bur on what i should do

flaming_metro SG

im 19 this year and i just got enrolled into poly.but problem is that i planned to go to other country to study after completing my studies and ns by then i will be 25 will it be too old to actually study? or should i just quit poly now? im considering the private sch route since its faster but with the private diploma can i actually go to some other country university to study but the problem is that will the university actually accept the private diploma?

Rednano SG

private diploma most usually must follow the same university 1... like some bridging course to the degree... e.g. diploma -> advanced diploma, and university... all awarded by the same university name.

and must find cmpb to seek permission for change of course.

Rednano SG

and by the way, now rule is u only can defer till pre-university level...

Rejected: Teen's 5 appeals to defer NS Mindef turns down SIM student's pleas to sit for first-year exams first
By Esther Tan

SINGAPORE Institute of Management (SIM) student Samuel Tan Chee Hong will not get to sit for his first-year examinations at the end of this year.

By then, the youth, who turned 18 last month, will have been called up to begin his national service (NS).

Samuel joined the private educational organisation in the middle of last year, finished a six-month foundation programme and started his course in computer science at the start of this year.

But, last month, he received a letter from the Defence Ministry telling him to report for NS next month.

He has made five failed appeals to Mindef asking for a deferment. At first, he pleaded for a deferment until the end of his three-year bachelor's degree.

When that was turned down, he made four further appeals seeking a three- month deferment to allow him to at least complete the first year of his course.

All have been rejected, even with support from Aljunied GRC MPs Cynthia Phua and Lim Hwee Hua.

Mindef's replies to him all carried the same reason: Male Singaporeans aged 18 and due to enlist will be granted a full deferment from NS only to pursue educational qualifications up to 'A' levels, a polytechnic diploma or equivalent qualifications such as those from the Institute of Technical Education.

NS deferment to pursue a university degree has not been allowed since late 2005, said Mindef spokesman Darius Lim.

At the Budget debate in 2006, Second Minister for Defence Ng Eng Hen explained that, with more educational opportunities available now, pre-enlisted males can start their courses at any time of the year. This means many more Singaporeans are able to start university or other courses locally before they reach 18.

Defence Minister Teo Chee Hean also reiterated Mindef's stance in Parliament last month. 'Allowing such students deferment would be unfair to the vast majority of their peers studying in junior colleges, polytechnics and other institutions who do not have the same opportunity to be deferred for their university studies.'

Samuel's father, Mr Roger Tan, said his youngest of three sons had started the SIM course knowing there was a chance he would not get to defer. 'But we didn't want to waste time waiting for him to hit 18 before he started NS. It was a risk we had to take,' said the IT manager.

He could have enlisted earlier, as teens aged 161/2 can apply for early enlistment. But his father did not want him to do that: 'Boys that age are too young, immature and slow to learn. The risk is too high and they will be more prone to accidents.'

An SIM spokesman said the credits Samuel obtained in his first three quarters of the year will still be valid when he finishes his NS in two years' time.

Since the start of the year, five other SIM students have had to stop their studies to enlist for NS. So far, all returning students have not had to pick up new modules to replace the old ones, the spokesman said.

When contacted, a Mindef spokesman said it considers two main factors when facing a deferment request.

One is the need to preserve equity in terms of educational attainment before NS. The second is the need to enlist NS-liable males for rigorous military training 'while they are young and fit'.

Mr Tan, 54, said his son was asking for a three-month delay and would be only half a year older upon actual enlistment.

'Even with a full deferment, he would only be 20 years old upon the completion of his degree course. He'll still be young and fit then,' he said.

http://www.sgforums.com/forums/1390/topics/327143

Rednano SG

Reply by Minister Teo Chee Hean to Parliamentary Questions on Deferment
Posted: 21 Jul 2008, 1935 hours (Time is GMT +8 hours)

Mr Speaker, Sir, let me first explain the basis of our deferment policy.

Under the Enlistment Act, NS-liable males can be called up for NS as soon as they turn 18 years of age. There is a reason for this enlistment age. The SAF must be able to maintain a credible defence force for our security and survival. Given our small population, national servicemen form the backbone of the SAF. We train them to become soldiers and leaders in their 2 years of full-time NS and they continue to play these critical roles during their operationally ready service. For many, this means they are required to serve up to at least age 30. By enlisting them at around 18 years of age, we optimise the ability of the SAF to fulfil its missions with an energetic and able-bodied defence force.

Despite the legislated enlistment age, MINDEF exercises flexibility by granting deferment from full-time NS for pre-enlistees pursuing their studies under certain circumstances. In determining our policy, MINDEF applies the key principles of universality and equity to ensure that everyone is given the opportunity to attain an 'A' levels, international baccalaureate, or polytechnic diploma or equivalent qualifications before enlistment.

MINDEF therefore grants deferment for pre-enlistees to gain their basic educational qualifications of up to 'A' levels, polytechnic diploma, international baccalaureate or equivalent qualifications. This is reasonable as most of our NS-liable males would either have completed or are completing their basic educational qualifications when they turn 18 years of age. NS-liable males are therefore enlisted at the earliest opportunity after turning 18 or when they have finished such courses, whichever is later. As university degrees are considered higher educational qualifications, deferments for university studies will not be allowed. This will strike an appropriate balance as our NS liable males will be given the opportunity to complete the basic qualification at 'A' levels, polytechnic diploma or equivalent, and be enlisted for military training while they are young and fit.

