Gang-raped, yet woman gets 6 months' jail, 200 lashes

last SG · 2007-11-17T09:33:58+00:00

Oh the PC police is on the prowl. Ooo.. these crazy muuzlems, they're so deranged...Inferior culture and all.. booh hoo hoo. Objective analysis based on con...

LazerLordz SG

Let me clarify. Rape is rape, there's no excuse for this heinous crime

What I'm saying is that any agitation from the international arena also needs the support of domestic activists, especially in more insular states (socio-culturally speaking).

Udon mentioned that it's best to leave it to the domestic fellas to solve their own problems, but I debated that point and wanted to say that domestic efforts won't work unless there is space for them to do so, and in nations like Saudi Arabia, international direct action in-country may not be as effective as a two-pronged approach that involves domestic lobbying and international pressure on the foreign policy and trade fronts.

frakfrakfrak SG

Lazerlordz and Fatum: "Universal" "values and ethics" are not monolithic concepts and implementation requires local adjustments. We have known this since the days of Suleyman the Lawgiver. Hence, what wrong is there to defer to the judgement of a local non-corrupt authority?

Fatum: Your indignations and attempts to emotionally monopoly the moral highground are tiresome. Your views are at the end of the day are based on emotions and not logic. Are you a woman?

MohamedF SG

Ok... lets put it in a simpler view... I went and commit a house-breaking and theft at a hdb flat... I escaped and on my way home I was gang robbed...

Then the news headline says. "Gang-robbed, yet victim was jailed, 4 strokes of the cane"

if you look closely at the article, the woman, though was gang rapped, did commit an offence of being in the same car with an unrelated man, which is a little bit harsh if you ask me, (weather if she is a prostitute, doing a "favour", pushed in or god knows what) which is considered an offence there. (Though, I think she is somehow guilty since any sane judge would acquit the woman if she was forced in to the car).

in conclusion, SHE WAS NOT PUNISHED FOR BEING A VICTIM OF A GANG RAPE BUT HAD COMMITTED AN OFFENCE AND SUBSEQUENTLY BECAME A VICTIM OF A GANG RAPE

law works in mysterious ways...

LazerLordz SG

Our premise here is that the law in question violates the basic right of a woman to have protection from rape. Therefore, any judgement made through that law, is void.

LazerLordz SG

Well, did Suleiman talk of double jeopardy? How can you charge a woman for close-proximity with a man when she has been raped.

Rape is by definition a forced act of sexual intercourse against a person's will. Therefore her crime of close-proximity was forced against her will. I'll bet that even if she had fought them off, there would be a high chance she'd be slapped with some ordinance relating to assault.

I believe that judge ought to re-examine his own credentials.

udontknowme SG

no no...it's not orgy. it is...rape leh...wait. i get my book....

found it

"After puberty all Eskimo girls are fiar game for any interested male. A man shows his intentions by grabbing the belt of a woman, and if she protests, he cuts off her trousers and forces himself upon her."

Fatum SG

I can't put it any better .... what this judgement against her basically says is that she was asking for it .... get it ? ....

Fatum SG

aren't you glad you're not an eskimo girl udon ? ....

btw, the eskimos hate the term "eskimos" ... they call themselves "inuits" ... only the plains and costal indians call them "eskimos" ... it's a derogatory term ... just something nice to know told to me by an "inuit" .... most textbooks should already make that distinction ...

Fatum SG

no ... I'm not a woman ... but I respect them ... I hold them as equal human beings, I hold their bodies as sacred, I don't see any sort of suggestions from them as an invitation to force myself upon them ...

do you ? ...

frakfrakfrak SG

Lazerlordz: She wasn't kidnapped mind you. Look Lazerlordz, I do not have much to go on here. You cannot force me to discredit the judge based on what you and I do not know. If we take liberties then we can say that what happened may be that she went along with him thinking he was a good boy and then she got date-raped. This happens even in the West. The difference in the law is that in the West they will say the woman was not at fault because she didn't know he had the intent. In Saudi Arabia they say all gender relations are subject to the sexual event, therefore the object of sexual desire must guard against the possibility of unwanted sexual contact. Do you want me to choose the former over the latter?

