The Ren Ci Trial

last SG · 2009-04-20T15:13:08+00:00

What sentence did Ming Yi and boyfriend get?

airgrinder SG

What is abuse?

In all non-profit orgs, there is this thing called surpluses. Non-profit orgs also need to think ahead into the future, and should not spend annual donations completely because the next year's donations might fall short of the needs of their annual expenditure.

IF the money is not in use to help the needy, but is a surplus, what is wrong with loaning it to employees, so long as it is ensured that the employee returns the loan?

You garner goodwill by helping employees in need. I don't see the issue with that. The only issue is that there is insufficient governance controls in Renci. Loaning to employees should have proper procedures, and ensure there are legal means to get back the loan should the employee fail to return the loan

You can't just suka suka lend company money to employees.

airgrinder SG

I just feel that there is overreaction in this matter.

Renci is unlike the NKF saga, and yet, immature reports from ST make both seem like they are the same.

All I see is bad governance, and the monk is doing his bit to help the poor. Along the way, he slipped. So? What's the big deal, as compared to our leaders overrewarding themselves from the same pool of funds that can be better used to help the poor?

The crack on NKF is way overdue when its exposed! This is precisely why government and the people "overreacted". I would have prefer the government "overreact" on NKF just when they started misusing funds, rather than till a later stage where the gold taps and superinflated pays comes in, damaging the image and creditability of the NPOs.

Tan.john52 SG

why worry so much over a monk

should pay attention more to our richbowl

soul_rage SG

"The govt is just making an ant out of a molehill" - excuse me, r u trying to say 'making a mountain out of a molehill'?

"That's just bad governance for me" - Bad governance is for sure but I would say that it's very bad governance & I believe that the govt has to do something in view of the serious degree of improper management.

Yes, thanks for the correction. Somehow I got the molehill thing wrong :)

Yes, so it's very bad governance. So just setup auditing procedures for it, that's all. It's nowhere near the level of NKF. The monk is still doing his bit for the poor, that's much better than those leaders up there that take so much and do so little.

What is improper management? Setting up legal means to ensure one is unjustifiably highly paid is not improper management? Overpaying oneself is not improper management?

The monk is not receiving much from Renci, he put his heart and soul into Renci.

When the people here criticize him, consider how much he has done for the good of the poor, and weigh that against this instance of bad governance, and I think you will realize this is just a silly fiasco setup by the govt to show that they are doing their job (after the NKF saga, when inadequate punishment was meted out to the guilty)

soul_rage SG

You can't just suka suka lend company money to employees.

As I said, it's just bad governance. Setup controls to ensure this doesn't happen again. Full stop. Finish. Why all the mudslinging at the monk?

soul_rage SG

This is a civil case, let the court decide, our govt had already put the system in place to handle such situation, there is no need for further govt intervention, the system will work itself out and give our citizens a fair verdict. Let us be more democratic, govt do not dictate the issue and in the end, labelled as dictator by opposition.

Angel

Young PAP

The system is crucifying a guy for bad governance and making him look as if he has committed the most heinous crime against humanity. Whether the legal system is fair, I do not know 100%. Biased reporting, attempts to make this an example for future cases. These are factors that can influence a judgement. After all, the judge is only human.

soul_rage SG

Can you see the difference btw Renci and NKF?

1. Gold Taps. Superinflated peanut pays, incredible bonuses paid to staff. THAT'S NKF

Compared to

2. Inadequate loan procedures. THAT's RENCI.

Case 1 is true misuse of funds. Case 2 is just bad governance

In fact, Case 1 can be compared to the superinflated pay packets of our leaders. Aren't the management of NKF and our leaders the same type of people, given that one is a non-profit organization, and the other is a nation's leadership (which is also non-profit)?

angel7030 SG

Crucifying??? well, Rome was not build in a day, so is Singapore, you got to trust and believe in our system or else, we are history. The system is allowing this guy a fair chance to represent himself thru his lawyers and he get to appeal if the verdict is against him, unless u are talking about Do what the romans do, crucifying Jesus to prevent him from preaching further.

Yes of course the judge is a human, nobody is playing God here, the laws can never be balance, there is always some short change in it, 2 parties enter court and one will come out happy whilst the other will be angry and sad and shouting unfair. That is the nature of things, nothing is fair, but we are just trying to make it fairer thru a proper system, that is all. UNDERSTAND!!!

