Heresy or Apostasy?

Creation1656 SG

I have always wanted to ask devout Roman Catholics Christians this question. Which is the more serious offense, Apostasy or Heresy?. I understand that Martin Luther was an ex-catholic monk, was he considered an apostate or heretic?. During the inquisition, i understand that heretics were bbq alive, how about apostate?

SingaporeMacross SG

Martin Luther is a heretic. A heretic is one who rejects certain doctrines despite being corrected. An apostate is one who renounces his faith.

Miracles&Prophecies SG

I think apostasy doesn't always involve renouncing one's faith explicitly rather it may mean defying one's faith by mere action or mindset while still being a member of the church. In other words apostasy could be viewed as simply as going against God.

Heresy is another thing, it is believing in doctrines different from the official church stand.

But one may well indeed be an apostate and a heretic.

Creation1656 SG

Originally posted by SingaporeMacross:

Martin Luther is a heretic. A heretic is one who rejects certain doctrines despite being corrected. An apostate is one who renounces his faith.

If martin Luther is considered a heretic, then it should follow that all the churches that came out of the reformation be considered heretical? What is the offical position of the RC church, is there salvation outside the RC church?

Miracles&Prophecies SG

Yes the official Catholic church doctrines is that there's salavation outside the RC church.

But this also applies to any other religion aside from Christianity unfortunately. But let God decides who gets saved. we should not judge those who are not even our own servant.

I'm a Catholic and I don't consider churches outside RC as heretics. I've read books about Christians outside RC having a personal relationship with God. Christ and that implies salvation is not the propriety of any single person or any single organization.

The church implies the congregation of believers and only that in my opinion, congregation of believers and not congregation of pastors or priests but congregation of believers in Christ. And in those hearts where Christ reigns it becomes the temple of the Lord, the church of the most high. And in those hearts where the spirit lies and dwells it is the temple of the Lord, the church of the most high.

My 2 cents anyway.

Omnia SG

In my view, Protestantism is a heresy so I would view all churches that came out of the reformation as heretical. Put it another way, they do not have the fullness of the Christian faith but only portions of it. You will only find the fullness of the truth of the Christian faith in the Catholic Church.

As to the question of salvation outside the Catholic Church, its catechism states,

"Those who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience - those too may achieve eternal salvation." - CCC 847

And with regards to non-Catholic Christians, the catechism teaches,

"The Church knows that she is joined in many ways to the baptized who are honored by the name of Christian, but do not profess the Catholic faith in its entirety or have not preserved unity or communion under the successor of Peter." Those "who believe in Christ and have been properly baptized are put in a certain, although imperfect, communion with the Catholic Church."^{..." - CCC
838}

So yes, my understanding is that as with Catholics, non-Catholic Christians may also achieve eternal salvation, but only if they leave this world in God's friendship (as with Catholics), no 'once saved always saved' nonsense that seem so fashionable amongst some non-Catholic Christians.

Creation1656 SG

Originally posted by Omnia:

Hi Omnia, thanks for sharing your catholic faith with me. i have many questions; how a catholic gain the friendship of his God? By obeying the 10 commandment? Is the 10 commandment still applicable today, to catholics? What is sin, as defined by the catholic church?.

If i am not mistaken, the catholic (or universal) church, claims to have an unbroken line of succession form the first pope, St. Peter. My question is, has the priesthood of St. Peter, under the catholic church, replaced the Aaronic priesthood?. What is the official position of the catholic church on this question?

Omnia SG

God's Friendship - At baptism, God washes away all of our sins. We are filled with the sanctifying grace of God and become 'new creations' - God has given us his graces to do good and to avoid sin. However, weak as we are, we do succumb to temptation and sin. Less serious sins (what we call venial sins) diminishes God's grace in our hearts but sins of grave matter which we commit with full knowledge and deliberate consent (what we call mortal sins) destroy God's grace in our hearts.

To restore sanctifying grace into our hearts, we repent of our mortal sins and confess them to a priest who represents Jesus Christ and who forgives us of our sins in his name. God is always waiting for sinners, ever willing to pour his graces on us, if we but repent when we sin and accept his love and graces.

Sin - The Catechism of the Catholic Church (CCC 1850) defines sin as "an offense against God ... Sin sets itself against God's love for us and turns our hearts away from it. Like the first sin, it is disobedience, a revolt against God through the will to become "like gods," ... Sin is thus "love of oneself even to contempt of God." In this proud self- exaltation, sin is diametrically opposed to the obedience of Jesus, which achieves our salvation."

Ten Commandments - The ten commandments continue to be valid today and we need to obey them. Breaking them is a grave sin. But we obey the ten commandments not because they were commanded by the Law of Moses (that law is not binding on non-Jews and Jesus had come to fulfill the law) but because the ten commandments have elements of the natural law which God has written in the hearts of men (Rom 2:15).

Priesthood - The Aaronic priesthood has been replaced by Jesus Christ, our new perfect high priest and mediator between God and man. Jesus instituted a new priesthood which shares in that mediation. And yes, St Peter and the other apostles passed on their offices to other bishops who passed on their offices to other bishops, all the way till today. The bishops of the Catholic Church (and that of the Eastern Orthodox Churches) are successors of the apostles and the bishop of Rome (a.k.a. the pope) is the successor of St Peter.

God bless and Happy Easter !

Disclaimer: I have tried to convey the teachings and positions of the Catholic Church as accurately as I can but I am not infallible. Other catholics should feel free to correct me if I have mis-represented any Church teachings.

Creation1656 SG

Originally posted by Omnia:

Thanks Omnia, i now have a better understanding of the catholic faith. In Genesis 26:5; Hashem gave Abraham his Commandments and Laws. Is this set of Laws and Commandments which were given to Abraham the same Laws and commandments that were given to Moses in the year 2448 after creation? Has Jesus fulfilled this sets of Laws and Commandments that were given to Abraham?

"I will multiply your descendants as the stars of heaven, and will give your descendants all these lands; and by your descendants all the nations of the earth shall be blessed; because Abraham obeyed Me and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes and My laws." So Isaac lived in Gerar Genesis 26:4-6 NASB.

Creation1656 SG

Originally posted by Omnia:

If the Aaronic priesthood has been replaced by the priesthood of Jesus, can the prophecy of Ezekiel, that the third temple will be built and the Aaronic priesthood restored to Isreal together with animals sacrifices, comes to pass?

"But the Levitical priests, the sons of Zadok, who kept charge of My sanctuary when the sons of Israel went astray from Me, shall come near to Me to minister to Me; and they shall stand before Me to offer Me the fat and the blood," declares the Lord GOD. Ezekiel 44:15 NASB.