Let's compare the worklife of Japan, Europe, and Singapore

last SG · 2007-09-18T02:34:05+00:00

Is this the best that a PhD qualified person can throw up in a supposedly critical piece ? For one who is arrogantly self-opinionated, you have again displa...

eagle SG

I was thinking

Europe... last time earn damn a lot from colonies.... Now most infrastructure already built....

Japan, after WWII, got US military help in defence. Most of money used to build economy, country so big, so economy has strong internal demand.

Singapore? Once a colony... Infrastructure not fully up (train stations still under construction).

eagle SG

Hmmmm.... Singaporeans has better top talent, especially at the very top. Which is why the very top talent gets 3 mil sgd pay a year, at least 3 times the amount of their Japanese and German counterpart. Also cannot say pay lesser wor... (sarcasm intended, mentioned just in case)

qlqq9 SG

It is true of what you said above. SGHis a very good example. I have ex colleagues who for no good reason were asked to leave. When I was on attachment there, I worked with these 2 people and I find them kind and helpful and good in their work, unfortunately the nasty doctors and staff in SGH love to bully them. SGH got rid of them immediately by paying them one month's pay without reason. One of the despots who was responsible for this is old man lky's doctor. This despot is despicable to get what he wants. This despot judge people how much he likes the look of the persons. He was trying so hard to get rid of this staff ever since he joined SGH. SGH works like the ruling party, they are closely related to PAP.

Short Ninja SG

Originally posted by soul_rage:

Japan
-> 26 days leave (can accumulate for 2 years)
-> Public Holidays: 15 (if bank or govt employees: +3 more)
-> Basic pay higher than Singapore. If Overtime, executives below managerial level gets OT pay.
-> Union to protect the workers

[/b]

I dont know where you got this data and which company or job are you referring to but its not true.Many people are required to put in their own time without pay.Its called "Service OT" and if you dont do it then you are not a good worker.If you are new in a company you might start with a low as 5 days leave and get one extra day for every year you serve in the company.Basic pay is higher but not much fringe benefits as in Singapore.In some parts of Japan Union dont even exist.Maybe you are talking about expatriate white collar jobs but for Citizens life sucks just as much

walesa SG

Originally posted by soul_rage:

Singapore
-> 14 - 18 days leave (assuming private companies). Only can accumulate for 2 years. Legally, a company can grant you only 7 days vacation and get away with it.

Technically, you could be working for free and this regime wouldn't regard it illegitimate. In fact, the lower your wages, the better it is for them - after all, they could literally enslave you into repaying your debts for life and still market themselves as a paradise offering cheap skilled labour at a level beyond comparison with any other parts of the developed world. Mr. Green

Oh, and did I forget to mention this regime is so considerate as to actually implement such wonderful policies to help look after you upon retirement through scams known as the CPF? Laughing

soul_rage SG

Well, I do not know where you get the "Service OT" part.

I have Japanese colleagues in the previous company and this current company, and they are all paid OT pay if they work OT.

My friends in oil MNCs confirm that as much.

And these are local Japanese.

I do not know where you get the 5 days leave thing, but here's some info on minimum leave in several countries

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vacation

It may not be 100% accurate, but your 5 days sounds a bit far from the info provided

unclebutcher SG

Rolling Eyes i dont think you can compare wages like this, after all they have 30-50% income tax, and cost of living is damn high

Short Ninja SG

I been living in Japan for over 20 years and I am a Japanese citizen now so you can tell your 'friends' not to throw smoke bombs at you when you ask them a simple honest question.

Short Ninja SG

‘Service OT’ is when you do stuffs for the company without getting paid anything from 30minutes to 100 minutes a day but only when you add it all up at the end of the year times the number of workers in the company would you know how much the company saves at the worker’s expence.This is one of the labor issues here in Japan.

SpeedStar SG

I agree with u on the leave thing as most of the japanese coy I interview in the past offer only 7 pathetic days of leave per yr.

Short Ninja SG

Yes,there is no fix rules some people get a better deal but what I am saying is that if the company can makan you they would eat you arrive (alive) Mr. Green

Short Ninja SG

And Soul Rage if your friends are still acting bluur about 'Service OT' just say 'sabisu Zanggyo' and they would soon confess> Very Happy

soul_rage SG

interesting, and no they are not throwing smoke bombs at me.

Coz its indeed true from the MNCs I work for, and that this is the common understanding I have from the Japanese friends I have.

So as to why you are different, I can't answer. Maybe they are the exception, or you are.

soul_rage SG

As I mentioned, in Germany, after income tax, they still have 2k to 3k+ for the middle income group

And no, their cost of living isn't super high as well given their pay, coz I was there for a period of time.

soul_rage SG

On this Service OT,
What happens after 100 minutes?

Short Ninja SG

Is that for Europeans?

Short Ninja SG

Actually you should be able to claim all OTs even if it is 15 minutes but the company would probably say 'wake up your farking idea' in an indirect way so press balls and KPKB Lah .Like I said earlier they judge you how hardworking you are by how much you are willing to work for free.As you know a lot of companies are also struggling here and so this is something people do 'volunteerily'. If more than 100 hrs even a zombie would put it in overtime sheet> Mr. Green

soul_rage SG

So technically speaking, you can claim for OT (in terms of $$$?)

And so in a company, they have an unofficial time of 100 minutes free, before you are allowed to claim?

My question is, where is this 100 mins thingy coming from?

100 mins -> 1 hour 40 mins.

I think most of us Singaporeans work more than 2 hours past the official knock off time, so that makes us even more hardworking than Japanese?

soul_rage SG

Yes, and again its a misconception that the cost of living is sky-high.
Most of us have the subconscious state of computing their costs into SGD, and therefore think its high.

But if you are earning 2k to 3k+ euros per month, then their costs are not really considered that high anymore

You can get a glass of beer at less than 2 euros
You can get pork knuckle at less than 6 euros
You can get a glass of soft drink at less than 2 euros
You can get a large main course of pork ribs with sides < 8 euros
If you want to save, there are asian fast meals that costs < 4 euros for a full meal

So no, I do not think their cost of living is sky-high.

Short Ninja SG

There is no yardstick to measure OT but just an average estimattion so for that I apologize.I am really sorry to hear about the situation in Singapore during my time it was called 'Angkat Bodek' but I guess you could also call it 'sabisu zanggyo' now.

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