Local Study Award: IN for the Money, Not for Country/Passion

SgBoysRulez SG

Hi, Im enlisting to Tekong for PTP on 9th Dec 2010 and Im wondering that should i take up LSA if i meet the requirements for it? (I dont think I will stay after the 4years bond & the reasons that i take it are:

1. to have enough savings to start a family (house+car+$$ for marriage+ other savings)

2. experience what it is like as a NS regular

3. dont need to worry about uni fees which also means no debts (I want to experience life in hostel but I wouldnt be able to afford staying in campus hostel if I dun take up LSA)

4. LSA holders can disrupt for their studies after they commissioned (which means I would get my degree (4yr program) @ 23yrs old (Im 17 this year with alv equivalent qualification)

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My questions now are:

1. What rank would I probably get by the time I finish my 4 year bond? (CAP?MAJ?LTC?COL?)

2. is the 4years bond in exchange for monetary benefits worth it?

3. am I really able to disrupt for studies after I take up LSA and commission as 2LT?

4. would my degree honours be a factor or my CEP/promotion rate?

Thanks

eac SG

1) 4 years of Officership salary isn't enough for them.

2) 2 years of NSF life is general enough for almost all Singaporean men. Even NSF LTA Officers can't wait to take their ICs to ORD.

3) Now you eat the dangling carrots up in the air for the LSA sponsorship, later then you know that 4 years bond. Break it and you pay back all the salaries/ allowances/ to the SAF + some further monetary compensation for "supposedly used to groom you" expenses. Whereas in the civilian career, if you not happy at work, at most you give 1 month notice.

4) Most Singapore men get their local Uni degree at 23 to 24 too.

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1) At most up to Captain (CPT) rank after having your 1st degree. LSA is local award only and it's considered to be a sponsorship. Therefore, it's far from the SAF Overseas Scholar Scholarship (SAFOS), only second to the President Scholarship under the Public Service Commission (PSC).

2) Since the economy is picking up speed, a civilian career whether private/ public is better than a regimental uniformed career, where the 4 years of military work experience is relatively useless in the civilian work experience, since you don't carry a rifle to the office in say, Raffles Place, don't you...

3) Yes, you can disrupt but is it really worth it? NS is just 2 years now, you enrol in University later, the skills, knowledge and technology learnt is newer and up to date. Moreover, to be commissioned as a newly minted 2LT, it takes almost 1 year from enlistment date to commissioning date, then serve 1 year of Officership till ORD.

4) If you are a SAFOS scholar, then you will be promoted faster to LTC/ COL/ BG like Lee Hsien Loong, George Yeo, Teo Chee Hean...etc. Otherwise, since LSA is like a sponsorship, not a scholarship, so it's commonly known as the "Farmer Officer" path. Typically, when SAFOS scholars retired at COL/ BG/ MG/ LG rank, only the top few LSA holders can retired at LTC / Senior LTC rank, and perhaps only a handful of the tip top tier reached COL rank at retirement.

SgBoysRulez SG

Thx eac for your reply man, but i think I would like to discuss & hopefully can get some enlightenment from you

1. I calculated that the money I could have save from enlistment day till the end of bond is at least 30k (including the annual 9k allowance from LSA) though not really enough but savings should be more than those who are working in the private sector right? (asume their parents didnt fund their uni & they have to pay off student loan)

2. Nothing much to say (ye to experience it myself)

3. see point number one below

4. In terms of local degree I thought majority of the male graduates are 24-25 years old? (3yr bba/4yrs program) and I have calculated that through this LSA route I should be ahead of my singaporean male classmates by 2 years as currently I am ahead of them by a year as I skipped a grade back then

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1. Is it really captain at max? cause if 4yr bond and stuck at captain I dont think its worth it though unless if its MAJ/LTC (I thought should be at least a MAJ after all the what tours in all those 4 years)

2. Isnt it worth it as by being 2 years ahead of my peers, I only lose out 2 years of experience to them in the private sector but gain a foundation in terms of savings? (pls enlighten me)

3. I think that the curriculum would be the same though (never really c uni update it's syllabus very often leh) & I also heard that you can serve your bond and remaining NSF liability at the same time right?

4. So will I be able to reach atleast a MAJ(1) by the end of the bond if I was able to make it to the "handful of the tip top tier "?

Thank You very much as this meant alot to me & my future

eac SG

Thx eac for your reply man, but i think I would like to discuss & hopefully can get some enlightenment from you

2. Nothing much to say (ye to experience it myself)

3. see point number one below

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2. Isnt it worth it as by being 2 years ahead of my peers, I only lose out 2 years of experience to them in the private sector but gain a foundation in terms of savings? (pls enlighten me)

4. So will I be able to reach atleast a MAJ(1) by the end of the bond if I was able to make it to the "handful of the tip top tier "?

Thank You very much as this meant alot to me & my future

1) If you are to sign on the contractual bond just for the money and "loan-free" tuition fees, then you will suffer during the 4 year bond, since you pay back not in terms of money, but 4 years of military life. Maybe not initially, after 2 years into the regular life when all your batch cohort shout "ORD Loh!", then you will understand what are job satisfaction and working morale all about. Please note the 4 year bond starts effectively only after you are being commisssioned as a Officer. So the calculation is firstly 3 months BMT + 9 months OCS = 1 year. Therefore, 1 year Officer in training + 4 year bond = 5 years of NS.

