Lower The Cost Of Living

last SG · 2006-05-08T17:59:04+00:00

sorry, the progressive package $$ given out is not for free.... look at how PAP gave out the carrort in potong pasir n hougang..its also not free, cos they...

Aveme SG

then what make you think reservist are trained?

if you want to call upon reservist,they will too have to come back to some camp for intensive training?

Civil defense people are more trained towards a country's internal problem management.

NS full time service man would already still need to be confirmed in their army camp,so there is no lost in training them at the same time.

Why do we need to recall reservist who have jobs in the real world to go back?

oxford mushroom SG

Life is not a bed of roses. People make wrong investment choices...they must make do with what they have now instead of expecting the government to cover their financial losses.

Renting a room in an HDB flat at market rate is still cheaper than buying a flat. If they are so poor, why should they buy a flat when it is more economical to rent? On top of that, if they should lose their jobs, it will be added hardship if they have a mortgage to service.

oxford mushroom SG

Reservists have completed their training in NS, whilst full-time servicemen are undergoing training. Don't you see the difference?

Anyway, I do not advocate using these any of these personel...the training will take too long. My post is in response to the question of small government. Beware that the civil service becomes stripped to its bones and unable to respond in an emergency. We need professionals to do such a job.

Aveme SG

Who is expecting the goverment to cover their financial lost?

What we are talking about is for them to cover their daily cost of living.Yes Life is not a bed of roses,but they certainly did not make wrong investment choices based on info they had b4,b4 the asia financial crisis,it is acceptable for people to think they can afford their flats,but with the crisis,retrenchment and stuff,their salaries drop,you are going to blame that they cannot forsee this?Who will forsee himself getting retrenched when the singapore economy was doing well?And that he can forsee his jobs taken by foreigners by our foreign talent policy?

How can you compare a room with a flat?

Renting a room will cost at least $300? and that has to paid in full cash,while for buying a flat,part of it is using $ from the CPF,so the total outlay of renting using cash on hand is higher

The point i am driving at is that with high property prices,if sudden circumstances happen,people will find it harder to cope as they are burden with high repayment and have much lesser left per month to spend on necessity,that is the real problem of the cost of living,the real everyday life cost that is affected cos of high property prices.

I am not in favor of straight foward slash in property prices as such a move will crash the property mkt and make thing worst,but at least policies should be put into place to help out in the everyday cost of living portion.

headset SG

I think u embody a large group of singaporeans who cant grasp the problems of the low wage earners and the disenfranchised.
Problem is... they are often swept out of view by our pretty state.

Ther is a cycle emerging.. Poor parents.. cant supervise their kids...cuz theyt are constantly out there looking for jobs..
Sinario1:
Kids look elsewhere for companionship and support....shotgun, unplanned teen pregnancies result... kids leave school to supprt their kids.. the cycle perpetuates....
Sinario 2:
Kids have to work while studying, unable to cope with work and study at such a young age, they do badly at school. Up to the point of secondary education.. this isnt tha much of a problem.. Tertiary educationis way too expensive for these guys.. Education hence takes a back seat. They take up low paying jobs due to poor certification... the cycle continues.

These are only 2 of the many sinarios ive noticed., where kids are born into adversity and are caught in a perpetuating poverty cycle. This is in singapore, mind u. It ssad but true.. only a hand few escape. The wider the income gap, the bigger the prob.

Aveme SG

Originally posted by oxford mushroom:

Reservists have completed their training in NS, whilst full-time servicemen are [b]undergoing training. Don't you see the difference?

Anyway, I do not advocate using these any of these personel...the training will take too long. My post is in response to the question of small government. Beware that the civil service becomes stripped to its bones and unable to respond in an emergency. We need professionals to do such a job.[/b]

Look you are a foreigner,what do you know about what our reservist had being trained in.We are trained in the external defence of singapore and not internal disaster management during our full time service.That portion of internal disaster management is under the civil defense area and the police,so if you do not know what you are talking about,you should not go into that area.

i see,and my reponses was to casino_king's post about using reservists,which certain does not make sense

oxford mushroom SG

What makes you think I am a foreigner? When I did my national service you were probably not even born.

