Looking for spinner balls

solitary SG

Hi, anyone selling spinner balls?

tErI-yAkI SG

All Pro Shops in Singapore sell spinner balls.

Laughing

tErI-yAkI SG

Finally, the Super Classic is over.

Just when critics claim that spinners are on the verge of losing out to hook bowling, at last, spinners proved that wrong in this event.

5 spinners in the top-6 says a lot. Indeed, no surprise that a spinner won the event. It simply proves that spinners can still compete at the highest level.

Congrats to Tsai Ting-Yun for emerging as champion and pocket US$25,000.
Laughing

solarbody11 SG

Why all from Taiwan? Singapore also got spinners in the event right? Prove that Taiwan spinner better?

tErI-yAkI SG

I didn't say Taiwan spinner better.
I only mentioned that there's 5 spinners from the top 6.

3 Taiwanese, 1 Chinese, 1 Singaporean.

Laughing

harmzuay SG

I've always been of the opinion that whichever style of play comes out on top in any given event is more a reflection of the oil pattern laid down in said event, than the respective abilities of the bowlers. Cool

After all, most bowlers at that level are good some way or other, regardless of their choosen style of play.

tErI-yAkI SG

Agreed! Razz

Spinners are widely thought to be the weaker of the 2 styles. Of course, hook can be more consistent due to some bowling area zoning, while spinners have to be very precise in order to get a good shot.

In terms of ball weight, spinners also lose out. In many sense, spinners are at the disadvantage. The only advantage I can think of, is spinners can endure longer series.

But 1 thing we have to agree is that, hook bowlers can achieve monster avg like 240+, spinners will struggle to even hit that score every game.

Embarassed

harmzuay SG

In terms of ball weight, spinners also lose out. In many sense, spinners are at the disadvantage. The only advantage I can think of, is spinners can endure longer series.

I would not call a light ball spinner disadvantaged. But the general idea of the above paragraph is there. The difference in ball weights is due to:

Heavy ball bowlers who play a hook rely on pin carry to carry a strike. This means the ball must be heavy enough to not get knocked off its original direction whenever it hits a pin at the pin deck.
Hitting the pocket and leaving single/double pins are usually the result of a certain amount of ball deflection, hence losing pin carry.

On the other hand, spinners' bread and butter weapon is ball deflection.They want/need/require the ball to deflect and change direction once it contacts a pin. That is the reason they use a light ball.

A spinner's choice of ball weight is never due to weakness. I know a few spinners capable of throwing a decent hook with a heavy ball. They just prefer to spin a light ball.

I hope this helps. Twisted Evil

tErI-yAkI SG

Originally posted by harmzuay:

On the other hand, spinners' bread and butter weapon is ball deflection.They want/need/require the ball to deflect and change direction once it contacts a pin. That is the reason they use a light ball.

A spinner's choice of ball weight is never due to weakness. I know a few spinners capable of throwing a decent hook with a heavy ball. They just prefer to spin a light ball.

I hope this helps. Twisted Evil

Hi harmzuay,

Maybe I have put it the wrong way. However, I did not mean that spin bowlers are weak, and that's the reason why they choose to spin, and not hook the ball.

However, I meant that spin bowling is considered to be 'weaker' in terms of scores. And of course, the reasons are as we discussed above.

Yes, I agree with you with regards to the pin deflection / ball deflection theory. Like what I have said earlier on, if a spinner misses his target, then the chances of striking is very slim. However, since hook bowlers generally bowl area zoning, they will have a wider allowance for missing the intended target.

Cheers~ Laughing

tErI-yAkI SG

I think solitary is looking for 2nd hand spinner balls....

Seems that not many spinner balls in the market nowadays.

k4korny SG

correct me if i'm wrong.. I thought spinner balls are the same as normal balls except that the fingering is drilled differently?

If it is so, then if you're serious about learning spinner, you should get a ball custom made to your fingers/ hands.

harmzuay SG

Teriyaki

No problems. I knew what you mean. I was making a point for anyone else reading the thread, since there are so many new "faces" since my long break.

Spinners do have a reputation of traditionally shooting average scores that are 10-12 pins lower than that of heavy ball bowlers. However, I do believe that this "reputation" was spread over time by people who read it or heard it before. And since this more than likely originated in the states - where the bowling lanes are oiled a million times more than they are here in asia - this probably is not true in asia.

In fact, the average oiling in asia suits spinners more, IMO. Twisted Evil

About the question about how spinner equipment is drilled: spinner balls usually vary very little from normal balls because even branded balls at that weight have only a simple pancake weight block or the like.

