Another scam to absorb Singaporean money

last SG · 2007-10-19T13:27:06+00:00

Originally posted by Gazelle: Atobe, there was never a false challenge, there are only false accusations and BS by you and your fellowsheep. All I did was t...

Gazelle SG

Atobe, have you verify with your daddy that when you apply for utilities in Singapore you have to pay a deposit? Laughing Or have you selectively choose not to talk about it so as to make your thread sound more credible to other sheep in this forum???

Black sheep? haha I think you are talking about yourself, because you are corrupting the minds of other sheep with your BS. btw...is BS = Black Sheep or Bull Shi.t? Laughing
maybe both....

spinsugar SG

Ummmm.... coz can't win based on fact and logic? Mr. Green

stupidissmart SG

The problem here is that the MIW Government also owns the private companies.

They take the Citizens' money with two hands, as there are huge pockets to fill, and both the Government and their Government Owned companies will take and give nothing back at no price.

Both the Government and the Government Owned ''Private Company'' are getting rich off the Singaporeans' bank account; and it is Singaporeans providing more funds for the Government to implement newer systems of money collection scams.

Do you think you can get anything FREE from this Government - when they believe that there is NO FREE LUNCH in Singapore ?

Will there be a choice after the dust and emotions have settled down ?

From past experience with this MIW Government, there is simply NO U-TURN.

Well, in tis world everyone feel they have paid too much tax to the gov. My point is tat it is better for gov linked companies to earn money rather than other private companies because the money they earned is truly gone while the money earned from gov companies have a chance to at least reduce tax. According to statistic, the earning from gov linked companies is really used in the budget. IMO, singaporean r not the people with the least amount of possessions or the most debts compared with people from other countries. We r also not the country with lesser income compared with cost of living. Though we r not the top, but at least we r comfortably placed.

Coming to the power payment using card, I find myself having little problems with it because there really isn't much fault with it. As said, if u want to pay monthly instead of keeping a high stored value in the card, u r still letting banks earn money from u. U have a choice as well and furthermore, i don't think they will remove the option for people to pay the bill through the old means. Until they really remove I think it is better not to make speculations. U can complain when tat happenned one fine day though.

will4 SG

I cannot say what the govt is doing to energy like what the telco are doing is scam. There is no right or wrong to be said until the scheme has been fully

implemented n there is feedback from the people to the govt. As for ur enmity with Atobe, Atobe on some matter do deep analysis n not everybody is his match.

Gazelle SG

So I guess Atobe must have done pretty deep analysis before he call it a scam isnt it? Deep is subjective lah... Mr. Green

Atobe SG

Originally posted by Gazelle:

Atobe, have you verify with your daddy that when you apply for utilities in Singapore you have to pay a deposit? Or have you selectively choose not to talk about it so as to make your thread sound more credible to other sheep in this forum???

Black sheep? haha I think you are talking about yourself, because you are corrupting the minds of other sheep with your BS. btw...is BS = Black Sheep or Bull Shi.t?
maybe both....

You are making remarkable progress of not making a single sexual connotation when address my reponse - have you been holding your breath ?

Only a 'crap sniffer' will know the difference between BS and the crap that attracts you - can anyone beat you by the margin of your nose ?

Only a Black Sheep will deride everyone else for their intelligence - could it be due to your own inadequacy and insecurity to keep your influence over others ?

Why will you believe that others do not have a mind that is more superior then yours, and that although no one will express criticism at my post, does it necessarily mean that they are influenced by my opinions ?

Can we believe your intelligence to accept the present scheme with deposits to be more superior than the proposed scheme of pre-paid cards ?

Yes, deposits are paid for the amount anticipated, and if the deposit amount is insufficient to cover any constant higher amounts, the deposit will increase.

How does this compare to the proposed scam, when any expected amount of electricity consumption is pre-paid, and the values are subsequently deducted as electricity is consumed ?

