Stupid apostasy law in Malaysia

last SG · 2007-06-01T10:23:48+00:00

sometimes non muslims will get affected also.... during ramadan fasting times..no food in university, they say respect other pple's religion but who arent t...

Icemoon SG

Actually Islam also accept that Christians and Jews have a share in the next world.

So the analogy is like leaving England for the States during WWII. Treason meh? Laughing

MohamedF SG

True

the first question is hard to answer coz got many variables...

Try to imaging yourself in the shoes of a government man... would you just anyhow allow your citizen to leave your country? Wouldn't you want to discourage them from leaving your country?

Even though not big treason like assassinate the president, it's still a considered a small treason like setting a bad example to those who are loyal to the country

googoomuck SG

Quran 9.1 9.6
The verses are about repentence and dispensation.

Treaties(what ever treaties must surely tie to Islam)

1) Unbelievers who have not upheld their part of the treaty, Muslims can break the treaty and are to give them 4 months notice.

2) Unbelievers who have upheld their part of the treaty, Muslims are to honour the treaty until it expires. After that, no more new treaty.

Either way, when the time is up, the unbelievers are given two choices willingly submit or be submitted by physical force.
The battle, if there is any, has to be an offensive fighting against the unbelievers.

The verse 9.5 is clear as crystals. Its not possible for its interpretation to be taken out of context.

alveo SG

Do you think islamic terrorists are "extremists" or do you share their point of view?

Icemoon SG

The way to do it is to encourage them to stay, not discourage them from leaving.

If everyone is leaving, it means there is something wrong with your government isn't it? Laughing

Icemoon SG

You have to see it from a good government and bad government point of view.

The South Korean defecting to North Korea is not setting a bad example to his ex fellow citizens. To the South Koreans, he is just an idiot.

So Islam is South Korea. Other religions are like North Korea. Laughing

MohamedF SG

These "islamic" terrorist are misguided... probably because of illiteracy or something... after all the bombing in afgan and iraq, I wonder if their are enough schools to teach the children?

Without education, the illiterate can easily be misguided to believe in terrorist ideology... the muslims have a strict code of conduct in war including, no destruction of civilian property, no killing of civilians, and an ultimatum before an attack... terrorism clashes with these codes...

but I do understand what they stand for which is to get America out of the middle east... they have done enough damage already...

Fingolfin_Noldor SG

Actually, the moment Islam came out of Arabia, they made war on the Sassanid Empire and the Byzantine Empire. They conquered the Sassanid Empire and drove the Byzantines out of the Levant into Asia Minor. You have plenty of forced conversions, and indirect pressure on the populace to convert.

Leaving the country and renouncing citizenship isn't considered treason actually. Now the issue here really, is as you say, that many Islamists made it law such that one cannot leave the religion under the pain of death. However, you became contradictory when you said that this law must remain but you cannot force someone to believe in something.

So ultimately, you must choose.

Icemoon SG

I thought they were trained to be terrorists in some madrasahs or something? They were given religious and military training.

MohamedF SG

This is a loaded question... try to specify why the people want to leave...?

Icemoon SG

Too many FTs? Laughing

MohamedF SG

Singapore also has madrasah too... but don't have the same teachers...

I'm not good with history so I don't know much about this... All I know is that Islam only permit war if it is to defend itself, or if it to correct an injustice (after all other options is used). Any other wars are made by humans.

The original law was made to prevent treason during the waring state... However, the law remains now as a means to discourage apostasy as apostasy is considered a grave sin... I am for this law, but I am against the punishment... some suggestion I've heard was a 3 day camp for them to renounce their decision, afterwards they are left to their decision...

simi FT?

For the record, I am no expert in Islamic law... All my post are based on online research and reasoning...

Short Ninja SG

Yeah I agree that Char Siew is more addictive than crack
once you start eating you can never turn back Mr. Green

mahawarrior SG

Singapore can talk about religious stuff one meh? some more this thread is getting so long liao…i thought people who talk about religion in s’pore will be sent to jail one?

MohamedF SG

People can talk about religion, but can't cause hate...

what do you think eternal hope and wisdom bliss is for...?

Short Ninja SG

This maybe off topic abit but could someone please define the meaning of ” Masuk Melayu”? It should be “Masuk Islam” rite? In Malaysia do you become a Bumi Putera if you “Masuk Melayu”? I believe DR Mahathir is of Indian Descent but somehwere along the line his family became trasformed into a different race.

curryman SG

hey man...dun mislead other pple....all malays in malaysia are required to be muslims by law by constitution by society

curryman SG

its actually a fine line, masuk melayu...actually i dun think there is such a thing

masuk islam is when u convert...of course u must be a non malay lah if u convert to muslim.
if u muslim its will 1 up ur status a bit in malaysia but still not on the same level as malays (who are muslims of course)

dr M got to get to such a high level is because 99.999% of the malays do not know that he is an indian descent. not many pple r educated n informed in malaysia u know

curryman SG

all religions have extremist.do not single out islam Neutral

(human) SG

God never says that, god never approve of that. Anyone heard what god say?The rule is implemented by humans. Rolling Eyes

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