What does Singapore need?

last SG · 2004-04-16T11:39:38+00:00

why don't u read the previous posts before shooting your mouth off like a rabid homophobe. we hardly know enough about nature to call it "unnatural" and "il...

[ Neo ] SG

Well we've had the following campaigns that I can remember:

1) Keep Singapore Clean and Green,
2) Speak Mandarin,
3) Road Safety Campaign,
4) Courtesy Campaign,
5) Cleaniness Block Campaign,
6) Wash Ur Hands Campaign,
7) Be a Volunteer Campaign,
Cool Safety First Campaign,
9) Save water Campaign,
10) Higher Productivity Campaign... plus etc etc.

So what else do we need to upgrade? Mr. Green

oldbreadstinks SG

have more kids Campaign
no to oral sex Campaign
marry foreigners and make them stay Campaign
support cpf cuts Campaign

listen2u SG

I think Singapore is moving towards a more tolerant society for gays and lesbian.

Well, even thought I a bit uncomfy of this, i not against it as it does no real harm to anyone. Its the person own preference or rights.

Anyway, I feel same sex marriage is abit ... er mmm.. how shld I put it, strange... oh well, i against that idea.

[email protected]_arms SG

IF you people cant accept Chinese FOBS or Ang Moh FOBS or tainted half breeds, how can we expect you to accept Homosexuals? Irony.

TLK SG

I have a problem with what you are saying here. To proclaim something like that, we must be sincere and truthful about it. I do not think that all Singaporeans have that mindset to accept homosexuals and all that. If we still proclaim it, how different is it from a lie? In fact, it's a blatant lie. It's not going to benefit anyone in the end and Singapore would be screwed up.

TLK SG

Btw, you are not living in reality. Reality is that hate is fought with hate. If there's anyone who believes in Hate VS Love and that they actually does it, it's in very small number. A very small minority. It's still a long way to change. Humans are aggressive by nature and it's not going to be easy.

^sylvia^ SG

nothing can be fair and equal. like the rich and the poor

oldbreadstinks SG

da si ten Laughing
ma si ai

Stevenson101 SG

Don't see why homosexuals should create any discomfort, i mean if the gay or lesbian do not try to enforce their views or make a move on you, why bother about how they wish to live their lives?

There is homosexuality in nature, male dolphins i believe often stimulate each other's penis. But it is more of a form of sexual release in the absence of a mate.

We are in a world where hatred is fought with hatred. I think what SG needs is to be different. Hatred must be fought with love. We need to tell the world that we as a society is a loving society that truely accept everyone.

I think to bind S'poreans to SG is to make this place a place for everyone. I think we as a society is coming to a stage where we have to think of sustainability. How are we going to make this place home in this big bad world?

I think we should start by proclaiming that we are a country that accepts everyone (that includes the gays, lesbians, trans-gendered, disabled, and mentally unstable). This I think will tell everyone that we are a loving society. Human rights must be championed by the government too if we are going to continue attracting people from all over here to SG. How are we going to compete in this globalized world? We have the tools, we have the policies, but there are going to be other countries that can provide better incentives to business and people to go there. What we need to build is our diversity in order to assure that we value humans, I think that will allow us to continue prospering as a society.

And for this, that's what the entire worlds needs but i don't see that happening in the next few centuries or so.

SGglobalist SG

Hi to all that replied.

I am saddened by reading most of your comments. Especially the one that said "fight hate with hate".

From what I gather, we have been living with this realist ideology for too long. The ideology that if one wins the other looses and there is no in between. To build a sustainable environment for all, this to me is not a route that we as humans should travel. There should be win win situations and we have to learn to compromise. If we are all so self centred, where do you think this world will end up? I think it will be nuked away. Look at all the religious wars and colonial occupations, what were their main reasons for attacking and fighting? I think one was because they could not just live and let live, and that they assumed that their way was the correct way, their religion was the correct religion so the fighting began. Look at the colonization of the Americas, where Columbus thought the natives were barbarians and uncivilized even though it has been proven that they, the 'barbarians' had their own way of life, and were different but not wrong. However, Columbus and his crew imposed their culture, their way of thinking on the natives. Look at natives all over the world now where they are being oppressed by the governments of their lands, how do they feel? Maybe because this is SG and we are brought up in an environment that has sheltered us from these global suffering.