If you believe that everyone in this Speakers' Corner are 'Sheep', cannot think for themselves and can be misled, can you seriously be better as a Black Sheep yourself - can you think with some clarity if both schemes can be similar ?

Surely your superior Black Sheep intelligence will enable you to sniff out the crap in the proposed scam that there are no further meter readings, and no more printed bills showing the amount consumed.

Surely the super intelligence of a Black Sheep will realise that the pre-paid amounts are deducted in 'real time' as electricity is consumed, and not at the end of the month ?

Like the present HDB season ticket, which is updated electronically for the amount paid, is there anything to prevent electricity prices being tweaked without notice and at the touch of a button from Central ?

As matters stand now, every household is purposefully limited in the juice that is delivered to each home at a maximum of 20 Amps for HDB units, and 30 Amps for private homes.

This amount is hardly enough to run all the appliances - with two instantaneous type of bath heaters of 2kW capacity, operated at the same time, tripping the Circuit Breakers.

When the consumption load is close to 80% of the ''juice limit'', the electric meter will spin wildly even as the meter is rated for higher ampere tolerance - this will result in most middle-income family of 4 living in HDB homes being billed a monthly consumption of anywhere from $220 to $360.

This amount is little difference from those living in private housing estates being able to increase the ''amount of juice'' delivered to their homes; which will end up paying a more realistic utility bill of $250 to $390 despite a larger floor area with more electrical conveniences.

As matters stand, there is little transparency in the present system, with most Singaporeans forced to accept the 'fait accompli' of the juice delivered to the HDB unit; and most do not know the inherent design shortfall of the power grid that can only generate higher revenues to the service providers.

Can we trust the intelligence of a mischevious Black Sheep that is only good at crap sniffing, instead of doing something more positive ?

Gazelle SG

Atobe...you never fail to impress me with you long arse story telling skills.. Very Happy

So what the FCUK are you talking about when you say this is a scam? Wont opening up of Singapore electricity market benefit people as they now will have a choice?

Btw, have you verify with your daddy that you need to pay deposit when applying for utilities in Singapore?

Atobe SG

Do you know what is the annual profits that Temasek earn from its 100% ownership of PowerSeraya, Senoko Power, Singapore Power, and Tuas Power ?

If you believe that Temasek has returned its earning by lower taxes, how much of Temasek's annual NET profit has been recorded to be physically returned to the Finance Ministry, when even the money returned to Singaporeans - {under fanciful acronyms} - is from surplus collections from GST and not from any Government Linked Companies ?

If you believe that Temasek has returned the amounts to the Finance Ministry to cover budget expenses and lower taxes, is there any justification for the 2% increase in GST, OR even the increase of GST from 3% to 5% - when the reasons given then was to cover budget expense due to a lowering of direct tax ?

Coming to the power payment using card, I find myself having little problems with it because there really isn't much fault with it. As said, if u want to pay monthly instead of keeping a high stored value in the card, u r still letting banks earn money from u. U have a choice as well and furthermore, i don't think they will remove the option for people to pay the bill through the old means. Until they really remove I think it is better not to make speculations. U can complain when tat happenned one fine day though.

At least UOB, OCBC, ANBC and CITI Banks will offer more rewards to loyal customers when they are profitable, compared to DBS bank or the Government Owned Companies.

This is only a hard sell to provide an option at this early stage, as when ERP was first introduced the ERP Card Reader was given free for up to 3 years {???} - and subsequently, the Card Reader has to be paid for by the Car Owner.

Do you seriously believe that after 3 to 5 years, the Government will not declare that only Pre-Paid Card will be used for payment of utilities and with the payments made in 'Real Time' ?

The amount of value held in the cash card is simply a matter of accounting, while the bulk of REAL CASH is already earning profits by clever fund managers.

The success of any enterprise today is not merely the physical production and exchange of products for CASH, it is the shrewd productive management of HARD CASH to generate more cash that is the real success story of any enterprise.

The biggest growth has always been the Banks and the Finance Industry, and never the manufacturing or service industry.

