Is Medical & Health Care too Expesnive in Singapore?

last SG · 2004-03-31T17:10:55+00:00

There are simple explanations to your response. For example, why use france as a comparison? Simple. We are both developed countries who place great emphasi...

stupidissmart SG

I think is unfair to compare Singapore hospitals and malaysia and thai hospitals… it is like comparing Thai airlines with SIA… Maybe someone can give us the figures for hospital billing in cities like london or new york or hong kong…

Viper52 SG

Of course it's unfair...but look at the numbers being bandied in the article. For open heart surgery, it costs 64% more in Singapore than in Thailand and 82% more than Malaysia. The figures for cataracts are even more shocking. Use the figures in the article, take a calculator and do the math. Pay premium prices for quality? Sure! The problem is, the premium is TOO HIGH! Is the standard here 64% better than Thailand and 82% better than Malaysia? I don't think so.

We have to realise, the days of customers having the pay a premium for Singapore are over. That premium has gotten too high, and standards have climbed sufficiently in our rivals, to make it more worthwhile for the customers to go to our rivals.

And anyway, lets not compare Singapore with the region. What about the anomalies in prices between private and government hospitals here then? Isn't it ridiculous that prices for medical procedures are more expensive in the supposedly "subsidized" government hospitals than private ones? By right, government health care costs should not even match private health care costs, never mind exceeding it like the situation here.

Those who think health care here is affordable for all seriously need to wake up and smell the roses. And cut back on reading propaganda drivel.

Lingos SG

Buddy.. it's not that it is too expensive that drives them over the edge.
It is the thought of becoming a hinderance to their loved ones. Some people do not want to be dependent on their children.

ShutterBug SG

BASICALLY, there is NO REAL CARE here in hospitals, if you have no MONEY.

Everything here, all boils down to one crucial and critical factor: MONEY. It's either you have it, or you die.

So, when a person in hospital is in critical status, potentially ill on the edge of death, what do you think the doctors are more concerned about? Saving the cashless individual's life? I seriously doubt so.

In America, ER divisions saves the people first, then worry about payment later. But with costs and POLICIES in place here in SG, that can only remain a dream.....

<sk> SG

Baseless accusations against the professional healthcare workers in Singapore. Shame on you! Recently, on the forums in the ST recently, the PR head of healthcare, said that hospitals will save lives first before payments in an emergency.

raihanraihan SG

In a matter of life and death yes they might save lives first . But in non-emergency cases I believe money plays the main role. Moreover, if some hopitals charge cheaper than others for the same operation that means the more expensive hopitals are over charging and thereby making healthcare expensive in Singapore.

BillyBong SG

What viper posted is merely what others have to say. This does not imply he has the same stand but he's probably close.

What most flamers like yourself are blind to are the facts of life. Sure the gahmen can be rather 'squeezy' at times concerning money but no one is going to argue that the opening of medishield and medisave special accounts benefits rather than hurts.

Without those extra contributions, ppl who need medical services will suffer far worse than if they had made no financial planning for illnesses and other aligments.

Do you want freebies to be thrown on your lap? Who's gonna bear the cost of these monetary contributions? The Gahmen? It's simply us taxpayers who indirectly foot the bill.

So think abt that the next time you grab a dangling carrot...

zenden9 SG

Did i say freebies? Did I say free medical health service provide to us? When come to a point of arguement,I notice this word of ‘free’ will come out and try to rebuke our arguement from those govment dog! What we want is reasonable and widely acceptable medical fees provided from the gov. But what we receive is unacceptable and expensive fee!

Viper52 SG

Sorry BillyBong, but IMO you're trying to detract from the real issue with the arguments about Medisave etc etc.

The fact remains that cost of treatment at PUBLIC hospitals is ridiculously high when compared with that in PRIVATE hospitals.

The fact remains that this is ludicrous considering these public hospitals take government subsidies yet have the cheek to charge Singaporeans more or less the same prices as UNSUBSIDIZED private hospitals.

The fact remains that a lot of Singaporeans find the costs of treatment, even in public hospitals prohibitive.

At the end of the day the fact remains that medical treatment in Singapore IS too expensive.

Medisave and MediShield defraying the costs is merely a sideshow to the main issue to the fact that Medical and Healthcare in Singapore is TOO EXPENSIVE. Which was the original question for this topic.

Finally, zenden is right. Whenever the issue of costs in Singapore comes up, the government and it's supporters always come up with the same arguments and sidetracking from the issue of cost, by trying to paint the issue as one of Singaporeans asking for freebies. We're not asking for freebies, we're just asking for prices to be reduced because it doesn't take a fool to figure out that if private hospitals charge more or less the same as government hospitals, and if private hospital charges = profits, then government hospital charges + subsidies = obscene profits.

At Singaporeans' expense. Medisave or not

zenden9 SG

Bravo! Bravo! 3 Cheers to Viper52 and a slap to Billybong!

socrates SG

Isn't it ridiculous that prices for medical procedures are more expensive in the supposedly "subsidized" government hospitals than private ones?

I am not very sure about this fact. Is all area from public to private doctor cheaper ? Otherwise which area is it cheaper ? I mean NTUC generally is cheaper than the stuff sold in Liberty Super Market or Cold Storage. However there will bound to be some items whereby Cold Storage charges lesser.

I have the statistic of both private and public hospital bills here

public
http://app.moh.gov.sg/sta/sta020313.asp#sta020313

private
http://app.moh.gov.sg/sta/sta020315.asp#sta020315

From just looking at the chart, public hospital win all hands down.