To a religious person, he should not fear the mortal laws, for he who knows the rules and regulations of his God should know better that what await him below. That will be worst. Burnt in HELL!!

nature-ones SG

this incident really makes my family mad n i think i have lost some trust in those charity and donation event

Darkknighthuang SG

1. No, I don't find it strange. There is no evidence whatsoever that Yeung is useless, or does not justify his pay. Moreover, whether a boss hires someone sometimes depends on personal liking. Of coz, the basic calibre must be there.

Nobody is saying that Yeung is useless. If the monk hired him and pay him high wages, he must be good for something. Even an Ah Kuah is good for something.

The monk must really have a personal liking for Yeung, to give him supp credit cards to use for expensive personal purchases. And Yeung must have justified his high pay for doing certain things that others could not or would not do for the monk.

angel7030 SG

Nobody is saying that Yeung is useless. If the monk hired him and pay him high wages, he must be good for something. Even an Ah Kuah is good for something.

oh, Gay and hormosexual topic...i go report to Aware

angel7030 SG

this incident really makes my family mad n i think i have lost some trust in those charity and donation event

Dun be sad and mad, men and monks are the same, their greed and unusual lifestyle always betray them, dun worry, if you had lost your trust in those charity org operated by monks, priest or men, join the Nunnery Charity, operate by gals and women of the righteous, for we are the virgin ones, the holy ones and the trusted ones.

Nun Angel

CEO

Singapore Nunnery Association

Er Mei Shan

richong 3216 SG

Yes, thanks for the correction. Somehow I got the molehill thing wrong :)

What is improper management? Setting up legal means to ensure one is unjustifiably highly paid is not improper management? Overpaying oneself is not improper management?

The monk is not receiving much from Renci, he put his heart and soul into Renci.

Excuse me for the late reply - actually was out the whole afternoon & when I came back - wah! so many posts already.

Thanks for your reply which I think is cool calm & courteous.

Regarding the question of what is improper management & your examples of people being highly paid, you stated "setting up legal means to ................. Overpaying one self is not improper management?"

Well, personally I feel it's a shame re the sky high salaries they are paying themselves but the fact that it's legally set up will qualify it as proper & not improper although morally it's another issue.

soul_rage SG

Nobody is saying that Yeung is useless. If the monk hired him and pay him high wages, he must be good for something. Even an Ah Kuah is good for something.

When I was running my committee in school, I also have loyalists whom are treated specially because they are loyal to me and would help to go all out to get things done for me.

It's again a case of bad governance. So what if there's personal liking? In the words of my secretary in the past, "if you are an apple, no matter what you do, you are an apple. If you are not an apple, no matter what you do, you are still not an apple"

This is the reality of this world. I have worked long enough to know there is no true fairness at work.

soul_rage SG

Excuse me for the late reply - actually was out the whole afternoon & when I came back - wah! so many posts already.

Thanks for your reply which I think is cool calm & courteous.

Well, if the monk had control of the law, then it would also become legal...

Either way, I think I have argued enough, people reading my postings would know what I mean. It'sa case of overhype resulting in overreaction. Ultimately, if you focus at looking past the fiasco, the monk is still doing this job effectively.

For those who do not accept my point and believe that Renci = NKF, so be it.

Vaum SG

2. That's just bad governance for me. It only tells me that Renci requires more governance. That's all.

So what exactly sucks, because I don't see anything illegal (or the lack of evidence), and is only more a case of bad governance.

The govt is just making an ant out of a molehill. Compared to the government's pay, which is funded by the SAME source (taxpayers) that funds welfare support to the poor, I would say this case is negligible.

In fact, aside from bad governance, the monk has been doing a great job ensuring that the people benefiting from Renci CONTINUE to benefit.

So what's the big deal?

I do wish you that u can write and publish your point of view in the ST Column or something.

Darkknighthuang SG

I agree with your secretary.

If you are an Ah Kuah, no matter what you do, you are an Ah Kuah. If you are not an Ah Kuah, no matter what you do, you may not be able to please the person who hired you.

Hawk Eye SG

Alamak! Primary science teaches us that some things are reversible, some are not!

skythewood SG

I do wish you that u can write and publish your point of view in the ST Column or something.

Maybe he did. There is a reader's letter section somewhere. Comments can also be left on the online site.

iveco SG

Marine Parade (previously Aljunied) GRC MP Ong Seh Hong also kena implicated in this case. Wonder if it is in the nation's best interests for him to stand down.

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