Atobe SG

Now you are slipping back to your old bad habit of sexual verbose - can a Black Sheep change its color ?

You were doing quite well for the last 36 hours {???}.

Long arse story telling ?

For a crap sniffer, that is about the only way to lead him on.

Have you lost the capacity to concentrate by holding your breath in not expressing sexually biased terms ?

What do you know about opening up of Singapore Electricity market - when the dice is rolled by the same pair of hands ?

Only you believe that LKY and LHL are two different persons, and yes - I forgot that there is the other chairman wearing skirt in the Family.

If you are not paying the bills, it probably explain your approach in having to ask ''daddy'' to clear up every mess that you have created.

Try to be an independent Black Sheep and also a good one, if you aspire to get out of a sheep skin and be a real Gazelle.

Gazelle SG

If you have been paying your own electricity bill you would have know that every household would need to pay an initiate deposit of $60 to $800 when applying for utilities in Singapore. would you still be so dumb to say that the propose cash card billing system is a mean of sucking people's money.

Good try atobe...I am sure the sheep in this forum will believe you... Mr. Green

Btw, have you ask your daddy to verify what I said?

Gazelle SG

Will4, want to see an example of Atobe BS?

Originally posted by Atobe:
At least UOB, OCBC, ANBC and CITI Banks will offer more rewards to loyal customers when they are profitable, compared to DBS bank or the Government Owned Companies.

Atobe are you confused between bank customers and shareholders? Loyalty rewards program is simply a ploy to make their customers spend more and hopefully to the extent that they will have to roll over their credit card bill.

Atobe, are you sure that DBS Bank's reward programe is not as good as UOB and OCBC?

This is only a hard sell to provide an option at this early stage, as when ERP was first introduced the ERP Card Reader was given free for up to 3 years {???} - and subsequently, the Card Reader has to be paid for by the Car Owner.

Atobe, 3 years is simply a transitional period, and why do you need extra ERP Card Reader when all new cars are equip with one? To install you your bicycle?

Do you seriously believe that after 3 to 5 years, the Government will not declare that only Pre-Paid Card will be used for payment of utilities and with the payments made in 'Real Time' ?

Atobe, your ERP card reader example it irrelevant to the objective this card system is trying to achieve and lets not speculate about the future as they are meaningless

The amount of value held in the cash card is simply a matter of accounting, while the bulk of [b]REAL CASH is already earning profits by clever fund managers.

What about the initiate deposit that you paid when applying for utilities? Arent those HARD CASH? Or have you not understand the meaning of INTITAL DEPOSIT??

The success of any enterprise today is not merely the physical production and exchange of products for CASH, it is the shrewd productive management of HARD CASH to generate more cash that is the real success story of any enterprise. The biggest growth has always been the Banks and the Finance Industry, and never the manufacturing or service industry.

Atobe, what nonsense are you talking about? Do you know the world largest and more profitable companies are not banks. Are you jerking off and shoot your cum on your own face?

Atobe SG

Originally posted by Gazelle:

If you have been paying your own electricity bill you would have know that every household would need to pay an initiate deposit of $60 to $800 when applying for utilities in Singapore. would you still be so dumb to say that the propose cash card billing system is a mean of sucking people's money.

Good try atobe...I am sure the sheep in this forum will believe you...

Btw, have you ask your daddy to verify what I said?

Another clean post without your perverse sexual expressions - good effort, although the seams seem to be stretching.

Where is the source of your information concerning the deposit of $60 to $800 ?

Did you check this out with your daddy, who has been paying all the bills ?

Either your daddy must be dumb-founded with a god-foresaken Black Sheep in you, or he has must have found it simpler to feed you with crap ?

You could have called Singapore Powers for more accurate information that the following deposit amounts are collected :

$50 from 1-2 room HDB units,
$100 from 3-5 rooms HDB,
$250 from Private Homes, and
$400 from Bungalows.

What crap did you sniff again to come up with your BS.

