Enquires on which degree to take

ahtoot89 SG

Hi, I'm pretty sure there are a lot others who had this same situation as me so I'm asking for your advices.

After completion of A Level, my results missed the cut of the accountacy course of local universities so I'm sourcing for other degrees and I would like to pursue the UOL Accounting & Finance. The questions i want to post are:

1. Which institutions should I choose? (UniSIM? Singapore Accountancy Academy(SAA)? PSB? etc...)

2. With the completion of the degree, will my competitiveness be GREATLY affected by those who graduated with similar degrees from local univerisities to the extent I may not be able to secure a job?

3. After getting the degree, I wish to furthur pursue a Masters in Finance/Accountancy. What are my chances of getting accepted into the course in a local university?

4. Is enrolling in a local university the best choice for pursuing a Masters?

To those experienced/professionals out there, any valuable advices?? :D:D:D

Forbiddensinner SG

Hi, I'm pretty sure there are a lot others who had this same situation as me so I'm asking for your advices.

1. Which institutions should I choose? (UniSIM? Singapore Accountancy Academy(SAA)? PSB? etc...)

2. With the completion of the degree, will my competitiveness be GREATLY affected by those who graduated with similar degrees from local univerisities to the extent I may not be able to secure a job?

3. After getting the degree, I wish to furthur pursue a Masters in Finance/Accountancy. What are my chances of getting accepted into the course in a local university?

4. Is enrolling in a local university the best choice for pursuing a Masters?

To those experienced/professionals out there, any valuable advices?? :D:D:D

1. ACCA. Take a related part-time job outside at the same time. When you finished the course and got the cert, apply to enter local unis again using your cert and experience. On the otherhand, have you appealed for accountancy already? Do not think that you will definitely not get in just because your grades are slightly lower than the "standard mark".

2. Local unis' degrees are always more recognised than other local private unis. That is something which you cannot change. If you get an overseas degree from Harvard Uni, it will obviously be an entire different story altogether.

3. Bachelor degree from local private unis to enter Masters for local government unis? I am not too sure to be honest. But I can assure you it is either extremely low or zero.

4. Yes. Unless you want a private Masters from a private uni.

Lee012lee SG

Hi, I'm pretty sure there are a lot others who had this same situation as me so I'm asking for your advices.

1. Which institutions should I choose? (UniSIM? Singapore Accountancy Academy(SAA)? PSB? etc...)

2. With the completion of the degree, will my competitiveness be GREATLY affected by those who graduated with similar degrees from local univerisities to the extent I may not be able to secure a job?

3. After getting the degree, I wish to furthur pursue a Masters in Finance/Accountancy. What are my chances of getting accepted into the course in a local university?

4. Is enrolling in a local university the best choice for pursuing a Masters?

To those experienced/professionals out there, any valuable advices?? :D:D:D

TS, have you checked that UOL accounting and finance graduates will be able to become certified accountants and public accountants in Singapore with IPCAS ?

If the answer is affirmative, Singapore Accounting Academy will be highly recommended as it is the educational arm of IPCAS. While SIM has a long relationship with UOL (SIM brings in the UOL examiners/setters to conduct intensive revision for their students every year). PSB should be a distant third.

ACCA will also be good as ACCA graduates can become certified accountants and public accountants in Singapore. However, ACCA used to have a 10% - 20% passing rate but for the past 1 to 2 years, the passing rate has raised to about 50% to 60% with the new syllabus.

I hold the same views as Forbiddensinner on points 2, 3 and 4.

ahtoot89 SG

Thanks for the replies! Just a point to make, re-taking A levels has crossed my mind. But as a NSF who is ORDing next Feb, is it wise to re-take? The next application for A level is next year. Is it A-levels? Private university? Or other better options??

To Forbiddensinner: Haha, perhaps I should rephrase "missed the cut" to "impossible for me" as I got triple Cs and Ds. Thanks for the tip! I agree with your first point as I think I would stand a higher chance in getting into a local univeristy( I yearn to get into one too as you've said in point 2) with an ACCA qualification and working experience.

However, from what I know, ACCA is a very specialized subject of Accountancy( I went for the informative talk at SAA. SAA offers both ACCA AND UOL by the way.) The tutors told me the ACCA is for those who knows that they HAVE/WILL be an accoutant in the future. If I found out that I do not excel in Accoutancy, I would still have a UOL degree to fall back on as they said it is more "general".

If you do not mind, I would like to pose a few more questions:

1. Which programmes are actually the best? I only know of ACCA and UOL degree that can allow me to become an accountant in the future? I would like to trade my future accountant position should the need arrives and to have that choice, can ACCA or UOL meet the requirement or are there other better programmes out there?