The cheapest for medical specialities for private ward B1 is on average $628 in East Shore Hospital while for public open ward is $100 at Tan Tock Seng Hospital. If you want to see the same ward B1 for public hospital, it is still $374 in Alexander Hospital.

So the original assumption that public hospital is higher than private hospital is a myth. Actually I thought that is common sense... Rolling Eyes

Viper52 SG

Originally posted by socrates:

I am not very sure about this fact. Is all area from public to private doctor cheaper ? Otherwise which area is it cheaper ? I mean NTUC generally is cheaper than the stuff sold in Liberty Super Market or Cold Storage. However there will bound to be some items whereby Cold Storage charges lesser.

I have the statistic of both private and public hospital bills here

[b]public
http://app.moh.gov.sg/sta/sta020313.asp#sta020313

private
http://app.moh.gov.sg/sta/sta020315.asp#sta020315

From just looking at the chart, public hospital win all hands down.

The cheapest for medical specialities for private ward B1 is on average $628 in East Shore Hospital while for public open ward is $100 at Tan Tock Seng Hospital. If you want to see the same ward B1 for public hospital, it is still $374 in Alexander Hospital.

So the original assumption that public hospital is higher than private hospital is a myth. Actually I thought that is common sense... Rolling Eyes
[/b]

Yeah, one would think it's common sense isn't it? But the fact is that, I was not making assumptions. Fact was, when the MOH first published its price guide last year, it was revealed not only was there a wide gulf in the prices different restructured hospitals charged for similar procedures, some procedures are private hospital charges actually cost less. I cannot argue about the stats you put up, since they relate to ward charges, but the point I was making was for medical procedures.

The news made the headlines for a while, then disappeared off the altogether.

I saw my info from the MoH website then. Price comparison by procedure/operation. I don't know why the comparison for a lot of procedures have since been removed, as well as the comparison with private hospitals.

socrates SG

Panja you just shut up lah... you don't even know what the whole topic or what my reply is all about.

The term for the billing is

Average per day = total amount of inpatient bills / total number of days stayed in hospital (day surgery bills are not included).

I do not really understand what is day surgery bill mean Rolling Eyes it either means it had remove the medical procedure or the statistic do not involved those who had just operate and return without staying in hospital

zenden9 SG

So socrates,u think hospital is hotel .Just need to book the ward and sleep inside.Consultation fees,specialists,medicine fees,X-ray and operations. Have we consider all this into the factor? Don't just just compare the ward fee and a few hospital for comparison!
The ward fee is only small factor compare to the overall pictures of the medical fee,still got the intensive care unit,if u kena!

Viper52 SG

Yup, I understand where you are coming from. The prices for daily stay in a restructured hospital is indeed cheaper than a private hospital, and this is to be expected.

But like I said, my point was that the prices for medical procedures/operations do not make sense, as I have said, in the MoH's website, the price comparisons in this area between private and government hospitals (which have since been removed) show that despite subsidies, prices for these are very close, and in some areas, that for public hospitals actually exceed private hospitals

Personally, I would feel that comparing prices for medical procedures are more important to gauge affordability, since they would most likely take up the bulk of the costs, as well as being the reason for needing hospital services in the first place.

socrates SG

no no no... I mean the statistic seems to be the total bil for the stay in the hospital. That is it had included doctor fees, medicine fees, theatre fees etc. I mean I cannot be sure what that single phrase means but the statistic seems to be giving this idea that it is the average of the TOTAL bill, not just for staying in the ward only.

Viper52 SG

Originally posted by socrates:

no no no... I mean the statistic seems to be the total bil for the stay in the hospital. That is it had included doctor fees, medicine fees, theatre fees etc. I mean I cannot be sure what that single phrase means but the statistic seems to be giving this idea that it is the average of the [b]TOTAL bill, not just for staying in the ward only. [/b]

Doubt so...take a look at the points in bold:

Data are based on Medisave claims submitted by hospitals. The data include doctors' charges.
The comparison only serves as a guide and has not been standardised for the different range of medical Specialties in each hospital.
Medical Specialties include Cardiology, General Medicine, Geriatric Medicine, Paediatrics Medicine, Neonatology, Neurology, Rehabilitation Medicine, etc
Surgical Specialties include Cardiothoracic Surgery, ENT, General Surgery, Neurosurgery, Gynaecology, Obstetrics, Orthopaedic Surgery, Paediatrics Surgery, Plastic Surgery, etc
*Data include neonatology.
**Data exclude neonatology.
Average per day = total amount of inpatient bills ¸ total number of days stayed in hospital (day surgery bills are not included).
Hospitals, medical and dental clinics may reproduce this table for distribution to their patients.

I'm no cunning linguist, but I don't think the costs of procedures have been factored in. And the costs of different procedures are so varied anyway.

socrates SG

Ahhh… that had to depend on how you interprete it… My understanding is this is the average bill for people that visit any specialists. The only problem with this data is it has not been classified according to different specialist cost. For example people going to hospital for heart operations is going to pay more than people going for minor surgeries. They didn’t seperate the data into these different areas but jumbled up together as one.

NeonTetra SG

i feel that medical fees for those low incomes should be free or at least let them pay small amounts even though they r visiting specialist.

Poor people shouldnt be deprive of special medical attention and be treated the same as the rest.

stupidissmart SG

IMO I believe tat public hospital is still much cheaper than private ones. Therefore I feel tat singapore shouldn't privatise gov hospitals.

Even though eventually the citizens have to pay for the hospital fees, I still prefer to have more medical welfare in the sense tat Gov tax all the citizens equally and give to the people that will need money the most. If compared to other countries, I think singapore is the only country tat want to privatise all their Gov hospitals... anyone have any way to stop tat ?

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