The deposit amount is a security in the event Black Sheep consumer was to break and run after consuming the electricity; and if your consumption over a period of 6 months has been observed to be lower, the differences are apportioned and refunded by cheque. The reverse will also apply if you were to consistently consumed values above the deposit amounts and will result in your deposit amount being increased.

Are your views merely trapped in disputing about the deposits compared to the amount held in the pre-paid card ?

Have you not considered the entire scheme of deducting the value for the amount consumed in 'REAL TIME' - with no transparency in how the charges are clocked, and based on a designed platform that already have got us billed unwittingly at higher rates, and with the good possibility of the platform being tweaked at any time without our knowledge ?

There is also the other implications of over-charging without any accounting, as well as the onus on the Consumer having to maintain a high value in the Pre-Paid Card simply to ensure that the supply will not be cut off due to one's mistake.

All these can only benefit the Cash Card Service Provider - who most likely will be another Government Linked Company - making another tier in the supply chain. Over time, this Cash Card Service Provider will also charge for the service.

Can one who has been foresaken as a Black Sheep and hung up at crap sniffing - even begin to understand what paying bills with a Pre-Paid Card System will mean for those who are less fortunate and in the lower end of the Social Scale ?

stupidissmart SG

Do you know what is the annual profits that Temasek earn from its 100% ownership of PowerSeraya, Senoko Power, Singapore Power, and Tuas Power ?

If you believe that Temasek has returned its earning by lower taxes, how much of Temasek's annual NET profit has been recorded to be physically returned to the Finance Ministry, when even the money returned to Singaporeans - {under fanciful acronyms} - is from surplus collections from GST and not from any Government Linked Companies ?

If you believe that Temasek has returned the amounts to the Finance Ministry to cover budget expenses and lower taxes, is there any justification for the 2% increase in GST, OR even the increase of GST from 3% to 5% - when the reasons given then was to cover budget expense due to a lowering of direct tax ?

http://www.mof.gov.sg/budget_2007/revenue_expenditure/attachment/Revenue_Estimates.pdf

If u read the budget, it is under Stat board contribution and it account for 5% of the total country revenue

At least UOB, OCBC, ANBC and CITI Banks will offer more rewards to loyal customers when they are profitable, compared to DBS bank or the Government Owned Companies.

They only react to competition as in all private organisation. When has UOB ever reward its loyal customers when they earn a big profit ?

I agree tat the owner of the car should pay for their own card reader. Otherwise u expect the other non car owners to pay for them from their tax ?

Do you seriously believe that after 3 to 5 years, the Government will not declare that only Pre-Paid Card will be used for payment of utilities and with the payments made in 'Real Time' ?

Wat is the problem with it Rolling Eyes

The amount of value held in the cash card is simply a matter of accounting, while the bulk of REAL CASH is already earning profits by clever fund managers.

Leave it in banks and they do the same thing. So we spend all the money ?

Tat is true. So why deny the gov the chance to earn money ?

Gazelle SG

Atobe, dont try to improvise what I have posted earlier to make it your own lah...cant you see the damn link i post on page 2.

Is having your deposit kept with SP Services better than having value stored in your cash card?

Pathatic brainless loser!! Mr. Green

Atobe SG

I see you are working doubly hard to keep you mouth clean, and also trying hard to sniff out the CRAP with your expert crap sniffing ability.

Originally posted by Gazelle:

Will4, want to see an example of Atobe BS?

Quote: Original post by Atobe:
At least UOB, OCBC, ANBC and CITI Banks will offer more rewards to loyal customers when they are profitable, compared to DBS bank or the Government Owned Companies.

Atobe are you confused between bank customers and shareholders? Loyalty rewards program is simply a ploy to make their customers spend more and hopefully to the extent that they will have to roll over their credit card bill.

Atobe, are you sure that DBS Bank's reward programe is not as good as UOB and OCBC?

How sure are you that DBS Bank's reward program is better than UOB and OCBC ?

Are you trying to confuse my response with a new interpretation with your own profound crap sniffing ability to come up with new crap ?