MohamedF SG

Trying to put myself in judge shoes:-

"a woman shall not be in a same car with an unrelated male" i think that this law was meant to protect women from rape.

Though I do think that law is harsh...

frakfrakfrak SG

Of course I do, more so that you. One does not leave diamonds in the dirt. You are so rabidly pretentious it shows. "I can't put it any better". Oh do please try dear even though you have to climb down a little.

AndrewPKYap SG

any judge that gives a woman 6 mths and 200 lashes for whatever it is this woman is supposed to have done is an asshole...

women are supposed to prevent rape and if she gets raped it is her fault for not preventing it? crapz... even if she runs around naked, no man has the right to rape her...

udontknowme SG

[not related to topic: but my mom just mentioned that she wished she had abandoned me and my sis when we were babies...>< yeah lar she is just joking but....huuuummm....what kind of mommy says this lorrr!!!!!! ><]

modernization (in the way that u are talking about) is some amayleecan dream. (ok. this sentence doesnt really make sense i think. but im very tired....) why must other countries 'modernize'? why do they have to adopt policies and laws that have originated from some other random country? do they not have a say in how they should run their own country? i will admit that i do not know anything about laws in saudi arabia. maybe this punishment is wrong even in their own country. i have no idea. but im not talking this one incident. im talking about a whole bunch of other stuff in general. nonono. i dun think they should have any role at all in creating space for domestics activists to work in. how did america come up with women's rights and all that?? who helped them? they did it themselves didnt they?? Confused
things'll only work out properly without external interference.
oh. and why why why is it that countries like the states feel that they are 'responsible' for the 'well-being' of people in other countries??
u send stuff like rice/wheat etc to people in other countries. but some people in those countries CANNOT take wheat. so what's the point of sending all those foods over when honestly it's not really going to help? it's not going to take half a generation before the people develop biologically to be able to digest wheat.
and based on TCKs who have lived in parts of africa etc, it's not helping either.
nothing is universal and ever will be universal. there is no black and white in this world. everything is grey. no matter what happens, there will be some people who see it as 'right' and some who see it as 'wrong'. even IF the law states that killing people is wrong. there will always be some people out there who view the killer as right.

damn im rambling..... should i go to bed and sleep...

LazerLordz SG

It's not just the States mind you.

Wink

Anyway, go and sleep la.. rambling liao. Embarassed

LazerLordz SG

Look, guarding against sexual contact is not the same as guarding against RAPE.
RAPE = Sex against one's will.

What part of that do you fail to understand? Rolling Eyes

Fatum SG

oh really ? ....

for someone who claimed that the rape victim was a prostitute ... based on his "analysis" .... Confused

hmmmmmmmm ....... *rubs chin ....

frakfrakfrak SG

Andrew: I do not agree with the severity of the punishment. Maybe the judge was making a deterrent sentence. Who knows. Also, its not a matter of right. Its a matter of power. She can run around naked and no man has the right to rape her. But some men with power man may still rape her. Heck, the President of Israel had been charged with rape wasn't he? Hence, she must not run around naked because the powers that protect her are not infinite. The law must not be naive right?

the Bear SG

it's okay.. one day fff will get the crap beaten out of him for sitting by himself...

and it'll all be his own fault for sitting there and his own fault for being a victim Laughing

and maybe, he'll then get arrested and put in jail for inciting others to beat the hell out of him by sitting there, minding his own business

udontknowme SG

but if i was there i'd view it as normal. i'd hate it (like some of the females there do), but hey...that's how it is. hmmm...but now as someone not living there and learning about it....yes DUH im glad im not from there. and glad im not from many parts of the world. because i like to have my own say in how i live. but then again...it's got to do with the education and life i've gotten i suppose...

btw, my textbook was written by an american. Twisted Evil
(biased remark made by someone from the more superior part of north america. hiaK~)

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