It is wrong to say Buddha is not existing after passing

last SG · 2012-01-04T14:57:39+00:00

Buddha exists surely, presupposing one is on an inward journey and willing to disappear cos the Buddha is in all of us, it merely needs recognising. The mind...

An Eternal Now SG

If there is the right pointing, right understanding and right contemplation, then with nian fo as an aid one can achieve realization. But if you just chant alone, I don't see it is possible if one does not have right understanding to attain realization. As said before other religions also do chanting but they don't attain enlightenment. Chanting alone is a form of shamatha which leads to samadhi, but if devoid of right view and contemplation as in vipasyana aspect like kong1－guan1，realization wont arise as chanting remains as a purely shamatha technique.

My point is, self-view can only be eradicated through realization. You pointed out about enlightenment in pure land which I do believe is valid, however that is more of other-power, relying on amitabha to attain rebirth and thereby awaken there.

Aik TC SG

Sutta MN 117 The Great Forty is about the Eight Fold Noble Path, i.e. The Fourth Noble Truth, which is the way that leads to the cessation of suffering. The sutta begins by stating what constituted Wrong Views, listing not believing in the efficacy of Kamma, Rebirth, and not believing in Enlightened Beings as wrong views. We can group these people as the Atheists, Nihilists, Sceptics, Determinists and some believers of certain Theistic religions.

At first glance, one may be also intrigued by the term not believing in ‘nothing sacrificed’ as wrong view, which would imply the sacrifice of living beings such as animals. One can find in DN5 Kutadanta Sutta what are considered right and wrong sacrifices. Here, right sacrifices are offerings that are bloodless and does not involved the taking of lives.

On what is Right Views, there is the Mundane Right View with effluents, i.e. kamma forming that lead to better rebirth and the Right View that is Supramundane that lead one to the cessation of Suffering, the Third Noble Truth.

There are many repetitions on the phase ‘Of those, right view is the forerunner’ This goes to show how important it is to start our practice and understanding of the Blessed One teachings on the right footing from the very beginning to ensure it does not lead us the wrong way, away from the path of the realization of the cessation of suffering.

sinweiy SG

should got more indepth knowledge to the other power and nianfo method from the teaching of Master Shan Tao or Master Oyi that equal to 念佛即是无上深妙禅 (to do with sudden awakening and that it's also a form of insight meditation).

持名念佛与止观是完全可以一致的。因为一句佛号蓦直念去，杂念不起便是止；一句佛号心念耳听，明明历历便是观。

2009novice SG

Just a sharing... nothing definitive.

It can be said that we ourselve and collectively as a human civilisation has brought this onto ourselve.

Put it simply... excessive activities fuelled by desire (including work, socialising, entertainment etc) is bad for spiritual progress. However, this is also our own karmic condition and is blameless.

Best is to find sometime to be alone to clear off excessive desires.

thx... suddenly recalled - 放下万缘

but i have a friend who have to work till late night- quite frequently... i guess he has no time to do homework

Dharmadhatu SG

indeed. it is like the repetitiveness of sutra helps instill right view.

since many years ago, thusness tell me to summarize what i have learnt often as it helps me instill right view, and said this is an important factor that contributed to my experience and insight

by writing your own summary of right dharma understanding you are strengthening re inforcing right understanding

reading, learning, also has the same effect

yes, i should follow your example and sometimes write summaries of my own understanding in my journal. Thanks!

Dharmadhatu SG

Just a sharing... nothing definitive.

It can be said that we ourselve and collectively as a human civilisation has brought this onto ourselve.

Best is to find sometime to be alone to clear off excessive desires.

yes, time spent alone is very helpful to me! In fact i needed alot of time alone to reflect and practice to offload the years of low-grade anxieties and other habitual patterns that i had implanted into myself from the earlier part of my life. I attribute my time alone and practices and readings done during that time to be one major factor that helped me to become ripe and interested enough to tackle the important questions of insight into reality... the present pace of life in current society is extremely unconducive to spiritual progress in my opinion, even though we should try our best to remain mindful and to simplify our commitments and activities.

