Citizenship US-SG Dilemma: Serve NS to Keep SG Citizenship?

fwy87 SG

i came here when i was 4 and i think my parents took up singapore citizenship for me

Eddie Lee SG

If you have a US birth certificate you are already a citizen of the United States.

One of my room mates has a teenage son that was born in the US but raised in Taiwan.

He has a US and a Taiwanese passport.

fwy87 SG

but ive got a red singapore passport, birth cert and i/c

i dont think i have a US birth cert either

i dont have a US passport since i had to surrender it

but at the back of my birth cert it says that on my 21st birthday i have to give the oath of something to choose whether i want to choose singapore or US citizenship

Eddie Lee SG

Even if you surrendered you US passport you can apply for another one.

If you were born in the US you still have a birth certificate in the city/county where you were born.

It's a matter of public record.

If you plan on staying in S'pore you should complete your military service. Failure to do so may come back to haunt you at a later date.

sebosebo SG

hey dude...i cant give any useful advice. but i wud like to comment that if u have this oppurtunity and ur family situations permits...just go and dont look back, its not abt wasting whose money, its everyman for themselves in this society. our govt wun think in ur interest neither wud i expect a foreign govt welcome u with open arms. but logically speaking, it seems there are so much more oppurtunities in the states then here, if ur family is cool with it...go now and dont look back. i do envy a little, best of luck k

kingchan SG

wah, ask a question kenna slam until like that. his parents also got pay tax one wah, so why is he not entitled to an education here? this type of arrogant attitude that makes me feel ashame of being a singaporean sometimes.

anyway the only reliable ppl you can ask regarding your NS matters would be the US embassy and MINDEF i guess. But it might be a bit too late for you now that you’re turning 21 soon.

baikachuchu SG

TS,

I think most of the anger directed towards you stems from the fact that common folks like the rest of us do not have the privilege or option to choose our citizenship like you do.So for the rest of us,it is either serve or jail time.

The fact that you have stayed in Singapore for at least 18 years of your life means that you will have gained substantially from your life here,whether you agree or not.So in every aspect,you are considered a full Singaporean and not a new immigrant.

If you truly respect the rest of your NS serving brothers,you will make a decisive decision regarding this.In fact,I think you should make this decision privately with advice from the government agency and the US Embassy rather than make it public in the forums but that is just my humble opinion,no offense.A sensitive issue such as this would tend to draw the same amount of resentment like the recent case where the Indonesian government requested that all Indonesian PRs living here should be exempted from NS as they would loose their Indonesian citizenship if they served in another country's armed forces.

If you truly want that US citizenship,you should just go ahead and bail out now without looking back or thinking of returning here.You might end up being a wanted renegade in SG but you will at least be a free man in the US!I doubt there is any extradition treaty between the US and SG to drag you back to serve once you have made it clear that you do not want to be a SG citizen.just be sure not to return to SG ever again or there might be trouble.

Think carefully as to which country you want to be your motherland and you can only have one.Appeal for assistance from the US embassy on this matter and see if they can offer any advice.If you want to have the best of both worlds,just serve your NS first than renounce your SG citizenship and go back to the US,knowning that you will still be welcomed back here in the future.If you are determined to be a US citizen for life and not return here,just get out now and forget the consequences,don't torture the rest of your serving brothers or those who have served.Envy is the fastest route to anger.

I wish you all the best in making the decision that is best for your future.

Croaking_Toad SG

TS, where do you see your future? Here in Sg or in the US?

edwin3060 SG

You have to think for yourself whether you want a US citizenship or a Singaporean citizenship as Singapore does not allow for dual-citizenships. You can't have it both ways. However, if you take up US citizenship without completing your NS, you will be liable to get charged and fined/jailed if you ever set foot in Singapore again, since I understand that you currently hold Singaporean citizenship.

I have a friend who was in a similar situation, except that it was between Australia and Singapore-- he did his NS, den emigrated. This way, he can still come back to Singapore to visit friends and family without fear. Besides, military service is looked upon favourably in US and Australia, and is actually a pretty big plus in your CV/resume.

Hope this information helps you =)

LazerLordz SG

Hope this information helps you =)

My advice mirrors Edwin3060's.

I would suggest you serve NS first, and then decide if you wish to take up US citizenship (i.e resume) or take up Singapore citizenship. There are a few reasons why this would be a better choice.

You mentioned you have a NRIC and Singapore birth cert, that's pretty much a lot against you at the moment should you choose the first option.

Let's say you decide to leg it, and head back to the States and claim your US citizenship and live your life there. If for some reason or another, your career requires you to travel to South East Asia and Singapore, this might be a disadvantage since it is very likely you will have to return or have an opportunity to do so, especially for work and so on.

Do you want to have this issue sticking to the back of your head? It hardly seems logical nor positive.

If you serve NS, you get a chance to decide legally and freely what citizenship you wish to take up after completion. Don't worry about serving NS as an American citizen, there's a fair number of foreign-born NSFs these days.

In my time, I had Japanese, Russian and Australian platoon mates in BMT.

Lastly, I would highly recommend you speak to the consular section of the US Embassy as they have assisted many such cases at the moment. They can help you to ensure that you stay on the right side of the law and also advise you on your nationality claims.

