Creation vs Theory of Evolution

last SG · 2004-07-29T17:46:29+00:00

let's stick to the new thread http://sgforums.j37.com/?action=thread_display&thread_id=94684

sillyme SG

No lah, i'm not young earth supporter Mr. Green
I'm "God created" supporter

Icemoon SG

Originally posted by sillyme:
[b]God made the world in six days, so there's not sudden influx of life. In anyway, we're talking about an almighty being, it's not surprising how He can create all these things at the blink of the eye.

Your reply was ambiguous. Six days no sudden influx of life.

stupidissmart SG

So u think one day before there was no earth and the day after earth appeared ? There r a lot of evidence tat the earth was made in many millions of years... There r even more evidence tat the galaxy is made in billions of years... one day ? *shake head*

The only thing I can say it... u really have a lot of blind faith on it even though there was so much evidence tat points to the contrary...

nukewatch SG

That is an important point. Because salvation does not depend on whether you are a young earth or old earth supporter. But you have to be "God created" supporter though.

There is a school of thought that Genesis 1 is not a record of how God created the world. Instead, it is a refute of a then common religion that 6 generations of gods created the world. 6 generations, 6 days, ring a bell?

An alternative thinking is that the writer of Genesis 1 simply fit the creation account into the common 7-days week. But it does not explain how the 7-days week come about.

The point is it doesn't matter whether God created the world in 6 days or 6 bilion years. The important point is that there is a Creator.

Icemoon SG

Does SIS accept Nukewatch's explanation? Very Happy

stupidissmart SG

That is an important point. Because salvation does not depend on whether you are a young earth or old earth supporter. But you have to be "God created" supporter though.

So u r an old earth or young earth supporter ? Evidence point to fact tat earth is old. According to bible earth is young. there is a contradiction among them.

There is a school of thought that Genesis 1 is not a record of how God created the world. Instead, it is a refute of a then common religion that 6 generations of gods created the world.

The bottom line is, they stated tat it is created within 6 days. It never tell u how it is created, fair enough.. but they do give a dateline for the creation. Do u accept tat ?

An alternative thinking is that the writer of Genesis 1 simply fit the creation account into the common 7-days week. But it does not explain how the 7-days week come about.

the writer is suppose to be god. Since he say so, according to your religion it must be so isn't it ? I thought the idea of 7 day week come from this story in genesis ? sunday is suppose to be the rest day like wat happened to god isn't it ?

The point is it doesn't matter whether God created the world in 6 days or 6 bilion years. The important point is that there is a Creator.

tat is wat we r trying to prove now. Whether is there a creator or not. How to do tat since he never claims how the world is made ? Simple, he claims tat it is created within 6 days. Just prove tat it is not created within days and it will make the idea of creator becomes less credible.

nukewatch SG

Somehow, my point is not understood. So I shall try one more time (perhaps last one), using simple english. Please bear in mind that in doing so, a lot of details are left out.

Originally posted by stupidissmart:
According to bible earth is young.

No, the Bible does not state that the Earth is young.

The bottom line is, they stated tat it is created within 6 days. It never tell u how it is created, fair enough.. but they do give a dateline for the creation. Do u accept tat ?

This is a repeated question, see previous post for repeated answer. Thank you.

I thought the idea of 7 day week come from this story in genesis ?

Maybe, maybe not. I will let you do the research.

sunday is suppose to be the rest day like wat happened to god isn't it ?

"Rest day" is Saturday for Jewish tradition, Friday evening to Saturday evening.

quote:
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The point is it doesn't matter whether God created the world in 6 days or 6 bilion years. The important point is that there is a Creator.
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tat is wat we r trying to prove now. Whether is there a creator or not.

I seriously doubt that can be proven. Either one believeth or one believeth not. Oops, I mean either one choose to believe or one choose not to believe.

Disclaimer: The views expressed here are the author's own. They do not claim to represent the views of all other Christians. All believers and non-believers are welcomed to agree to disagree. Cheers! Ganbei! leKhaim!

sillyme SG

quite true Razz
ignore the sudden influx. i was trying to tell SIS, everything was created in stages..

sillyme SG

anyway, to restate my point.
like what nukewatch mentioned, it's not important to me whether the earth is new or old. what is important to me is that the things that exist is created by the Almighty God who is also timeless.

sillyme SG

on a sidenote, please join us for a meetup on 15th august

details are here Mr. Green

stupidissmart SG

Okie, let me summarise your view

u do not care if the earth is young or old. U only care tat it is created by god. Why u do not care is because the evidence point to the fact tat the bible is wrong. U say it is not wrong, because the 6 days tat was used explicitly written in the bible doesn't mean 6 days ?!!? They put 6 days there just to refute other people religion ?!?? If u ask me, either the bible tries to copy other people religion or something must be wrong with god's english as days means days. The use of the word "generations" is probably just a thought by christians who realise tat the earth cannot be young... Rolling Eyes