Do you think the private banks will not lower their charges if they are making extra-ordinary profits for the financial year, or even come up with ever more rewarding program as they grow in confidence - some kind of 'quid-pro-quo' arrangements ?

The fact that DBS has taken one blow after another in different overseas misadventures that got them to absorb the financially strong POSB, and ended with long term POSB customers having to pay for unheard of bank charges since the beginning of POSB.

This is only a hard sell to provide an option at this early stage, as when ERP was first introduced the ERP Card Reader was given free for up to 3 years {???} - and subsequently, the Card Reader has to be paid for by the Car Owner.

Atobe, 3 years is simply a transitional period, and why do you need extra ERP Card Reader when all new cars are equip with one? To install you your bicycle?

What can we expect from a Black Sheep pretending to be a Gazelle, and simply out to be mischevious to confuse issues in total abandonment of common sense.

Is this not your typcial signature theme - either pretending to be smart by mis-stating the obvious, or truly stupid while making an effort to be smart ?

How did the subject of an extra ERP Card Reader crossed your mind ?

After the first 3 years since the ERP was implemented with the ERP readers installed at no cost - are the ERP Card Reader CURRENTLY installed at no cost to the New Car Owners ?

Obviously you have not purchased a new car when you have not even begun to pay for the electricity bills.

Obviously, you have no clue that replacement for faulty ERP Card Readers will have to be paid for by the Car Owner.

ERP charges for bicycle - the MIW Clones should thank you for your money grabbing idea - is it any wonder why you are considered a Black Sheep ?

Do you seriously believe that after 3 to 5 years, the Government will not declare that only Pre-Paid Card will be used for payment of utilities and with the payments made in 'Real Time' ?

Atobe, your ERP card reader example it irrelevant objective this card system is trying to achieve and lets not speculate about the future and it is meaningless

Even ordinary animals are more sharp eyed than a Black Sheep, and even a Gazelle is more careful in the presence of predators.

Are you capable of being a Gazelle when the MIW predators are constantly thinking up ways of devouring your cash ?

Now should we wonder which of the 2 out of the 3 liitle pigs your brain is similar to ?

The amount of value held in the cash card is simply a matter of accounting, while the bulk of REAL CASH is already earning profits by clever fund managers.

What about the initiate deposit that you paid when applying for utilities? Arent those HARD CASH? Or have you not understand the meaning of INTITAL DEPOSIT??

Can the value of the deposit be more then the total values that KIASU Singaporeans will pump into their Cash Cards just to avoid the electric supply from being cut due to their own oversight to top up the card ?

In your hurried effort to pull the carpet from under my feet, you seem to view issues in such a hurried manner that blur your own mind.

Slow down and give your mind a chance to click in sync with your eyes, your mouth is already held tight to prevent any sexual profanities from being voiced, why burden your emotions any further by constantly being rubbed out with careless thinking ?

The success of any enterprise today is not merely the physical production and exchange of products for CASH, it is the shrewd productive management of HARD CASH to generate more cash that is the real success story of any enterprise. The biggest growth has always been the Banks and the Finance Industry, and never the manufacturing or service industry.

Atobe, what nonsense are you talking about? Do you know the world largest and more profitable companies are not banks. Are you jerking off and shoot your cum on your own face?

Finally, you have to jerk yourself off - after holding your mouth tight for the last 36 hours.

You had to be your true self - a sexually perverse Black Sheep.

Please tell me which one of the world largest and more profitable companies are not banks ?

Atobe SG

Originally posted by Gazelle: 23 October 2007 - 05.17 PM

Atobe, dont try to improvise what I have posted earlier to make it your own lah...cant you see the damn link i post on page 2.

Is having your deposit kept with SP Services better than having value stored in your cash card?

Pathatic brainless loser!!

Improvised ? Damn link you post on page 2 ?

You must be hallucinating about me improvising, and should I even bother with your link in Page 2 that you will even damned ?

