((( In the beginning or Beginning-less ))) ?!??

sophia SG

The Root of Time
(Selected Dialoues from the 'Milindapanha')

King Milinda said:" Revered Nagasena,what is the root of past time,future
time and persent time?"

"The root of past time,future time and present time,sire,is
ignorance.
As conditioned by ignorance are kammic formation,conditioned by
kammic formations is coinsciousness,conditioned by consciousness is mind
-and-matter,conditioned by mind-matter are the six sence bases,conditioned
by the six senses bases is contact,conditioned by contact is
feeling,conditioned by feeling is craving,conditioned by craving is
clinging,conditioned by clinging is becoming,conditioned by becoming is birth
,conditioned by birth there come into existence old age and death,sorrow,
lamentation,pain,grief and despair.Thus the earliest point of this whole time
cannot be shown."

"You are dexterous,revered nagasena."

p's To be continued soon... Embarassed

An Eternal Now SG

Venerable Nagasena was a very skilful debater. He had converted the Greek King Milinda into renouncing, and eventually attaining Enlightenment. That was during 80 B.C, 400 years after Buddha’s Parinirvana.

sophia SG

Chicken or Egg First?

King Milinda said:" Revered Nagasena,as to that which you mentioned-the earliest-point cannot be shown-make a simile for that."

"As,sire,an egg comes from a hen and a hen from an egg from a hen-is there
thus an end of this series?"
"There is not,revered sir."
"Even so,sire,the earliest point of time cannot be shown either."
"Make a further simile"

Venerable Nagasena traced a circle on the ground and asked King Milinda:"
Isthere end of this circle,sire?"
"There is not,revered sir?"
"Even so.sire,are those circles spoken of by the blessed one:"Eye-
consciouness arises because of eye and visible forms;the meeting of the
three is contact;conditoned by contact is feelings;conditioned by feeling is
craving is;conditioned by craving is karma and eye is born again from
karma.Is there thus an end of this series?"

"There is not,revered sir."

'And,sire,the same applies ot ear-consciousness,ear and sounds;nose-
consciousness,nose and smell;tongue-consciouness,tougue and tastes;
body and touch;mind-consciousness arises because of mind and mental
object;the meeting of the three is contact;conditioned by craving is
feeling;conditioned by feeling is craving;conditioned by craving is karma
and mind is born again from karma'.

"Is there thus an end of this series?"

"There is not,revered sir.'

"Even so,sire,the earliest point of the time cannot be shown either."

"You are dexterous,revered Nagasena."

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

p's To be Continued Embarassed

sophia SG

The Myth of the beginning of time

String theory suggests that the big bang was not the origin of the universe but simply the outcome of a preexisting state
By Gabriele Veneziano

Was the big bang really the beginning of time? Or did the universe exist before then? Such a question seemed almost blasphemous only a decade ago. Most cosmologists insisted that it simply made no sense--that to contemplate a time before the big bang was like asking for directions to a place north of the North Pole. But developments in theoretical physics, especially the rise of string theory, have changed their perspective. The pre-bang universe has become the latest frontier of cosmology.
The new willingness to consider what might have happened before the bang is the latest swing of an intellectual pendulum that has rocked back and forth for millennia. In one form or another, the issue of the ultimate beginning has engaged philosophers and theologians in nearly every culture. It is entwined with a grand set of concerns, one famously encapsulated in an 1897 painting by Paul Gauguin: D'ou venons-nous? Que sommes-nous? Ou allons-nous? "Where do we come from? What are we? Where are we going?" The piece depicts the cycle of birth, life and death--origin, identity and destiny for each individual--and these personal concerns connect directly to cosmic ones. We can trace our lineage back through the generations, back through our animal ancestors, to early forms of life and protolife, to the elements synthesized in the primordial universe, to the amorphous energy deposited in space before that. Does our family tree extend forever backward? Or do its roots terminate? Is the cosmos as impermanent as we are?

http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?articleID=00042F0D-1A0E-1085-94F483414B7F0000

An Eternal Now SG

Everytime we speak about the Big Bang, we just don’t know what caused the Big Bang. Even the scientists can’t be sure. Therefore ultimately, we can only say, ‘conditioned arising’, ‘dependant origination’, (the teachings of Emptiness) – in line with Buddhist teachings/Nagasena’s debate.

sophia SG

WHICH CREATION STORY?
Rev. James W. Watkins

Creationists call us to believe the Biblical creation story as a literal account of historical events. However, Genesis contains two distinctly different creation accounts. Which creation story are they calling us to "literally" believe?

