Everyone Has A Role - Flamed

Onepax SG

If you come to think of it, almost all of the EPL stars have some form of injury and would be downgraded to PES C. Imagine Roy Keane being an enlistee instead of an officer or specialist, even though people deem him to be a 'midfield general'

Also, it should be conceded that there can be no perfect system for PES grading in the light of the four recent deaths

This is my response to Gloater's thread on Kengsters in this forum which said that "90% of the PES C & E personnels are [malingers]". Truth be told, there will be a handful of them who are fitter than the combat feet personnels if you look at the results of games day in BMT. i.e. a PES C company faring better than the other companies.

Furthermore, everyone is important to the army. You can't ORD or take leave if there is no clerk in your unit, draw arms to defend your country if there's no armstokesmen and so on.

Gloater SG

the diff between EPL stars and this case is that the EPL stars have all some form of injuries but they play on. The kengsters mostly have NO medical condition, but fabricate some to be downgraded.It is the diametrical opposite.

Your EPL analogy is apt in that it raises a point that professionals like footballer or a professional soldier tend to soldier on cos it's their rice bowl. I know one regular who refuse to seek further medical attention from MO's pressing because he didn't want his injuries to affect career if he ever even get close to a recommendation of a downgrade.

Onepax SG

but im sure there'll be some combat unfit personnels who would want to play on toobut can't because of their status.

nonetheless, you're still right

Gloater SG

but im sure there'll be some combat unfit personnels who would want to play on toobut can't because of their status.

nonetheless, you're still right

yes you are right there will be some who are genuinely combat unfit but want to play soldier. when we say kengsters, we refer to the ones who wish to be downgraded.

tarutaru SG

No need to go so far our own National team have several Pes C personals...Rafi Ali etc...

Gloater SG

No need to go so far our own National team have several Pes C personals...Rafi Ali etc...

so many chao kengs.

Gloater SG

are fitter than the combat feet personnels if you look at the results of games day in BMT. i.e. a PES C company faring better than the other companies.

Yes this so true and so disgraceful

LazerLordz SG

Go ask anyone in sports medicine and they will tell you most competitive athletes have injuries that would inhibit combat performance in certain areas.

If healthy people wish to keng, let them answer to their own conscience because it's their own life. We cannot be nannies for other people, a nanny state is bad enough.

Time to move on from spoonfeeding and worrying about the lifestyles of others.

Man!x SG

PES C or whatever also same... combat, service. its just a matter of what is the definition of siong. Why always the same topic come out? We all see kengsters everywhere PES A-E. but not all PES C-E are kengsters.. try saying that in an infantry BN to the QM, MTor CQ side,the next time you open your out ration.....you might have alot of gravy in different colors...

Gloater SG

It's not the same because it's just not the same. It's true that combat support and combat service support have their importance and also have their roles to play. Without them then we can't fight.

But this does not change the fact that most kengsters are in combat service support no? If they manage to keng successfully they get posted there.

Does it change the importance of combat service support? of cos not.

Does it change the fact that you find many more kengsters among storemen and clerks than a 2nd yr mono intake in SIR? No.

Does it change the fact that among downgraded men vs combat fit men, you find more fraudsters in the 1st group than you would in the 2nd? certainly not.

Also, of cos they are not the same. who's you kidding? if they were the same, they won't be identified by different names duh.

caleb_chiang SG

And you can't have kengsters when there is no kengsters to start with...

Sakuragi86 SG

gloater i sense jealously in your comments sia.isit because you cannot keng successful that why you so hate those who keng.

i wonder if you were pes c and e .will you be saying such thing.

you go think la.if someone really got big problem then you ask him to be pes a and b.then he die how. who answer. you ah?

Gloater SG

gloater i sense jealously in your comments sia.isit because you cannot keng successful that why you so hate those who keng.

i wonder if you were pes c and e .will you be saying such thing.

you go think la.if someone really got big problem then you ask him to be pes a and b.then he die how. who answer. you ah?

It is probably a surprise to you because I know every cohort got totally opposite types of people, but surprise, there are lots who did not try to keng you know? You will find it hard to believe from your friends, this I judge from what you said to me. you take it for granted clearly that downgraded is everyone's holy grail, and anyone who isn't must secretly wish he was. That's your world, sure I know.

here's news for you. i know this hwa chong guy who was given Pes C in JC because his myopia degree is over 900 and physical rigors increase the chance of his retinas detaching resulting in irreversible blindness and he literally begged to not be Pes C because he said he MUST go OCS. He was given the chance to be Pes C and he threw himself into Pes A/B instead because he begged for it. He later became a SAF scholar and chose infantry.

