Continue from Speaker's Corner

last SG · 2005-07-30T10:17:39+00:00

is it not hypocrisy if, ultimately, secular humanism is shoved down people’s throat?

Icemoon SG

When did I argue for a perfect species? Laughing

but if you are short or ugly still not so bad. but sexual preference has to do with the spreading of genes, it is one trait that kills all other good traits.

shade343 SG

You are not obliged, but you should. Laughing

laoda99 SG

How does homo not affect other people around him? e.g. his family, his wife (if he is a closet gay), his friends etc....

I have come across a case of a husband, who admitted he is gay, was blackmailed by his gay lover. The husband and wife are both teachers and have two lovely kids. The whole family is deeply distressed by the incident. So how can it not affect others?

Icemoon SG

well, i can't agree on the idea of celibacy. Even the Jewish sages get to enjoy sexual intimacy every Sabbath night .. haha .. why deny priests this entitlement from God? Mr. Green

So the christian and catholic r wrong to have priest and nuns tat value calibracy ? They should follow god commandement and make love every sabbath night ?

Well, let's just say they violated God's first commandment given to mankind when Adam and Eve were created.

laoda99 SG

Originally posted by Icemoon:

Singles can procreate. If they have ONS without protection every night or two, very high chance something good will come out. It is just they chose not to do it, or they did it with protection.

[b]So God's admonition against homosexuality in the OT was not exactly unfair. The Jewish tradition places high regards for the family and marriage. This is one reason why they could survive in the diaspora. They are unlike Christian priests and nuns who value celibacy. All the sages in the Jewish Talmud are married. There was one guy who didnt and was criticised by his fellow rabbis .. lol

So you see, God's intention was good. He wanted us to enjoy good family life. No wonder his first postive commandment was "be fruitful and multiply". Wink

oh yah, in case anyone of you are not familiar, Jewish couples are supposed to .. erm .. make love every Sabbath night. It is almost like a commandment to them. Cool [/b]

Agreed with esp 2nd and 3rd paragraph...

Christian workers remain celibate as a choice (according to paul) so tat they can devote their time to god.

laoda99 SG

For SIS:

Some animals such as giraffes practice necking, but that's still different from having sex. Male giraffes show affection by necking.

shade343 SG

Then its the guy fault for not being open with his wife. But if they guy loves a man and a woman, isnt he a Bisexual? And the reason why the wife is distressed is because she isnt open minded either.

Icemoon SG

hmm .. devote their time to god to do what?

Mother Theresa can open orphanage. Protestants also open orphanage. If you mean studying the bible whole heartedly .. hello .. our Jewish rabbis studied their Scripture even more heartedly.

Actually if you think of it hor .. Paul got reason for saying that one. Maybe he couldn't get a wife (I suspect he wasn't married) and was jealous of those who could. Paul wasn't exactly yandao - he was bald and short. Laughing

Hmm .. if we look at Priscilla and Aquilla in the NT, one very successful couple, we see they could still devote their time to god?

laoda99 SG

He is a closet gay...

If u are the wife, will u not be distressed too? Will u be able to keep an open mind after ur husband secretly indulge in sex with other men and then got blackmail?

Luckily, the wife forgave the man....I didn't know what happened after it though....

laoda99 SG

It is written in the bible according to Paul.

It is said that in the bible that Paul really wants to live a normal life and have a wife, he said it himself in the epistles. But he chose not to. Imagine him running around churches distances away....where to have the time to start a family?

But Paul also say it is better for one to get married so tat he is not consumed by fires...something like tat.....so it is actually up to the individual....

For my view, it is obviously better for persons to get married....

stupidissmart SG

When did I argue for a perfect species?

but if you are short or ugly still not so bad. but sexual preference has to do with the spreading of genes, it is one trait that kills all other good traits.

If u r not arguing for a perfect species, then why demand perfectness in the choice of partners ? Rolling Eyes Even rats, penguins and giraffe have gays and the also face evolution. Moreover as said by the sexuality test, there is a range of preference for same or opposite sex. People who may the opposite sex and same sex can still reproduce as well. Heard of bisexuality ?

How does homo not affect other people around him? e.g. his family, his wife (if he is a closet gay), his friends etc....

Tis is indirect influence. So u mean it is perfectly fine to be gay if tat guy has no family and wife while it is wrong to be one if he has family ?

Christian workers remain celibate as a choice (according to paul) so tat they can devote their time to god.