Educational opportunities in Singapore have increased over the past years. There has been a proliferation of private institutions and courses offered. Some of these private institutions offer to admit students directly into their undergraduate programmes upon the completion of their 'O' levels without them having to first attain 'A' levels or diploma qualifications. Some NS-liable males have enrolled for such undergraduate programmes upon the completion of their 'O' levels before they turned age 18. They subsequently asked to be deferred to complete their university studies or their semester examinations before enlisting. Mr Yeo has asked whether MINDEF can exercise some flexibility by allowing such students in private institutions to defer till their end-of-semester examinations.

Sir, MINDEF does not allow deferment for university studies, regardless of whether the deferment is for part of or the entire duration of the undergraduate course. Allowing such students deferment would be unfair to the vast majority of their peers studying in Junior Colleges, Polytechnics and other institutions, who do not have the same opportunity to be deferred for their university studies. This would also undermine our key NS principles of universality and equity. The NS system will not work if we allow individuals to choose when they would like to be enlisted. Hence, NS-liable males who commence their university studies before their enlistment would be enlisted at the first opportunity after age 18. They will have to disrupt their university studies as they will not be granted deferment.

In line with the above, MINDEF has stopped granting deferment for university studies since the end of 2005. This change to our deferment policy was announced during the Committee of Supply in 2006. Our deferment policy can be found on the NS Portal on the internet and in the information package that is sent to all NS-liable males when they turn 16 1/2 years of age. MINDEF has also informed major private institutions of our deferment policies and has more recently requested them to remind their potential students at the point of application that deferment will not be granted for university studies. For the minority who complete their basic educational qualifications before age 18, they can apply for early enlistment if they are above age 16 1/2 under the Voluntary Early Enlistment Scheme. This will enable them to enlist slightly earlier and complete their full-time NS before proceeding for university studies.

www.mindef.gov.sg/imindef/news_and_events/nr/2008/jul/21jul08_nr4.html

flaming_metro SG

wad im trying to say is whether u people thimk that i should just quit my poly and go ns first or come out from ns go for a private diploma and go to other country to actually pursue my degree or just continue staying in poly? but will the other country unveristy actually accept private diploma?

jaezai2008 SG

if u go to australia, don't fret. the vast majority of singaporean guys studying there are poly grads (so mid 20s). like alot. alot alot alot alot alot alot alot. so many it's stupid.

of course, on the other end, there are a few who are on track to complete their degrees before they turn 21/22 - these boys are those who deferred under the old legislative scheme (i.e. came to australia after O levels). but very few of them around. i don't think the figure ever exceeded 30 (whole of australia: nsw, vic, qld, sa, nt, wa, tas). in fact, i wonder if there will even be any of them next year .. don't forget govt stopped allowed deferments in 2005 .. these boys would/should be graduating and returning for NS soon.

jaezai2008 SG

if you going to do pvt diploma, you might as well do one which has a clear cut scheme of credits (e.g. SIM). save you the trouble/cost of applying to overseas institutions with only a 50% chance of being awarded the credits.

studying in australia is not cheap. and it's not easy as well. they readily accept, but graduating is another story. of course you can just pass your way through uni .. but what's the point then? i mean .. spend so much go there study to just get passes? if you look at the group of 8's international rankings, they are actually pretty good - all are in the top 50 unis in the world.

btw, if you go there study .. plz .. tolong .. don't go to some ghetto uni like uni wollongong or la trobe ... no matter what the agents say, there are stigmas in australia - of course on the surface they say all sama sama .. but employers are not stupid; big4 intake always 80-90% from the sandstone unis (save for vic/nsw .. where unsw and monash put up decent fights against sydney and melbourne).

flaming_metro SG

im not considering australia but australia do they accept private diploma into their uni?

jaezai2008 SG

not sure how the credit scheme works, but i'm assuming they do. best to go chat with that co. ... erm ... idc? ida? i don't remember ... it's their local office promoting education in australia.

my fd (hearsay) just told me that if you go good unis, they at most give you 1yr+ off .. but if you go the more obscure ones like qld uni of tech, they give up to 2yr off.

asharae SG

Well, I went for my degree in an university in the States after my '0' levels. I wasn't 18 yet then and was allowed to do so, after signing the bond. But if you're past 18, chances are that you'll have to serve NS first.

My advice is not to quit poly for a private diploma. If you intend to fast track, why not go for NS now, and after you ORD, take a 3 year private dipolma + degree course*? By then you'll be around 24 with Bachelor’s Degree, then you can sought work for some experience.

After which, you can go overseas for a Master's Degree course and work overseas if you desire.

*Note: Depending on which country you would like to go for your Masters Degree(UK/US/AUS), please choose a corresponding university at the private institution. E.g. If you intend to go Canada for your Masters and work there in the future, go for a US university and not a UK one. This is to avoid unecessary costs and time to take various prerequisites such as GDR, GMAT etc.