2) That's why you should experience BMT 1st before deciding whether you like to wear the green wear.

3) 1 year in difference for Uni enrollment isn't that much a difference at all. Yes, you may get the degree early just by 1 year. But after that, you throw away your knowledge for wear green uniform and carry a rifle in the jungle.

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1) Now about 3 months after getting a 1st degree let you taste the CPT rank for 4 years is good enough already. As already mentioned, LSA is a sponsorship, not a scholarship. So you are emplaced on the farmer officer path of progression, not the scholar officer path.

2) A foundation in savings versus a foundation of real working experience. You decide...

3) The syllabus (framework) don't change that much, but it's the articles and studying materials used are updated.

4) The tier ranking doesn't apply to regular Officer on the 4 year bond (short term contract scheme). As mentioned, they give you CPT rank for 4 years after a 1st degree. Even CPT rank also have Grade 1 and Grade 2, just like Major Grade 1 and Major Grade 2. The tier ranking is for regular Officers who signs the Officer contract for a life long career until the official statutory military retirement age.

eac SG

If you really need a scholarship or at least a sponsorship for tertiary education, please go to www.brightsparks.com.sg for more options of various public and private companies for a non-uniformed career.

SgBoysRulez SG

hi thx for the website, I read most of it but most of them requires a good cca record which I dont have really have cause there are only sports cca in my sch and I cant make it into the school team -_-

SO I thought LSA would be better cause ppl say "any tom dick or harry can get it" (but I was a member (1year +) then become president & student conductor of guitar ensemble (for 1 month+) during sec3 before I transfer sch due to relocation)

How about SAS? particularly SAS(local) <most likely leave after the bond>

1. Are you considered a scholar? what possible rank after 6 year bond? (min & max)

2. the monthly pay you received is based on? how much?

3. do they provide the hostel fees? (does the scholarships that provides hostel fees include their meal plans?)

4. 6 years being treated as a scholar shouldnt be so bad compared to 4 years as farmer right?

thank you so much man, you have really helped me alot (though I still look kinda of stubborn, still looking for chances to sign on-_-'')

stellazio SG

LSA still is 4 years only meh? i thought LSA gotta increase the term served as well?

eac SG

How about SAS? particularly SAS(local) <most likely leave after the bond>

1. Are you considered a scholar? what possible rank after 6 year bond? (min & max)

2. the monthly pay you received is based on? how much?

3. do they provide the hostel fees? (does the scholarships that provides hostel fees include their meal plans?)

4. 6 years being treated as a scholar shouldnt be so bad compared to 4 years as farmer right?

thank you so much man, you have really helped me alot (though I still look kinda of stubborn, still looking for chances to sign on-_-'')

1) Sorry, only SAFOS and the SMS Merit Scholarship are considered true scholars in the SAF like LHL, George Yeo, Teo Chee Hean...etc.

SAS holders attend Military Universities like USA West Point (Military) only. Then what can you do after the 6 years bond in the civilian working world with a Military Uni degree since you are most likely to leave after the bond? I met 2 ex-SAS holders, who have since resigned from SAF, are Security Managers at the IRs. For the average ones, at the end of the 6 year bond, most at CPT rank (Grade 1 or 2), then based on consistent performance appraisals and recommendations can 2 handfuls of 10 fingers to MAJ at best.

2 and 3)
Check http://student.brightsparks.com.sg/profile/army/scholarship.php

4) When I ORDed years ago, a SAS holder in my camp after working a few years is a MAJ then. Now just recently when I go back for reservice, he is still a MAJ, whether Grade 1 or 2, I don't know. He's in the mid-30s, and almost all who worked with him says he is really a talent, it's just the system somehow don't seem to be kind towards him. Even an Officer once said in some forums as a light-hearted joke, "SAFOS are groomed to be potential Generals to eat honey stars, the Merit ones are groomed to be potential Colonels to eat a triple crabs combo, the SAS are to Lieutenant-Colonels (a couple of crabs) and the LSA are the kar kias who eat chocolate bars..."

So you ask me right or not, you say leh...

Rednano SG

Dude, some past references from previous topics:
www.sgforums.com/topics/search?q=Scholar+Farmer&commit=Go&type=topics

Only these 3 are called the real true scholarships as mentioned above:
www.mindef.gov.sg/imindef/careers/scholarships/home.html

Farmers vs. Scholars
As with many militaries, there exists numerous rivalries such as officer/non-officer, combat/logistics divides, Army/Navy/Air Force. Fortunately, because the members of the SAF are thoroughly integrated into society at large, there are no major military/civilian issues.

Apart from such minor divisions, a more important dichotomy is observed between officers who are polytechnic or local university graduates (Farmers), and former scholarship holders who studied overseas (Scholars). This phenomenon exists because of fast-tracked careers, quick promotions, a dual-track career in the Civil Service after mandatory retirement offered as enticement for young men to take up SAF scholarships. While this state of affairs has existed since the Singapore government started giving out scholarships, the issue was mentioned in Parliament for the first time in a speech decrying the class-consciousness and social stratification resulting from the existing policies^{from:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singapore_Armed_Forces_ranks}