2009novice SG

forgot to answer 2009novice's main question:

having righr view does not mean you are liberated or awakened.

if your right view remains conceptual and inferred, maybe through reasoning and faith, that is essential as a factor for awakening, but is not awakening yet

if you are awakened by not just inferrential or conceptual understanding of anatta and emptiness but through a direct experiential realization of it, the least is you become a stream enterer

a stream enterer eradicated self view but has not eradicated other defilements or afflictions like anger, craving, etc

as you progress through the stages you will progressively eliminate the rest of the fetters or afflictions and attain complete liberation

thx... erm ok last not to appear draggy- if a person read a book about 4 noble truth but he/she also appreciates it (体会) it... can it be considered as realization...?

Eradicated self view sounds abit complicated yet... most books impart knowledge but to have eradicated self view is another thing...

An Eternal Now SG

The four noble truths consist of suffering, the cause of suffering, the cessation of suffering (nirvana) and the path that ends suffering (noble eightfold path).

If you say realize, does that mean he realized nirvana and completed his noble eightfold path? I think highly unlikely.

It is more likely that by inference and faith, he accepted the four noble truths. You need faith in the Buddha in other to practice 4nt, you need faith there is such a thing as nirvana otherwise why practice?

If through contemplating 4nt he realized impermanence, no-self and dependent origination and become a stream entrant, that can be considered as realization. But even that cannot be considered as complete realization of the four noble truths. Only an arahant and Buddha can say that.

An Eternal Now SG

@dharmadhatu: don’t forget to share with us anything you think might help others Smile

An Eternal Now SG

Some good posts by Namdrol:

Causes and effects are not the same, nor are they different.

The mind that takes rebirth is not as same as the previous mind nor is it different.

This is the reason why it is possible for sentients beings to experience serial rebirth through the appropriation of an infinite series of new physical bodies over time, relatively speaking.

By saying that there is no actual rebirth, one is committing oneself to a metaphysical position called ucchedavada i.e. annihilationism. Commiting oneself to the position that there is an actual self, person, or entity that is reborn is called śāśvatavāda, eternalism.

But when one understands that one instant of mind is neither the same nor different than the next instant of mind; since they are not the same, one avoids śāśvatavāda; and since they are not different, one avoids ucchedavada — thus one can understand the truth of rebirth, karma and its result, and dependent origination in the manner in which the Buddha intended and leave off the metaphysical speculations that plague non-Buddhists about such issues. One can then also understand that since the mind has no beginning, it never arose; and since it never arose, it never ceases.

The meaning of the heart sutra is very simple—it is about the inseparability of samsara and nirvana. That is simple, but it is also profound.

Aik TC SG

If through contemplating 4nt he realized impermanence, no-self and dependent origination and become a stream entrant that can be considered as realization. But even that cannot be considered as complete realization of the four noble truths. Only an arahant and Buddha can say that.

In one of right concentration, right knowledge... In one of right knowledge, right release comes into being. Thus the learner is endowed with eight factors, and the arahant with ten. - MN117

An Eternal Now SG

The learner has all aspects of the eightfold path but has not brought it to perfection, therefore has not attained nirvana, and therefore the four noble truths has not been fully realized.

sinweiy SG

Some good posts by Namdrol:

Causes and effects are not the same, nor are they different.

The mind that takes rebirth is not as same as the previous mind nor is it different.

This is the reason why it is possible for sentients beings to experience serial rebirth through the appropriation of an infinite series of new physical bodies over time, relatively speaking.