For generations, serious students of Scripture have noted stark divisions and variations in the age of the Hebrew, its style and language within Genesis. As we have it now, Genesis is actually a composite of three written primary sources, each with its own character, favorite words and distinctly different names for God. Such differences all but evaporate when translated into English, but they are clear in the ancient Hebrew text.

http://www.sullivan-county.com/identity/2cs.htm

X-Mind SG

Taoist's theology
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Possible according to mathematics:

2o>>>21>>>22>>>23>>>24>>>25>>>26......2n

Similarity to Yi Jing:

Oneness Matrix(Tai Chi)>>>Yin/Yang>>>4gua>>>8 gua>>>18 gua>>>32 gua>>>64gua

Thus Thirty-two realms evolved, exclusive Three Pristine realms(Three Pure Ones),and Da Lou Realm.

In additional,Three pistine realms,and the Da Lou Realm.

Thus Thirty-six realms in the Taoist religion.

Why not begin think of how life works?

Mr. Green

sophia SG

The Process of The Creation of the World

Universal Cycles, or Kalpas1

The notion of Universal Cycles is an important concept in Daoist Cosmogony. A single universal Cycle is said to last from Cosmogony till its destruction. The concept of Universal Cycles originated in India. The universe is an endless process of repeating Cycles; each Cycle has a beginning and an end. After the end of a Cycle, the universe falls into darkness and everything in the universe is destroyed. Only the most accomplished of the Immortals2 are able to survive the end-of-cycle apocalypse. At that point, a new Cycle will begin. Major universal Cycles are themselves made up of minor cyles. The major universal Cycles are named 'Dragon Han'3 , 'Extended Well-Being'4 , 'Crimson Light'5 , etc. ; these Cycles have followed each other in succession since aeons ago. We cannot know how many Cycles there have been in the past.

The Appearing of the Crimson Light

After the end of a Cycle, the universe plunges into a period of darkness, in which the mighty Diamond Wind6 blows through a world of chaos, a space of infinite emptiness and absolute darkness in which no light, no form, no image is to be found. Even the Vital Breaths of Dao7 are shrouded in complete darkness. It is then time for the new birth and growth of nature, and the new cycle of Crimson Light will begin. The stage is set for the new life of the universe. This is called "The Appearing of the Crimson Light". The space-time in which we presently live is part of the cycle of Crimson Light.

The Root of the World: The Crimson and JadeCharacters

At this point, the Vital Breaths of Dao gather together, and an octagonal Book suddenly appears out of the void. Each character in the Book is about 12 feet long, with rays of light streaming forth from the eight corners of the Book. When these rays are seen by the Primeval Lord of Heaven8 , He knows the time has come to inaugurate a new Cycle. At this point, He places the Jade Characters into the Forges of Heaven, until they begin to emit crimson rays of light. Thus they are called the Crimson Characters. The Crimson and Jade Characters9 are the source of the Heavens, and are called the 'Original Matrix'10 . The Crimson Characters are in fact the Root of the world. Thus the Book of Salvation11 says: "The Crimson Characters of the Grotto of Chaos12 are the Word of Essential Truth arising from the Absolute Void. At the very beginning of the Cycle, it forms the Cosmos and makes the Sun, the Moon and the Stars send forth their light. It is the origin of the Heavens. It has no ancestor; its essence is of Dao."

The Emergence of the Thirty-Two Heavens out of the Original Matrix

The Heavenly Matrix formed out of the Crimson Book of Jade Characters, is called the Original Matrix. It weaves itself in all directions, forming thirty-two heavens. The World is hence created, and a new Cycle has begun. Taking note, the Primeval Lord of Heaven opens the Perfect Script of the Five Divine Tablets14 , leading to the formation of the various spirits. At the same time, the Lord exercises His power to ensure the long life of the heavens of the new Cycle. Thirty-two heavens are thus created and maintained; if we add the Three Pristine Heavens15 , there are a total of thirty-five Vital Breaths of Dao. These Energies are derived from the Vital Breath of the Highest Origin16.