Tat is unnatural. DO u see any animals calibrate for their religion ?

stupidissmart SG

Some animals such as giraffes practice necking, but that's still different from having sex. Male giraffes show affection by necking.

Male giraffes spend most of their time in bachelor groups, where they entwine necks and rub against each other for up to an hour at a time. These "necking" sessions often culminate in mounting, and can outnumber heterosexual encounters 9 to 1.

U know wat is mounting ?

laoda99 SG

1) Is indirect influence not influence?

2) Now u say it is unnatural. I agree with u too. But sometimes, do pple have a choice? Many of my school teachers remain celibate throughout their yrs of teaching....

3) Do animals have a religion?

stupidissmart SG

Is indirect influence not influence

Can u answer on the next question. If by going wat u say, then GAYS R PERFECTLY FINE IF THEY DO NOT HAVE FAMILY AND WRONG IF THEY HAVE ONE. If u say yes, then clearly u will realise tat your argument on family etc is really a very weak argument. If your family and wife is buddhist and u convert to christainity, u also hurt them as well. So christainity should not evangelise ? If your family wanna have a heir from u but u becoem a priest and take a vow of calibracy, then u also hurt your family and u r wrong and people shouldn't become priest ?

Now u say it is unnatural. I agree with u too. But sometimes, do pple have a choice? Many of my school teachers remain celibate throughout their yrs of teaching

Who say no choice ? Marry ugly fat men. If not marry blind handicapped terminally ill people. If not buy one from another country. There is a choice, but they rather be single then resort to such measures.

Do animals have a religion

No, so if going by the theory of natural=good, religion is definitely wrong.

Icemoon SG

hahahahaha ..this is one of the dumbest reply to come out of sgForums. Laughing

no offense .. but really dumb leh ..

laoda99 SG

1. Can u answer on the next question. If by going wat u say, then GAYS R PERFECTLY FINE IF THEY DO NOT HAVE FAMILY AND WRONG IF THEY HAVE ONE. If u say yes, then clearly u will realise tat your argument on family etc is really a very weak argument. If your family and wife is buddhist and u convert to christainity, u also hurt them as well. So christainity should not evangelise ? If your family wanna have a heir from u but u becoem a priest and take a vow of calibracy, then u also hurt your family and u r wrong and people shouldn't become priest ?

Think about it, can gays not have any family at all? Is indirect influence not influence?

Your second part abt the hurt, I agree with u. But what has it got to do with gays?

Personally, I would think it is more shocking or hurtful for me to tell my family that I am gay than i want to become a christian or take a vow of celibacy (not calibracy, nothing to calibrate)

2. No, so if going by the theory of natural=good, religion is definitely wrong.

I think judging by this theory, it means that if u r not an animal, u should have a religion.

stupidissmart SG

Your second part abt the hurt, I agree with u. But what has it got to do with gays?

U say it is wrong to be gays because they hurt their family. But being christian or priest can hurt their family equally as well. If u view gays as wrong because of tat reason, then being a christian or priest is wrong as well

Personally, I would think it is more shocking or hurtful for me to tell my family that I am gay than i want to become a christian or take a vow of celibacy (not calibracy, nothing to calibrate)

To other family, the result is the same or perhaps worse. Tis is particularly true if your family is from another religion altogether

I think judging by this theory, it means that if u r not an animal, u should have a religion

I think u get a wrong conclusion. animals don't have a religion doesn't means human must have Rolling Eyes In fact animals, who do not eat the fruit of wisdom and is suppose to be the purest state defined by god do not even pray or worship him. sn't tat a sign tat men shouldn't have a religion as well

Icemoon SG

I never demand perfectness. I believe that homosexuality is largely a matter of choice and not by hereditary. And I argue that it is unnatural 'cos it violated the first principle of survival - to pass down your genes. Hey even flowers which cannot fark around need to pass down their genes - through insects.

I remember my first reply on this issue, in this topic, to ah heng, was - "not quite right".

stupidissmart SG

Then my argument to u is tat sexuality is a range and not just black or white. It do have mechanism to pass down to future generations. According to many experts, they find tat homo can be due to genes. R u gonna say they r wrong ? Impotency also violates the first principle yet there is still people who r impotent. Doesn't tat show we r still undergoing evolution and flaws still surfaced ?

Icemoon SG

aiyoh .. if you want to argue it the religious way .. please go and study the religious text before you shoot!

It is not about fruit of wisdom, but that animals lack the conscious or spirit put in human by God. God breathed into mankind the neshamat, something not mentioned in the creation of animals. Animals are just nefesh chayah, or living being, or soul if you like.

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