MIlitary in the Region

last SG · 2001-10-14T09:28:00+00:00

I dont mean to be rude but who would want to attack New Zealand?? Half the time people forget it even exists...

Viper52 SG

Been on board the CICs of both the AEGIS CGs and DDGs, and they are awesome! 1 AEGIS cruiser can basically do traffic control for both PSA and CAAS of ot was parked in Singapore. The crews of the CG were nice enough to show us some of the “targets” they plotted while I was on board, and they briefed us extensively on the capabilities of the system, and it was impressive enough considering that most of the systems was turned off during my visit. Have to agree though that it is not necessary in Singapore context, as we are mostly defending local sea lanes and not looking for blue water capabilities. Hawkeyes with over-the-horizon targetting capabilities for Harpoons and AEW should be more than enough, esp that the MPAs habe the Harpoon targetting capability themselves.

Shotgun SG

Again, let me make myself clear. I am not talking about the air-traffic monitoring feature of the Aegis. But the ability to engage multiple surface to air targets where our aircover is out of reach.

RSAF hawkeyes play a huge part in terms of air-defence, however, they still lack the ability to pin-point multiple tracks to guide surface to air missiles.

YourFather SG

The Hawkeyes can only cover up to so far??? I'm sorry, but by virtue of the Hawkeye's height and the nature of the seas in our region, where land masses are everywhere, the Hawkeye can look MUCH FURTHER than the AEGIS can. AEGIS cant look over the horizon....

As for engaging multiple targets... not so sure we're going to face THAT many targets.... engaing 3~4 at one time would suffice, that I believe our vessels are capable of doing....

Shotgun SG

What I meant by engaging targets, I meant vampires. Inbound missiles that current RSN ship systems are unable to handle. Missiles may fly in amounts and ways that can completely overwhelm RSN’s current naval air defense systems.

Joe Black SG

I believe some Dutch, German, British and Swedish radars already provided limited multiple engagement capabilities. They haven't reached the muturity as the AEGIS, but I believe they should suffice for RSN requirements... furthermore, AEGIS is built to handle abti-ballistic missiles defence as well, which neither RSN or Singapore as a whole is currently facing... and the AEGIS is also a very very very political sensitive piece of hardware. We don't want the Malaysians (translates to Mahathir) with green eyes accussing Singapore of preparing to wage wars against them rite... hee hee Smile

YourFather SG

Considering that our corvettes will be operating under air-cover, it would be lucky if they managed to get a shot off from the bugs they have. As for exocets launched from their ships.... I really do believe the BARAK missile with the radar system on our corvettes can handle the threat.

Viper52 SG

I think we have to balance the risk of a mass saturation anti-ship missile attack against the prohibitive cost of getting a weapon system capable of putting up a significant amount of vampires in the air. If we achieve even air superiority in the air, coupled with a early strike against the enemys naval assets, the risk could be reduced to a point where that threat is virtually non-existent.

Just my $0.02; but I do feel that as far as naval capabilities go, the purchase of the frigates + new naval helos, and if we do get more advanced C3 systems for the RSN, it would be enough to face any regional threats that might develop, China notwithstanding...

Shotgun SG

I feel that a balance between a slightly downgraded multiple component Aegis battle management system, together with a better C3I, would be able to negate any possible naval threats alone. Thus freeing the RSAF for other more demanding missions such as SEAD.

GMD SG

one thing i feel necessary to point out for the Sunburn is that it is a Mach 3 capable missile…in terms of the range as faced in littoral waters, that is as good as an instant hit…granted that it is a very big and bulky missile and overkill to hit anything smaller than a frigate…

Shotgun SG

Yea, like what I said before, Sunburn would have been a massive overkill. In anycase, most of the guys here feel that our Hawkeyes are sufficient. For me, I just feel it would be better having another ace in the hole.

BTw, the Aegis system was supposedly approved for sales, but according to the page I saw that time, it never commented of the governments ever considered buying them seriously.

silencer SG

& the whole arm force only consist of 5000 men, including the Gurkas! Geez, just a small force for such a rich country

tripwire SG

when RSAF first bought the hawkeye... it was no less sensitive...

If SAF feels that the purchase of AEGIS will enhance singapore security and deterence value... i doubt they will give a damn about what malaysia thinks... afterall, they could be the potential enemy.. why make it any easier for them??

my feelings says.... its always best to have a back up... if we become too reliant on one platform, one equipment, one doctrine or one man.... we will be in trouble if the enemy found a way to neutralise it...

While hawkeye has served us well in the past... we cannot be dependent on just the hawkeye.... what will we do if the hawkeyes are sabotaged or even shot out of the sky... then wont we be demoralised??

and as far as defense of singapore goes... the govt will spend even if singapore is in depression......

Shotgun SG

Does this hint that Singapore really bought or developed some backup system for the hawkeyes?

Joe Black SG

Yap, ground based radar TP-117 3D mobile radars. They also have some other stationary ground based radars.

As you mean other airborne or seaborne platforms, answers is sort of... that is if you can consider the MPA as some sort of early warnings or the F-16 radars.. Smile

Shotgun SG

I doubt the APG-68 has that much range to give anybody early warning. =/

YourFather SG

Hmmm, not so much a matter of range, but a matter of scanning the huge amount of airspace. They can only scan a very small portion of the airspace at one time, thus the use of AWACS. The APG-68 has pretty good range, IIRC. (of course, cannot compare to the range of AWACS platforms lah)

Shotgun SG

Yes, like you said, they can only scan a certain area of airspace at a time. I doubt it would be early warning if the radar was scanning at the wrong place at the wrong time. =)

Joe Black SG

True. What is interesting though is that USAF are developing aircraft radars (such as the ones in Raptors to scan a wider volume of sky at any one time). They could act as mini-AWACS and that was suggested by some military experts. Smile

YourFather SG

Something like the SU-30MKI’s ability to act as ‘command posts’, due to their data-links and extremely fast scanning due to their AESA radars. Malaysia will have this capability if they get the MKM version.

tripwire SG

Iranians use their tomcats radar as AEW for other fighters... the logic is simplistic.. just point the tomcat radar at iraq...

But in the end... i think going to space.. should be the logical next step...

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