(FYI to the rest, please stop the blame game and leave your petty envies and hang-ups about the threadstarter or his situation to yourself. He is asking a legitimate question here. Thank you. )

fwy87 SG

to be honest i can still see myself as a citizen of singapore, ive had a good 17 years of life here and as much as id hate to say it but id hate to leave this place.

i am sorry if i have angered anybody here with my questions, but my purpose wasnt to make you envious of me whatsoever. i had a dilemma and i needed some experienced people to help me through it and i appreciate the positive and constructive input/opinions on how i should do this.

from what i gather it seems that the best way is to serve my NS first before going to the NS.

however what i feel is strange is that when I am serving my NS, I will be an american citizen which brings me to another thought, will I be treated unfairly? This is not to say that I am saying that the NS is bitter in anyway, it is possibly a random thought without any thought anyways.

but thank you for the help guys, but I still have alot of questions and until now its been frustrating getting them answered with the ICA directing me to MINDEF and MINDEF directing me back to ICA.

if anybody still has any comments i will be reading them ^^, ive appreciate them all, big or small :D

baikachuchu SG

TS,

I was just explaining why some people might feel anger towards you.I have nothing against you personally.Hope you can understand.=)

I have a few PRC soldiers serving in my camp,even an Australian guy but they are treated fairly by everyone.This is because in the view of the other Singaporeans,they have accepted the responsibility of NS that comes with their PR/Citizenship status.So in our view,they are no different from us,all wearing green after all,lol!!

Of course,someone will crack a friendly joke or two to the foreigners once in awhile.For example,my friend has a habit of trying to immitate the Australian accent and going "Good day mate,hobo?" when talking to the Aussy guy.As for the PRCs,their command of the English language does bring about a few laughs once in a while,especially when they try to give the commands in Malay.BUT all this jokes are made in good spirit and never taken too far.

Our government has the habit of practising Taichi when it comes to phone call.

What I suggest is that you personally go down to the government agency itself,be it ICA or CMPB and request to speak to someone in charge directly.Bring your parents too.If needed,get the embassy to contact them on your behalf,they take consulate representatives more seriously.

fwy87 SG

why CMPB?

baikachuchu SG

All ns registration for whole of Singapore go through them if I'm not wrong.Appeals for deferment even those PES Fs that are ineligible to serve have to go through them.

Guess that's why they call them Central Manpower Base,lol!

Croningfool SG

i have a situation and i need help

i was born in the US, stayed there for 4 years and i came back when my grandma died. this year i will be turning 21 year so i will have to choose my citizenship, whether i want to give up my singapore citizenship or take up US citizenship.

also if youd like to know i just completed my polytechnic education

i am to enlist before my 21st birthday though and thus i will not be able to take up my US citizenship before i enlist.

therefore im wondering that if i were to leave singapore before my 21st birthday, will i get prosecuted even if i switch to US citizenship?

i appreciate any input in advance

tyvm

Ignore all the amateur moral philosophists that seem to have popped up. The green-eyed monster has raised its head and their judgement must be considered warily.

It seems that you might be in trouble if you abandon NS. However, before doing anything, write to mindef via email and ask if you can skip NS if you take up foreign citizenship (which of course means you give up Singapore citizenship) before you are enlisted.

Alternatively, if you are not coming back, then just go. You do not owe the country anything. I am sure the army will manage without you! I am not sure if any of your kin will have to 'pay' a penalty of some sort so that is something you might want to ask as well.

I think LL's caution that your future career prospects might be scuppered is valid, but overly cautious. Taking a rational risk management approach, you need to ask yourself what is the worse that could happen careerwise and the likelihood of it happening. You also need to ask what advantages you stand to gain from leaving and the probability of gaining those advantages. Only you know enough about your circumstances to be able to analyse the risks.

Of course, it is only commonsense not to reveal too much when opening the lines of communication. I think advice above to speak to CMPB with your parents and with full disclosure is wrong. Wait and see what reply you get from your initial query, then decide how to proceed. If it is found out that it is impractical to leave, then adopt the full disclosure and conciliaroty approach; no one needs to know you were the one who made the inital enquiry!

Good luck!

ceecookie SG

I advise u take up U.S citizenship,as you do not have to endure the political corruption of the Singapore Government.

Better still,i daresay you will be easily let off NS with a $5000 fine only.And the S.A.F sucks anyway

However,if you do want Singaporean citizenship,it would be good if you could volunteer to be a spy for the C.I.A.Who knows we may need the U.S's help with overthrowing the PAP regime

eac SG

there is a $75000 'break ns' bond if u fly to another country n not serve ns.

+ once u ever step foot on SG soil again, u r immediately arrested at the checkpoint.

i strongly urged u to contact the US embassy to get an official help to manage ur case with CMPB. as said b4, u r not the only one who have this dual citizenship problem.

anyway, u should read more abt the Enlistment Act here. -> http://www.mindef.gov.sg/dmg/ls/enlistment_act.htm

ceecookie SG

I urge TS to be calm.

Remember what happen to the Melvyn Tan saga?

aiglosicicle SG

when i went for my medical check up i met this german who was almost in your situation except he spent all his life in germany. he decided to honour his singaporean citizenship.

I-like-flings(m) SG

Hope this information helps you =)

yup... i got a fren...whole family already in canada..and he is even staying there already... but he have to come back to serve... then go back to get his canadian citizenship

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