Salvation by the inauguration of a new Cycle

At the beginning of each Cycle, the Primeval Lord of Heaven reveals Scriptures and teaches the Way, disseminating scriptures on Dao, saving all the people under heaven. Individuals who, owing to spiritual affinity, attain salvation, may join the ranks of the Immortals. These are able to survive the apocalypse at the end of the Cycle, and enjoy eternal life. The Scriptures revealed from within a Sacred Pearl by the Primeval Lord of Heaven at the beginning of the Cycle, are the most mysterious of all Dao Scriptures.

http://www.eng.taoism.org.hk/daoist-beliefs/cosmogony/pg2-2-1-2.asp

sophia SG

Formation of the Daoist Theory of Universal Evolution

Fundamental Difference Between the Daoist Theory of Universal Evolution and the Christian Concept of the Creation by God

The question of whether the universe has always existed as it does now is a most interesting, but also most perplexing one. Countless are those who, over the past thousands of years, have deeply pondered over this question and formulated what they considered to be the best answer, some going so far as to elaborate wonderful theories on the subject. Nonetheless, until today no consensus has emerged. Contemporary opinion tends to consider that the universe had a beginning, and that this beginning was a stage in the evolution of the universe -- looking at the universe as a whole, it has neither an absolute beginning nor an absolute end. Daoist Cosmogony has proposed a similar view of the universe for the past two thousand years. This theory of universal evolution is radically different from the Christian theory of the Creation of the universe by God. Daoism considers that universal evolution follows its own laws and is not the product of divine creation. Rather, it is the product of Spontaneous1 evolution under the control of the Great Dao2. The highest divinity of Daoism, the Primeval Lord of Heaven3, emerged during the evolutionary process, which he helps to push forward according to the circumstances. On the other hand, Christianity considers that God created the world out of absolute nothingness.

Initial speculations on the origin of the universe

Early on, Laozi had reflected on the origin of the universe. He considered that Heaven and Earth have not existed indefinitely. Dao preceded the formation of Heaven and Earth. The process of the generation of Heaven and Earth by Dao is resumed in the following formula: <> In other words, Dao generated the primeval unified whole, which divided into two opposing forces, whose interpenetration generated all beings. The two forces referred to by Laozi as the 'Two' are commonly considered to be designate Heaven and Earth. Later on, other Daoist theorists further reflected on the origin of the world and formulated systematic theories. These were discussed in the scripture The Source of Dao4, which points out that before the formation of Heaven and Earth, there was nothing but limitless dark space, in which nothing existed. There was only Essential Vital Breath5 and Vital Breath of Spirit6 circulating everywhere. These Essential and Spiritual Vital Breaths refer to different functions of Dao, which formed the world and the myriad beings.

The complete description of the origin of the universe began in the Wei and Jin dynasties

Ge Hong, the famous accomplished Daoist and reputed astronomer of the Jin dynasty, made an important contribution to Daoist Cosmogony. In his Inner Book of the Master Who Embraces Simplicity7, he considered the concept of 'Mystery'8, and its effect on the formation of Heaven and Earth. In his later years as a hermit on Mt. Luohu, he wrote the important work The Book of Pillow Secrets9 in which he discussed the 'most sublime root' and pointed out that before the formation of the world, the original chaos was like an egg, inside which was Perfect Man Pangu who called himself the King of Primeval Heaven10. As the universal egg grew larger in its initial stages, he grew larger inside it. At the formation of the world, the light elements rose upwards to form Heaven and the heavy elements descended to form Earth, while the King of Primordial Heaven resided on Jade Capital Mountain11 in the centre of Heaven. Later on, other spirits, men and animals were formed. Ge Hong's theory was later developed into a systematic Cosmogony. At about the same time, the Highest Clarity sect12 also reflected on the question of the origin and structure of the universe. Around the end of the Eastern Jin, the grandson of Ge Hong's brother, Ge Caofu, wrote a large number of scriptures, amongst which the Numinous Treasure's Lofty and Sublime Book of the Limitless Salvation of Mankind13 and other writings fully described the process of the formation of the world. Subsequently, the Book of the Supreme Venerable Sovereign's Opening of the Heavens14 appeared, which also discussed the question of the creation of Heaven and Earth.

http://www.eng.taoism.org.hk/daoist-beliefs/cosmogony/pg2-2-1-1.asp

sophia SG

Vishnu Resting

In Hinduism, Vishnu is the deity responsible for maintaining the universe once created. The entire universe is periodically destroyed by fire and dissolved for a time into an infinite ocean. Vishnu rests upon this ocean until it is time for the universe to be re-emanated. In this illustration the god rests on the serpent Shesha, whose other function is to hold up the world. Vishnu is attended by his wife, Lakshmi, and the monkey-faced sage Narada. Brahma, the deity responsible for beginning the world in each cycle, rests on a lotus coming out of Vishnu's navel.

