Soul Retrieval

sinweiy SG

I thought Buddha said no self hence no soul. the belief in a soul is as old as belief in god. believing in a soul is a fallacy, same with the concept of god. there is no such thing as you, me or Buddha, hence where is the soul to begin with?

if your notion is moving toward the corresponding of Nothingness, than it's not the right view of Buddhism too.

Jacky Woo SG

if your notion is moving toward the corresponding of Nothingness, than it's not the right view of Buddhism too.

did I imply its nothingness? emptiness is not nothingness

Dharmadhatu SG

Hi,

I think, Soul retreival as a term is quite misleading. IMO, this process is about reconnecting with disconnected energies from the subtle energy forms. These energies can be in elemental forms that consists of personalities or rather mental tendencies.

Still, i think can be a tricky and dangerous practice. Before i came back to Buddhism, i was experimenting with more new age stuff. I have an experience of dark-force entity interference pretending to be soul retreival. One got to be very careful. That episode of attack last for an entire month 24/7. Hellish and no fun ..

In the Bon tradition i think they utilise traditional goddesses of the elements.

For your experience, how did you manage to fend off that provocation in the end?

After realisation, would there still be entity attacks/attachments?

Do you seriously believe in the 'barriers are harmful' theory in that soul-healer site?

Dharmadhatu SG

Hi,

Just a sharing and certainly open to possible discrepencies :)

I also read up a little bit about the 5 elements and also Chinese astrology and Bazi. TheTibetan 5 element and the Chinese 5 Element is slightly different. In the Tibetan system, there is an element of Space, of which there is no Chinese equvalent... and the Chinese element make a distinction of one of the Tibetan element into 2 different aspects.

Nevertheless, if a persons chart is very balanced with regards to the elements, the life experience will be generally smooth without much up and down (apart from larger forces at work that can overide the individual elemental composition). These elements and their interplay are reflective of one's karmic tendences and potential karma manifestation (ripening).

IMO, what is useful about understanding the element composition is that it is reflective of our personality or karmic tendencies. For example, if a persons composition has too much Earth, then the personality may become more stubborn and less receptive to changes. If a person's natal chart has a lot of water, then he/she may be more emotional but also highly intelligent. By looking at the elemental composition, we can see what are our karmic habits and those are the areas that need to be worked on to clear the defilements.

These terms for the elements such as Earth, Fire, Water, Air (Wood in Chinese Astrology) are not literal. These are symbolic of dynamics that is roughly corresponding to the physical aspect that is being used to describe them. For example, the subtle expression of Earth is not physical Earth, etc.

The elements have higher and lower expressions. For example, the lower expression of Earth is stubbornness, difficulty in seeing from a different perspective, etc. The higher expression of Earth is stability of experience. The lower expression of Fire is anger, enthusiam. The higher expression of Fire is bliss.

In the most ideal situation, all the elements are fully balanced. Fully Enlightened Beings are said to have fully balanced elements operating in their highest expressions.

Most of us un-enlightened Beings are operating from the lower expressions of the elements.

In my thinking, there may also be a link between the five elements and the five dhyani buddha families and five wisdoms.

simpo_ SG

In the Bon tradition i think they utilise traditional goddesses of the elements.

For your experience, how did you manage to fend off that provocation in the end?

After realisation, would there still be entity attacks/attachments?

Do you seriously believe in the 'barriers are harmful' theory in that soul-healer site?

In the Bon tradition i think they utilise traditional goddesses of the elements.

1. In the past, i followed new age soul retreival, dangerous and unreliable...

For your experience, how did you manage to fend off that provocation in the end?

2. The provocation die down on its own.

After realisation, would there still be entity attacks/attachments?

3. Initial Realisation is a different matter from entity attack. But it gives one the added confidence not to be that easily distracted. Don't think of it as anything different from a physical person abusing you.

Do you seriously believe in the 'barriers are harmful' theory in that soul-healer site?

4. Sorry can't find the barrier are harmful theory. I haven't read the site's content for a very long time. I suggested Souldivine to the site because i don't think he is ready or interested in real enlightenment path, but this info gives him something beneficial to work on that is more inline with his intended purpose. Once a person have understood no-self and emptiness, there are paradigm shifts that make these kind of work feels likes working with illusions... like bluffing oneself.

Dharmadhatu SG

After realisation, would there still be entity attacks/attachments?

I was thinking along the lines of... after realisation, there should be no more clear delineation of good and bad, negative or positive like in the songs of Milarepa.