And if you can afford your own gear, always get your ball custom fitted for your hand.

tErI-yAkI SG

Thanks man... Yeah.. I'm just trying to put the message across that spinners are losing out because of these aspects.

True, oiling patterns plays a major part in the scores. And in this Super Classic, as we all can see, somehow it favours the spinners. However, I believed all of us also noted that the oiling pattern is so damn bloody different from Singapore Nationals a couple of months back, where 6 or 7 perfect games were achieved. Incredible. But look, when $100,000 perfect game prize money is at stake, look what's the score? Haha...

Another example was in the Philippines Open. During Qualifying rounds, spinners were dominating. In the ABF Step-ladder stages. Unbelievable, all spinners, with the exception of Jennifer, were knocked out in the 1st round! If I'm not wrong, I think a female Chinese Taipei bowler even bowled a score of 120+. (By the way, Jennifer was also knocked out in the 2nd round).

I just think that, what a turn-around in a tournament, where spinners, esp from Chinese Taipei, were so dominant, until the knock-out stage.

Just my observation. Cheers Laughing

tErI-yAkI SG

Hi k4korny,

Yup you are right. All bowling balls are the same. With the exception of weight differences and core differences.

But spinner balls are lighter. Like what harmzuay has mentioned.

And of course, drilling of holes are different, as generally, spinners prefer to drill conventional type, as compared to hook bowlers' finger tip drilling.

solitary SG

Haha.. seems like everyone is talking abt everything except the availability of spinner balls. Allow me to join in the fun here..
I think its pretty true that spinner balls are just normal balls with no or little difference in the core. But there are still some so called spinner balls with pretty good reputation out there.. not really sure if those balls are really as good as they sound, but still, people would generally go for them.
As for the drilling, I think different spinners would drill their balls differently. I have my finger holes drilled very close together, whereas I've seen taipei spinners holding the ball (from newspaper) with one finger hole behind the other, unlike normal drilling where they are side by side.
Anyone came across this kind of drilling b4?

harmzuay SG

The Super Classic was a joke to me. 6 or 7 perfect games within a single tourney involving kids is not possible under "regular" playing conditions. This sounds harsh, but allow me to explain.

Firstly, kudos to all the people who shot 300 - fantastic to hit the pocket 12 times in a row regardless of score.

That said, i'm convinced the lanes must have been blocked more solid than bank vaults. Teriyaki has provided the stats, so i won't. But I do believe that bowling in Asia has become almost "political". Consider all our International tournaments, where bowlers from western countries and middle-east come to play... Tim Mack, for instance... In those tournaments, spinners are rarely even the favourites. But in internal regional tournaments, its the reverse. I think Asia - especially Singapore - wants to mainly establish itself as heavy ball-friendly, to attract big names from the west (usually heavy ball players).

Skill may play a part, but even skill can only do so much if the oiling doesn't favour you. 10 pins penalty from oiling can equal 100 pins difference in a 10- game qualifying series. That is easily the gap between making step-ladder finals on television, and going home early.

Just look at Korea (heavy ball capital of Asia). When the ABT goes there, it is ALL heavy ball bowlers. And reverse for Chinese-Taipei. Evil or Very Mad

Solitary

Mr. Green We strayed from your thread. Paiseh. I think it's safe to say that you will have better luck in the "Pasar Malam" threads in this forum. All the best! Cool

tErI-yAkI SG

Laughing

tErI-yAkI SG

Ya... Not necessary both finger holes must be side-by-side.

Your middle finger span can be longer than your ring finger... Or is it vice-versa? haha.. I forgot le.. Paiseh.. Embarassed

tErI-yAkI SG

Once again, spinners showed their dominations in the Women World Championship 2005, with 6 spinners in the Masters Finals, out of 16 bowlers.

alexlum SG

hi everyone Very Happy i think why hooking is more predominant than spinning in bowling is because it is VERY difficult to be a good spinner bowler! look at all the high end balls' core, they are MADE to hook by themselves as along as you have a good finger tip release. hook bowlers are also mostly 'power' bowlers due to the ball weight and the height of release. look at how high the westerners lift their balls into the air b4 the release.... i've personaly tried spinning with a 12lbs but it was a torture Embarassed generally spinners are not affected badly with the oiling pattern bcoz the style of play unless the lanes are heavily oiled as this will affect the spin and accuracy. still in my opinion, spinners are the more 'skilled' bowlers as the balls used are 'normal' ones compared to hookers. it takes LOTS of skill and practice to be a good spinner. by the way, i am a hooker myself Wink
have any of you seen a combi of hook and spin? ball starts off as what looks like a spin but it actually hooks when reaching the backend. is it possible???