There are too many Singaporeans who whine about the cost of living but are not prepared to accept a lower wage and a lower quality of life that will enable costs to be lowered.

You want to own a flat and you want a salary higher than the foreigner who accepts a lower wage and stays in a small room with another room mate. To employ you, your employer will have to levy higher charges and so raise the cost of living for other Singaporeans.

Khaw Boon Wan is right: lower cost of living also means lower wages. Unfortunately too many Singaporeans just cannot understand that.

Aveme SG

well ok,i misunderstood what you said just now when you said me and many malaysians rent a room,i took that to mean that you are a malaysian too.

K maybe in your generation of NSF,you guys were trained in disaster management but it is certainly not done for the more recent batches (at least till 10 years ago since i enlisted 10 years ago)

Your point is certainly wrong about lower wage=cost can be lowered.After the financial crisis,wages were cut accross broad,CPF cuts as well as most people accepting a wage cut to keep their jobs,but did cost go down? No,cost of every other thing went up instead, with critical area being the very daily transport neccessity,going up even when the company is already earning record profit.And no i am not whining about the cost of living as i have even agreed in some part of this thread that i know that rise in cost is inevitable.I am only concerned about the cost of living for the lowest 20% income bracket household,and that is what i had being talking about all this time in this thread that there is not enough being done to help this really really needy group.

king108 SG

Laughing Fellows Will4, they are rich in china

oxford mushroom SG

I am only concerned about the cost of living for the lowest 20% income bracket household,and that is what i had being talking about all this time in this thread that there is not enough being done to help this really really needy group.

People in the Car forum often say that speeding doesn't kill, it is unsafe driving that does. It is not the high costs of living that hurt, but the gap between income and expenditure. To close that gap, you either increase your income or spend less and accept a lower standard of living.

Costs of living will rise if Singapore is going to attain a Swiss standard of living. The solution for the bottom 20% of the population is not to cut costs of living, which will hardly be possible, but to raise their income.

Why are they at the bottom of the heap? Is it because they lack the education and skills to compete?

In any case, there will always be the bottom 20%. Not everyone can be top in class...there will always be one at the bottom. I am saying that the Singaporean at the bottom is better off than the foreign worker who paid his agents thousands of dollars to work for $600 a month in Singapore and yet has enough money to send home.

Of course more can be done to improve the lot of our poor citizens. The solution has to be skill upgrade. And I reject the argument that uncles in their 50s cannot be trained to handle a new job. It will be painful and the pay will be poorer but it is better than being jobless.

If you cannot earn more and yet want to retain your standard of living, then one solution is to leave Singapore and live in a third world country where the costs of living are much lower. I have seen villagers in China who save for months to afford a new bicycle. If our bottom 20% live there, they will not have to worry about costs of living Mr. Green

798 SG

lower our salaries? if only government can lead by example by lower their '1st class salaries'. they are not worth as MUCH!

oxford mushroom SG

That I agree...

If only Clinton or even Tony Blair will take the job..

Aveme SG

It is generally agreeable that cost of living will go up,but with regards to this group i am referring to,is it not possible to really put in the hardwork to locate such families and concessionary can be given to them?