You also dun seem to get how the definition of a kengster is someone who wishes to be downgraded without having due cause. Not someone with a genuine medical condition. So i don't understand why you say "someone really got big problem blah blah ask him to be Pes A?" I have never met anyone with a genuine and serious medical condition like a hole in heart, given Pes B or A. In fact even flat feet or or even low blood count can get you a Pes C in the SAF easily, as I know many. So please. Dun talk cock.

Gedanken SG

Gloater must be a walking MRI machine if he can just glance at someone and confirm that the person doesn't have a genuine medical condition. Talk about talking cock.

Come on Gloater, show us your medical expertise, or are you going to crap on about *ahem* "historical trending" again?

skythewood SG

I remember got one very fit guy, 2.4km run sub 9, in my BMT got downgraded after enlisted. Reason: He cannot squat. But he is fucking fit. he was also like, WTF, but no choice, he simply cannot squat, he will fall down everytime.

Short Ninja SG

cannot squat is a problem if you are required to do soldiering and dont want to squat is a bigger problem>either way he needs to be downgraded even if he was Superman.

Man!x SG

Define "due course"

if the guy went to the MO and say i got this and that, and the MO decide to downgrade him then its not "keng".. At least he declared his medical status and its up to the MO to decide whether he is combat fit or not. If he's fit the MO should be able to know that, unless you are saying our MOs are issuing out downgrades to every swinging dick who have a medical condition. Then we will have an army on status or non-combat fit..If a soldier wants to be declared fit when they have a medical condition is commendable. But what if something happens to him? Will the military be accountable for it? And do you think seriously that everyone has the same mentality as the Hwa Chong fella?

We got soldiers dying due to not declaring illness and participating in training or not sounding off when feeling unwell during training.And the most probable cause in my opinion is because of these labeling of "kenging" by their peers when they miss training due to illness. It could also be due to "gung ho"ness. This just create problems for commanders cause they have to personally search out for these dudes and pulled them out of training. Sometimes they might just miss one or two. if nothing goes wrong, fine, but when it does.. Specs/officers face these problem daily. Personally i rather have a soldier excuse from training and live the next day then having to send him off in his funeral.

The best definition of kengsters are: a) purposely injure themselves so as to get a downgrade B)"disappear" when there's actual work to be done. C) take MC or report sick and faking ailments when knowing there is an exercise/training and they do not want to take part in.

I believe everyone at one stage of their NS have "keng" before, including myself. That doesnt mean they are really kengsters, Sometime you just want to get out of training that you feel have no purpose or logic to you.(like parades), or just felt not like doing it on that day. i think you never served in the military or serve NS in the military thats why you easily label soldiers as kengsters. And having military friends doesnt count.

Gloater SG

Gloater must be a walking MRI machine if he can just glance at someone and confirm that the person doesn't have a genuine medical condition. Talk about talking cock.

Come on Gloater, show us your medical expertise, or are you going to crap on about *ahem* "historical trending" again?

did i say i was an MO? did I say i was the one diagnosing your PES? Are you stupid? you mean you need to have bionic eyes to know about who are the kengsters around you? They OPENLY tell everyone else they keng. Those who secretly wished to downgrade, tried to and failed and DID NOT TELL A SINGLE SOUL, obviously only God knows they're kengsters. Is there a shortage of chao kengs in the army who openly declare they are chao kengs? i think you never served in the military or serve NS in the military

Gloater SG

Define "due course"

Is there a lack of the people who fit the description of these? " The best definition of kengsters are: a) purposely injure themselves so as to get a downgrade B)"disappear" when there's actual work to be done. C) take MC or report sick and faking ailments when knowing there is an exercise/training and they do not want to take part in."

Whatever made you think I was referring to anyone else beyond these 3 types of people you describe above, for you to launch into that defensive tirade? oh it must be that thing they call guilty complex.

when was there a case of someone who died after not reporting sick and was genuinely sick? if you are referring to the guy who didn't submit his MC, he died of a heart failure, and his MC was for his LEG. LEG.

oh and save your time trying to psychoanalyse me because you're not even close haha plus.. I doubt it even helps you with your issues.

For you to be unaware that they are so many people in the army who make no bones about kenging openly to each other, seriously i think you never served in the military or serve NS in the military before.

hisoka SG

this is merely a case of the guy wanting the scholarship and knowing that going to OCS would stand him a better chance (in fact no chance for him if he's pes C). Nothing about keng or not keng.