Just referring to your respone above - and printed below is enough - to know that you are grabbing numbers from thin air, which confirms your PAPa has foresaken you and fed you with crap.

If you wish to know, my data on the deposits were taken from a quick telephone call to Singapore Powers before I posted the response that you are now disputing :-

Originally posted by Gazelle: 23 October 2007 - 04.37 PM

If you have been paying your own electricity bill you would have know that every household would need to pay an initiate deposit of $60 to $800 when applying for utilities in Singapore. would you still be so dumb to say that the propose cash card billing system is a mean of sucking people's money.

Good try atobe...I am sure the sheep in this forum will believe you...

Btw, have you ask your daddy to verify what I said?

Your effort with this icon Mr. Green surely fit your sheepish nature.

It would have been easier for you to maintain a straight face by being gracious; but then it will be beyond the nature of a Black Sheep.

Gazelle SG

Will4, is this what you call Atobe's deep analysis? Laughing

Gazelle SG

Atobe, why are you do dumb to actually reconfirm by statement that you dont even know that every household need to pay a deposit when applying for utilities in Singapore. (Will4, is this what you call deep analysis?)

Call SP Services? Why dont you ask them how come they didnt update their website...haha... Laughing

bloody dumb loser!!

Atobe SG

You seem to be in a fixated mood to believe that I am a bloody dumb loser ?

Why are you so anxious of me having to lose ?

If at all, your efforts in keeping your mouth clean and responded to my efforts to clean your act has already shown who has submitted to the efforts of the other.

Now I wonder who is dumb to the obvious fact that do not need any efforts for my part to claim victory, or to sneer at you as the loser.

There is a back door to scrub yourself cleaner if you wish, and no one will be less appreciative.

As I have said before - either you are too clever for your own good by pretending to be smart in mis-stating the obvious, or you are truly stupid while making an effort to be smart ?

Does calling Singapore Powers to ascertain the facts constitute being dumb ?

Now we know what kind of reckless standards you have in coming up with your mischevious mis-statements and your sources in coming up with data as your preferred version of facts.

Should we now have a better conclusion to the true character that you are ?

The picture of a Black Sheep that is recklessly mischevious and sexually vulgar seems slowly firming up - now I wonder where you get your habit of crap sniffing from ?

Only a crap sniffer will sniff crap with every whiff taken.

Hold your breath - for the sake of your mouth, as well as for the environment.

Atobe SG

Excuse me, please check to be sure that Temasek was and is NEVER considered a Statutory Board.

You should place a call to UOB Public Relations Director, and he will be able to give you a full run down as how as a Bank Customer you will benefit when UOB makes extra-ordinary profit.

Try to keep this to yourself, or the resident Black Sheep will begin to torture you with lables of being a better sheep than himself.

The issue is not only restricted to ERP Card Reader being paid for by the Car Owner.

This matter was raised to highlight the possibility of this proposed scam going the same way of the ERP, which was introduced with alot of sweet deals to gain wide acceptance, and after wide usage - modification to the basic ground rules pertaining to charges and rates will begin to kick in to recover the entire capital cost invested as well as to make runaway profit from a captive market that has no choice.

Where is the supposed choices for those who prefer to pay by the old method ?

Leave it in banks and the profits will result in the banks ability to pay higher interests on our bank accounts.

Leave it to the Government, and they will pay another Thaksin for another useless shell of a hollow Shin Corp.

Is the answer not obvious - as to why should the government be given the chance to earn more money from the Citizens ?

Has there been any benefits to Singaporeans - directly or indirectly - when the Government, GIC and Temasek Holdings make surplusses every year ?

Even with all the annual surplus, Singaporeans are made to pay an additional 2% increase in GST, higher hospital fees, education fees, transport fares, utilities, since the 2006 Election.

For every refund paid to Singapore for excess tax monies collected, Singaporeans are made to pay twice as much through all kinds of fee and rates increases - as seen in the spate of price increases soon after the 2006 Elections.

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