I still don't get it. If a homosexual do not come on to me, or do me harm, why would I hate him/her then? I think most of the people that replied have preconcieved ideology of homosexuals, and are socialized to think that their way is the correct way so other ways are wrong. The fact that if one is a homosexual then he/she is condamned to a life of imposed ideology and that they are scums is wrong. Look at the chinese and how they were treated in the 'west'. In the 1800s they were looked at and thought of as 'stupid and cunning' basically scums of the earth. We should ask ourselves why that happened. why did the west think the Chinese were lesser then them?

How about the disabled then? Are we to think that they are lesser than the abled, and that their lives means less than the abled? How about the ex-con who has changed his/her life after prison? Are we going to condamn that person for life? Please give me a break man. I know that we are all different in one way or another, but do we have to oppress those that are not the same as us? Yes we might not agree with homosexuality but to oppose homosexuals from legally proclaiming their love for fellow homosexuals is it wrong or correct? They are not hurting others through their actions are they? We are not dealing with binary oppositions here. Everything is mostly in the grey, what we need to learn is to get along man. I have lesbian friends and gay friends and they don't seem like scums to me, just ordinary humans. Why ar so many people concerned about what goes on behind close doors. Lets concentrate on the public sphere that affects us all. Homosexuality is not a crime. If you get raped by either a guy or a woman, then thats rape. Why would you be concerned about what sex raped you.

I am just rambling on here. Sitting here "china eyed" and spacing out. So please lets just live together in harmony man. Homos are humans too.

[email protected]_arms SG

Homosexuals are naturally persecuted because of Christianity, and most people here are Christian. I was at a Christian talk the other day about Homosexuality, and the pastor was saying "What are your thoughts when you hear the word Homosexuality".

People went up to the board and wrote stuff like:
"Disgusting"
"Weird"
"Evil"
"Satanic"
"Abnormal"
"Gross"
"Sinful"

So its unsurprising why discrimination exists.

CX SG

there are historians who have attempted to make the case that christianity was not inherently homophobic... but that the homophobic elements crept in during the medieval period when over-zealous monks re-copying works deliberately imposed their homophobic intepretations on the works they copied.

Ovid, who was known to have rather overt homosexual themes was even "censored" ...

and in analysing the history of ideas, their transmission, their influences and their metamorphosis, (haha... bad pun... ovid, metamorphosis... ) it is important to realise that pple impose their own ideas with every age and the "purity" of the original meaning is often not what we believe it to be...

was Sodom wiped off the map because of its "crimes of homosexuality " ? or was it because it committed a crime considered even MORE heinous at that time: the breach of hospitality.

pple weren't stoned or beheaded for engaging in homosexual sex at that time... but they WERE punished if they insulted the dignity of their guests. we have to understand that there were no "hotels" to speak of and visitors to a foreign city depended on the goodwill and hospitality of those who gave them shelter.

it was unspeakable that one should mis-treat the ones they invite to stay with them! it meant that the next time someone else travelled, they might not be promised the same hospitality they need and expect.

its not just courtesy or charity... its a social institution.

but we don't see that now... so medieval monks saw the homosexuality in the tale, found it repulsive, and intepreted it as such.

we miss more than we understand if we take everything that was written at face value...

[ Neo ] SG

I don't know how to put this into words very well, the bulk of the conservative fraction (including me) would probably just feel that homo and lesbian acts are against the order of Nature.

Either two from each catagory are simply just NOT meant to be a match for one another.