Therefore when any provocations come, how would a realised person deal or perceive it...

Do you seriously believe in the 'barriers are harmful' theory in that soul-healer site?

i see.

simpo_ SG

I was thinking along the lines of... after realisation, there should be no more clear delineation of good and bad, negative or positive like in the songs of Milarepa.

Therefore when any provocations come, how would a realised person deal or perceive it...

i see.

Ideally, the disturbances should be seen within the framework of non-dual and empty (holographic). Under such a level of mastery everything will seems to be occuring within a non-dual, luminous, empty, transparent 'space'.

However, i have yet to reach such a level of mastery in a stable manner. But it can be seem that this is the way to go... instead of dealing it as something solid and objectified.

This is also the way that healing(including soul-retreviel) will progress towards after realisations.

SoulDivine SG

I am not sure what how each you handle with negative astral entities (refering soul fragments/ghosts) when you do encounter them. Personally, I do have a "standard procedure" which I suggest.

1. First, you will need to have non-dual perception. Meaning, you should not judge people/astral entities as good/evil, right/wrong. You also should not judge emotions as something that need to be suppressed or denied. If an astral entity comes to you, it means either you have done something that attract their attention or you have what it takes to help them move on.

2. If possible, try to ask them questions like : "What is your name?" "Why are you here?" "How can I help?". For me, there is no need to ask how they feel because I can sense how they are feeling. Commonly, they come with either one of these 3 types of emotions: very sad, very angry or very scared.

3. Attempt to accept them, forgive them and release them to the light. This is the most compassionate thing you can do to help them move on. Whether it will work or not, I think it depends on whether they like/agree with you or not.

4. If they just come and surprise attack suddenly without giving you a chance to talk, jump to step 5 immediately. In this kind of situation, you will panic and the worst case scenario is that they will attempt to possess your body. You will know you are being possess when you become paralyse or lose control of your astral body. Since they are astral entities, they can only attack your astral body or your mind, and lucky so far, I have not received any physical injuries due to astral entities attack.

5. Last resort, really cannot resolve by yourself. Call for help from higher beings -http://www.rainbowjigsaw.com/2011/03/creatorsourcegod-speaks-exorcism.html
Guan Yin also will/may help you http://www.rainbowjigsaw.com/2010/03/kuan-yin-speaks-space-clearing-ghosts.html

6. Lastly, not all ghosts that you encounter are really soul fragments. Some are just thought forms created by some intelligent beings with the intention to attack/disturb you. These type, you can just ignore them completely and they will eventually go away.

Hope this helps.

simpo_ SG

I am not sure what how each you handle with negative astral entities (refering soul fragments/ghosts) when you do encounter them. Personally, I do have a "standard procedure" which I suggest.

Hope this helps.

Hi Souldivine,

Thanks for your sharing :)

simpo_ SG

1. First, you will need to have non-dual perception. Meaning, you should not judge people/astral entities as good/evil, right/wrong. You also should not judge emotions as something that need to be suppressed or denied. If an astral entity comes to you, it means either you have done something that attract their attention or you have what it takes to help them move on.

There is a need to clarify the different meanings of the term non-duality.

It has been discussed so many times that i think it should be a stickied topic :)

Non-duality can be used to describe 'no right or wrong' aka being non-judgemental. Because when we can come to a state of non-judgementalness, the mind is not agitated and is thus peaceful, there is often a misconception that this is the state of enlightenment. But this is not entirely correct.

Non-duality that is used to describe enlightenment is the realisation and experience of 'no subject/object division'. Subject-object division refers to the typical impression that there is a 'me/self' and there are things outside 'me/self' which the 'me/self' experiences. 'No subject/objection division' thus is the experience where this typical impression does not applies.

By the time someone realises no-self, he/she would have firstly realised non-duality (no subject/object division). If in experiencing events, there is no 'me' in the experience, then there is only the 'being observed'. In the words of Buddha: "In seeing, there is just seeing. No seer and nothing seen. In hearing, there is just hearing. No hearer and nothing heard."

Therefore, there is a need to understand the various meanings of non-duality in order to avoid misunderstanding and misinterpretation.

Dharmadhatu SG

There is a need to clarify the different meanings of the term non-duality.

It has been discussed so many times that i think it should be a stickied topic :)

Therefore, there is a need to understand the various meanings of non-duality in order to avoid misunderstanding and misinterpretation.

yes, true!

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