A Cosmogonic Hymn

The earliest and most basic of the Hindu scriptures is the Rgveda, usually dated to about 1500 B.C. This hymn tells of an original male (purusa) of a thousand heads, eyes, and feet, which the gods cut up to produce the world. This volume is the first complete printed version and the first complete critical edition of the Rgveda, by the German-English scholar Friedrich Max Müller (1823-1900).

http://www.loc.gov/exhibits/world/accounts.html

An Eternal Now SG

It is interesting to note that Buddhism also believes in the cyclic formation and destruction of the universe. Such cycles exist ad infinitum. However we do not suscribe to a personal God who creates the world, like Hinduism, but rather it is a natural occuring phenomena.

More info:

Beginning of our world:
http://www.jenchen.org.sg/vol7no1a.htm
http://www.jenchen.org.sg/vol7no2a.htm
http://www.jenchen.org.sg/vol7no3a.htm
End of our world:
http://www.jenchen.org.sg/vol8no2a.htm

Sutta reference: Agganna Sutta

sophia SG

Insan Kamel The Universal Being

Concerning the beginning of the spiritual creation.

The beginning of creation was fine dust, and the first existent in it is the Muhammadan reality of the Rahman. It is not contained in any place since it is not contained. From what did the world come into existence? It came into existence from the known reality which is described by neither existence nor non-existence. In what did it exist? It existed in fine dust. In what manner did it exist? It existed on the form known in the self of the Real. Why did it exist? It existed in order to manifest divine realities. What was its goal? Its goal was to be purified of mixture, so that every world would recognise its portion from its origin without mixture. So the goal of the world is to manifest its realities [i.e. the realities of the Real or the realities of creation], and recognition of the spheres of the Macrocosm from the world. In the usage of the [Sufi] community, it is whatever is other than man. The Microcosm, i.e. man, is the spirit, cause and reason for the world. The spheres of the world are its stations, movements and the separation of its classes. This is a summary of all that the chapter contains.

(Man is the Microcosm)

As man is the Microcosm by way of the body, so he is also inconsiderable due to his being in-time. Resembling the divine is valid for him since he is the khalif of Allah in the world and the world is subject to him, a vassal of the divine as man is a vassal of the divine.

Know that the most perfect formation of man is in this world. In the Next world, each man is in one of two parties based on equity in the state, not in knowledge. Each party knows its opposite state. So man is either believer or unbeliever. It is either happiness or misery, bliss or punishment, blessed or punished. Thus the recognition of this world is more complete although the manifestation (tajalli) of the Next world is more sublime. So understand! Open this lock! In this station, we have a symbol for whoever is clever and it is an ugly and disgusting expression whose meaning is beautiful and unprecedented:

http://nurmuhammad.com/NurNabi/concerningthebeginningspiritualcreation6.htm

water_rat SG

"In the beginning and Ending" from a blackhole in our element universe realm :

It is now believed that at the center of each galaxy there is a super-massive black hole that is millions to billions of times heavier than our sun. The massive black hole captures nearby stars and drags them into a swirling accretion disk. A "torus" in the inner accretion shields the black hole in those systems that are viewed edge on (which is probably the case for our galactic center). In many of these systems (which are called AGN = active galactic nucleus), a jet is ejected perpendicular to the disk and is seen in the optical and radio wavebands. In the very central regions the disk becomes so hot (tens of millions of degrees) that the emission is in the X-ray and Gamma-ray bands. This animation shows an artist's impression of the view from an approaching spaceship. The HEASARC data archives contain many observations of these systems made with orbiting X-ray and Gamma-ray observatories.

http://heasarc.gsfc.nasa.gov/docs/blackhole.html

water_rat SG

What is the nature of the mysterious dark energy which is accelerating expansion of the Universe?

Will the Universe Expand Forever?

Summary - (Aug 30, 2005) What is the nature of the mysterious dark energy which is accelerating expansion of the Universe? In a recent study published in the Physical Review Letters, physicists are proposing two scenarios: thawing and freezing. In thawing, the expansion of the Universe should eventually come to a stop, and maybe even reverse. In "freezing", the acceleration should continue indefinitely. A new mission: the Joint Dark Energy Mission (JDEM) has been proposed by NASA and the US Department of Energy, and should be able to determine which of these two scenarios is correct.

http://www.universetoday.com/am/publish/berkeley_scientists_test_dark_energy.html?3082005