CX SG

and what makes u think that there were only meant to be 2 categories?

and why is it " unnatural " ? it has been known to occur naturally amongst monkeys... maybe it is hetrosexuals who have a visceral reaction against homosexuals who are abnormal.

are reproductive functions the only reasons for humans to form sexual relationships? if that were so, don't u think that we would have seasonal mating like many mammals?

and one reason for disgust is always FEAR... the worst homophobes are often the ones that are afraid of their own sexuality.

and u know the funny part? not every gay man wants to have sex with them...

RaTtY81 SG

Singapore needs a leader tat understands the peoples needs, troubles, problems and solves them.

zenden9 SG

A leader who can understand Gay And Lesbian need???

CX SG

eh... that's too narrow lah... i'll just go for "open-minds willing to listen to different views" ...

stupidissmart SG

Is true that some people choose to be gays because they r born tat way. However the public attitude towards gay still plays a part. From wat I have seen, those countries tat support gays movement have a higher proportion of gays. Rolling Eyes

Someone born slightly "gayish" but can still live a straight life if society influences people to be normal. On the other hand someone both slightly more toward being "straight" will be influence into being a gay if society display this possibility to them... Peer pressure is something very real. If all your friends are gays and u mixed often wih them, there is a high chance u will becomes one too...

We r not going to hunt all the gays and burn them on stakes... I just hope tat watever they do, don't let me or my children see or hear it... To me if my son suddenly tell me he is a gay, It will be something really sad.....

CX SG

why sad? does it make him any less of a person?

would he be suddenly diminished in your eyes?

his education, his brains, his achievements would all count for nothing?

u judge a person strictly based on who he / she fucks? Rolling Eyes

"don't let your child see or hear it" ??? Laughing while u're at it, make sure that he doesn't see or hear about "poverty" , "disease" , "crime" , "war" and "sex" as well...

u can't protect a person from knowledge... i would rather have a good conversation with a well-read and intelligent gay-man than to sit down with a narrow, ignorant, homophobe.

ultimately, we all gotta realise that its plain stupid to see them as sexually threatening to us.

not all gay-men wanna have sex with your son, stupidissmart...
Rolling Eyes

SGglobalist SG

Originally posted by stupidissmart:
However the public attitude towards gay still plays a part. From wat I have seen, those countries tat support gays movement have a higher proportion of gays.

Someone born [b]slightly "gayish" but can still live a straight life if society influences people to be normal. On the other hand someone both slightly more toward being "straight" will be influence into being a gay if society display this possibility to them... Peer pressure is something very real. If all your friends are gays and u mixed often wih them, there is a high chance u will becomes one too...

[/b]

Hi StupidIsSmart,

I really do not know if there is a survey or statistics out there that provides a poll that the entire public gets to take on this subject. So I dont think that the "public's" view point is that credible. If you studied statistics, you will know that it is all based on the sample size that they surveyed etc. not the 'whole' population.

Some of the readers spoke about how "society" does not accept gays or lesbians, I really wonder if it is just them speaking on society's behalf or they conducted a islandwide survey of all people in SG because I am part of society and I accept them.

One thing I know though, to create change, it starts on the individual level not on a societial level.

As for gays, if they can be influenced to be straight, are you telling me that straight people can be influenced gay too? So you are saying that sexuality is not innate but socialized? As for peer pressure, I know that it only the willing gets pressured. I think you should teach your child self determination so that he will learn to believe in himself not what others want him to do. I dont think that teaching him to 'other' others will help with his development as a human being because then he will grow up to hate or discriminate against others.

Lastly as for turning someone gay, I think that is just a stupid way of thinking about homosexuality and it is all based on fear. Where is the prove that someone will be turned gay if he/she mixes with them. That is just full of BS if you ask me. It shows how insecure that person is.

Stupidissmart, I hope that your sexuality is not born out of pressure, rather I hope it is based from an innate acknowledgement of who you really are. As for countries with higher proportions of gays and lesbians, I think you are not considering the fact that other countries are larger than SG (approximately 100 million in States, 30 million in Canada, etc) furthermore, in SG alone, I think that there are more gays and lesbians than you would think.

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