The meaning of the heart sutra is very simple—it is about the inseparability of samsara and nirvana. That is simple, but it is also profound.

right on.

sinweiy SG

But when one understands that one instant of mind is neither the same nor different than the next instant of mind; since they are not the same, one avoids eternalism ; and since they are not different, one avoids annihilationism — thus one can understand the truth of rebirth, karma and its result, and dependent origination in the manner in which the Buddha intended and leave off the metaphysical speculations that plague non-Buddhists about such issues. One can then also understand that since the mind has no beginning, it never arose; and since it never arose, it never ceases.

what's mean by "understands that one instant of mind is neither the same nor different" ?

imagine the film strips that have around 24 films per second. from our human eyes, if u compare two films side by side, they "almost" look identical, but they are not really identical, "slightly" different. it's an illusion.

let alone 65 moments in a single finger snap (which works out to about three milliseconds per mind moment!) we are mostly unaware of what is going on in our minds. -Thubten Yeshe

佛在《仁王经》上讲, 一弹指六十刹那,一刹那九百生灭'。这种说法是方便说,不是真实说。真实说,一刹那是不思议的生灭。佛经讲‘不生不灭',其实是生灭的

。《仁王经》上，佛举例子告诉我们，他说一弹指有六十刹那，一刹那裡面有九百生灭。这是世尊教学的时候给我们一个粗浅的概念，如果比起弥勒菩萨所说的差距很大。佛说一弹指六十刹那，一刹那九百生灭，六十乘九百，弥勒菩萨告诉我们这一弹指有多少个生灭？三百二十兆，数目更大。(转自学佛网：http://www.xuefo.net/nr/article9/93744.html)

Maitreya said it even more about 320 000000000000 instant of mind per snap of a finger!

Fugazzi SG

Muse over this

What is permanent is truth (not dictionary meaning but existential truth). One is only experiencing relative truth and it will remain so as long as one is IDENTIFIED with one’s mind and body. It has been erroneously assumed to be the absolute truth, there is no truth, only truth that is relative to what is perceived,. why so? When one walks on the road, and falls down on the pavement, only then is the pavement a reality to him/her. Before that. it did not exist. It was always there but only became a reality when it was perceived by the one who fell down. The pavement does not call out to say I exist. The one who fell down thru his/her perception gave it existence. Eg, stock market crashes, it has only relevance for someone in the banking or .. Would it have relevance for a village peasant? Will the mountain goats be affected by the stock market crash? As such, ‘reality’ remains a mere psychological experience for many, it is only existential when it really happens to that person in a given situation and is always relative to one’s conditioning and so on so forth. One has to reconcile or at least understand that one could be confused or simply not know.

Also, many assume that they exist in the mind or the body. The mind and the body exist in the source. The source cannot be found outside of onself. It is an inward journey and as long as there is no longing in one’s heart (love) to merge with the source (eg God, jesus, Mohd, Buddha heart soul soul, enligthenment, awakening) one has settled for mediocrity. The mind cannot use logic to get inside – cos the mind is a limitation, it does not exist. it is a bundle of thoughts. can one find one’s mind?

To know God, to know Jesus to know Krishna – one has to ‘die’ – by that is meant die to the roles and be empty of …. By that ‘dying’ to roles, it is not meant that someone has to reject roles; accept and fulfil the roles but dont bring it home. By home is meant source (aka God, Jesus, Mohd, Buddha heart, soul, enligthenment, awakening) and one is always being a clean slate (emptiness). It is always being open to possibilities. However, the human mind cannot accept uncertainty and hence it is content with certainty and thus unwilling to risk enquiring and being resistant to this willingness is akin to riding a stationary bicycle.

PS – With any practice one’s mind is involved. For eg when i say ’’I meditate or practice ..’’ As long as this questioning(#) does not arise and that is: for what and for whom , the mind is at play and the meditation that is practised is to most likely reach/attain a goal. Any goal, any craving, any desire does not emanate from one’s being (presence or present) but from dipping into the past aka knwoledge, books, someone, sutras, texts and …. it cannot be from the present or presence of the moment. If one maintains this stance of practising without the (#) one is alreadly futurizing and one may reach/attain to that desired goal or … cos it is now herenow; the practice is to get something that is not already here.

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