U doubt it cannot be proven ? Maybe u r right because to be blunt... u find excuses for its mistakes... bible also suggected tat the earth is flat and sun revolves around earth. I bet u can come up with sayings tat twist its literal meaning to something totally different. If u do not read the words in the bible literally, everything in it becomes undefined. U can say days actually meant generation. Maybe in future some can even say "days" meant papaya, banana or saseme street.

sillyme SG

let's put it this way. there are many questions and doubts i have, but that doesn't stop me from believing in God. there's a huge chunk of missing information about the beginnings of this world we live in. maybe we'll find out someday, maybe not. the it's better to be in God's presence for one day than a thousand days away from Him.

so, let's look at the beginnings of the world from another angle. since you do not believe in creation, you surely believe in the big bang. if all began with an explosion, a big chaos, how did the universe stabilise? surely it defies newton's law of motion. what brought chaos to order?

stupidissmart SG

Tat is funny, because why do u believe in it when u realise tat r a lot of problems and contradictions with it ? Why can't u think about it from another angle tat it just meant christainity does not exists ? Wat evidence do u have saying tat it do ? Frankly, do u think u r special, and tat the religion u believe in have to be true while the other people like taoist buddist and freethinkers r false ?

so, let's look at the beginnings of the world from another angle. since you do not believe in creation, you surely believe in the big bang. if all began with an explosion, a big chaos, how did the universe stabilise? surely it defies newton's law of motion. what brought chaos to order?

I believe in the big bang. Tat depend on wat is your definition of chaos and order. Do u know tat there is no such thing as absolute position but only relative position ? The absolute position tat we learn during school r also in refernece to a point of interest. Now almost everything is moving (asteriod, stars etc) in a way tat mathematically say tat they come from a common point. Earth is continuosly moving around the sun and on its axis and also following the movement of the sun. Sun is moving around the milky way. Gravtiy caused all these movement. Things near to the edge of galaxy r still moving at the speed of light. Newton law of motion is used to justify big bang, there is no problem to it.

the.raven SG

haiz....last time got people get condemned just because he said the earth orbit the sun.

the.raven SG

scientists and astronomers have always been, and will still be studying the universe. right now we do not have enough knowledge to say what exactly happened in the vast cosmos. however we dont just go like "god created it in 1 day and then everything became like that" thats taking it for granted. the point of learning science is to figure out things. and also there already are many theories which are answers to your questions by people like Einstein, Stephen Hawkings, and many modern physicists. go read a book or something.

sillyme SG

Yes I've read of Hawkings and Einstein and science-related articles (I wanted to be a physicist when I was young). And as I agreed, there are many things that we do not know. But that does not rule a creator out of the whole picture. This creator would have set in place physical laws in which the creation should operate. But because he is divine, he would have the powers to intervene the events that take place in the process of creation.

I would never have the knowledge to make a sensible or convincing argument of the second law of dynamics, nor talk about the findings from Cosmic Background Explorer. These are just things I read from the source (credit goes to google, etc). In anyway, each camp will have their "valid" points of argument.

Again all these things scientists have discovered may be true, but I restate again, it does not rule out creation by a divine being.

But not having all knowledge of everything and how it came about doesn't stop one from taking a step of faith in acknowledging the beauty of God. For who has heard of believers accepting God as their father because he figured how God created the world? To some, it was because it was the God of their fathers; to some, it was the love they saw God had; to some, it was the transforming change they saw God can do. It is truly a liberating experience Smile Smile Smile

Devil1976 SG

I was created by my mum and dad. I evolved into what I am today... Cool

Devil1976 SG

Creation VS Evolution?? ~WAHAHAhahahaha... < Laughing >

stupidissmart SG

Why force fit a creator into the picture just for religious sake ? I mean as people know more and more about science, they tend to know tat supernatural phenomenon r getting more and more... false... As said by raven, if we do not know certain thigs, tat doesn't means we give up and conveniently join a religion. If everyone do tat, then there will be no science.

But not having all knowledge of everything and how it came about doesn't stop one from taking a step of faith in acknowledging the beauty of God. For who has heard of believers accepting God as their father because he figured how God created the world? To some, it was because it was the God of their fathers; to some, it was the love they saw God had; to some, it was the transforming change they saw God can do. It is truly a liberating experience

I just cut and paste an earlier answer I had written in chit chat

Let me ask u then, wat actions have he done in the bible tat u can recognise him as your father ? He test people by killing their whole family, he kill almost the whole race of men just because they r not good in his eyes, he kill off the first born of the egytians just because they do not listen to him and he cursed the whole human race to speak in different language just because they wanted to cooperate in building a tower. Why do U think I felt he is sadistic etc, is because he really is a bit... sadistic... He really create evil isn't it ? He really punish men for being sinful isn't it ? Everyone sins isn't it ? According to a christian website, when u r born, u have already sinned. Then isn't the analogy of forcing everyone to swim and punish them when they r wet true ? He create sin, make it such a way tat everyone sin then punish people because they sin. Is there anything wrong with tis saying ? U better hope tat u r not his son as he will probably crucifixed u as a sacrifice to himself.

sillyme SG

Back to square one ah?

I'm a believer of God, and I do not deny the relevance in science too. (best of both worlds Razz )

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