It is not only about lowest 20% as i agree that there will always be a lowest 20% but it is about the lowest 20% who cannot cope with the cost of living that should be of concern.If the lowest 20% can cope,then there is nothing wrong.It is not just about skill upgrade but whether after such skill upgrade will companies employ them since they will mostly fall under the older group of workers and companies are mostly hesitant to employ such a group when they think they can employ a younger foreign worker who they think will be able to learn faster on the job.So they have competition from foreign workers as well as the age barrier and as such any move to help increase the income is not as easy as just talking about it

Eg,We have concessionary transport fare for students and the elderly as well as other such kinda differential price offerring to run their business.Such price differential plans are not new and certainly still bring a profit for the company.Maybe there can be a new catergory set up? Not in the form of a direct price plan but what i have suggested in the form of coupons price discount for the really essential items like rice,that only after they are properly targeted to be really unable to cope with the cost of living will such coupons be given.Given that for most of such household,there will come a point in time where they will become better off (found a better paying job thru help after retraining,or maybe the children has finished their schooling and can help out in the household income),such a system can then be withdrawn from them.The main thing is that such a group should be closely tracked as i believe that most people of such a group are not lazy and if given adequate help,they may soon stand up on their own feet.

And about what you said of relocation,it is certainly irresponsible,these group of older workers contributed so much to what singapore is now.We really should not be encouraging them to leave for a cheaper country,they are still our fellow singaporeans.And to that,Mr Khaw Boon Wah certainly is very irresponsible by him claiming tht those who cannot afford the cost of living here will be given the choice to retire in retirement village in JB,Batam and bintan aka almost saying that if you cannot afford the cost here,you should go die else where

siginah SG

The water conservation tax should stay, as water is a strategic resource which we cannot afford to waste.

Look at the present situation. We rely on Malaysia for water. Legal agreements or otherwise, this is a vulnerability on our part.

What about Newater? The production of Newater requires energy, the cost of which has been rapidly rising. We import all our energy. As such, while Newater allows us to circumvent some of the vulnerability of depending on Malaysia for raw water, we are clearly NOT 'out of the woods'. We are still vulnerable to disruptions to our energy supplies with the Newater solution.

Hence, we need the tax to encourage water conservation.

There are other ways to contain costs, like capping fare increases for public transport.

regards,
siginah

dragg SG

we pay for our personal water consumption.

i dont see why the tax is necessary.

Aveme SG

the tax is to make people feel the pinch so they refrain from using too much,it is not referred to water conservation for nothing.As much as i feel cost of living has to be controlled,water is too precious for people to waste so this is actually necessary

oxford mushroom SG

i have suggested in the form of coupons price discount for the really essential items like rice,that only after they are properly targeted to be really unable to cope with the cost of living will such coupons be given

Giving a 30% discount for rice will not help the poorest 20% of the population. What about transport, housing, healthcare and so on? Give out more welfare? Who's paying? Not me...

Those who cannot compete in a globalised economy will suffer a salary drop unless they emigrate to cheaper economies. That is a fact and unless people recognize the facts, you will not solve the problem.

oxford mushroom SG

And to that,Mr Khaw Boon Wah certainly is very irresponsible by him claiming tht those who cannot afford the cost of living here will be given the choice to retire in retirement village in JB,Batam and bintan aka almost saying that if you cannot afford the cost here,you should go die else where

Nobody is forcing you to do anything. You can die in Singapore alone in a one-room flat and be discovered a week later when you are decomposed and crawling with maggots. Or you can live out your last days in a nice retirement home attended by foreign nurses and maids.

Aveme SG

Well if the govt make better use of their tax collected,such an amount could actually be subsidied from there?eg the govt does so much unnecessary road work,digging up stuff and filling them in again,unnecessary changes to all the bus stops (there were quite a few such changes island wide a few years ago),spending unnessarily on plush goverment building,cutting back on minister's salary and lots more way that they govt did not make full efficient use of tax payer's money.

Also it is a fact that when GST was introduced,it shifted the tax burden of the country onto the poorer people,since in the first place when they were having very low income,they were not subjected to much income tax,so GST made them worst off,if cos of this,it subjected them to further hardship,should not more to made to help them?

Not solving the problem also does not means we should abandon our citizens who had worked hard during our Nation building years?

Aveme SG

well maybe you will think it is nice since maybe you are more cosmopolitian but to our older more ordinary generation,this is their land,their country,if they have to die,they will want to die on their own land and not on foreign soil (since they worked so hard to help build up our nation and is proud of it)

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