2. For your first suggestion, is the ACCA programme more advantageous than UOL degree in Accountancy and Finance? Assuming I've graduated from the ACCA programme. Can I take a degree in Finance in the local university? What I'm concerned is I do not want to repeat the same subject again. Example is I can ONLY take a degree in Accountancy if i graduated from the ACCA programme. If that is the case, does taking UOL degree in Accountancy and Finance allow me to choose what degree I want to furthur my studies?( It would be better to choose should I need to get a masters in either subject in the future)

To Lee012lee: Many thanks on the advice and statistics you gave!(Where did you get those information anyway?? ^_^) And yea! According to the SAA website, http://www.saa.org.sg/acca_main.html, I have to take a ICPAS Professional Examination before becoming an "Associate of ICPAS" which I reckon is the one and only undisputed qualification that an aspiring accountant needs.

From what I can gather from your reply, can I say that what you meant was SAA > UniSIM > PSB etc? If that is the case, I would like to ask some questions again:

1. Assuming I choose to go for a private institutions( I'm still deciding on whether I should study a private qualification and which school to enroll). Is SAA better than UniSIM in terms of the way of teaching? Is it effective? After all, we all wish to ace the examinations.

2. Although SAA is the educational arm of ICPAS, does graduating from it makes me more advantageous that those who graduated from UniSIM? Any statistics by any chance?? =P After all, while we wish to ace the examinations now, we would all want to have a job in the end.

3. Any statistics information I can find regarding the passing rate of the ICPAS Professional Examination? There is also a bunch of statistics I would like to find out like the % of students who got a job after graduating from different private institutions or graduated with a different qualification( UOL or ACCA) and I believe there will be more to come! Any good sources around??

Once again, thanks again to the kind readers who posted their replies here! :D:D:D Just a side note, this is the second time I'm typing this. Stupid internet was offline and the original one was wiped out even though I clicked "back". Grr... I do hope it still brings out the original meaning that I hope to present sincerely to you again.

Forbiddensinner SG

If you do not mind, I would like to pose a few more questions:

Whether to re-take "A"-lvl or not is dependent on yourself. Ask yourself if you are willing to put time aside and work hard without the guidance of tutors and lecturors. If you are able to do so, then re-taking it shouldn't be a problem, provided that you are able to understand the content of the subjects you are retaking, and is confident of doing better this time round.

1. All of these programmes from Private Instituitions have their pros and cons, hence it will be hard to say that any one of the programmes is the best. It is more dependent on what you will prefer to specialise in. Since you want to take up accountancy, I will say that SAA is one of the best locally.

The question is that what do you want to trade your accountancy job for? Even if you did get an accountancy degree from local unis, you will still be stuck within the finance sectors.

2. For such questions, it will be more appropriate for you to directly ask the local unis yourself via e-mail, as I cannot give you any direct ( Yes/No ) answers here.

deepak.c SG

Between UOL accounting and ACCA, you are better off with ACCA. You can't be a qualified CPA with UOL accounting.

Be warned, after you have completed your ACCA, you will be competing with hordes of PRCs undercutting the market (Big 4 not included, but then again Big 4 you work like 16 hour days).

ACCA can be considered as an undergraduate degree in accountancy, getting into the locals unis shouldn't be a problem.

I don't recommend SAA for ACCA, it's crappy, I'd rather go to Kaplan (FTC) or FTMS.

charlize SG

Yeah, as far as I know, ACCA qualification is considered by most employers as equal to a degree.

I know of a lot of people with poly diplomas who went on for ACCA and am now working as mid level managers.

charlize SG

Between UOL accounting and ACCA, you are better off with ACCA. You can't be a qualified CPA with UOL accounting.

Be warned, after you have completed your ACCA, you will be competing with hordes of PRCs undercutting the market (Big 4 not included, but then again Big 4 you work like 16 hour days).

ACCA can be considered as an undergraduate degree in accountancy, getting into the locals unis shouldn't be a problem.

I don't recommend SAA for ACCA, it's crappy, I'd rather go to Kaplan (FTC) or FTMS.

The number of foreigners taking up ACCA and other qualifications in singapore is phenomenal.

I highly suspect that in the future in 5 years time, for every 1 accounting job being offered, the ratio of local to foreign applicants should be 1:3 or more.

deepak.c SG

My friend after 3 years in local firm, 3 years in KPMG, got promoted to assistant audit manager, then she managed to get a finance manager post in a listed property company.

charlize SG

My friend after 3 years in local firm, 3 years in KPMG, got promoted to assistant audit manager, then she managed to get a finance manager post in a listed property company.

I see some friends accounting trained all doing quite well.

Some took their CFA and currently holding high positions in their company.

Earning 5 figure salary.

And they are in early 30s.

ah san SG

Let see if i can help.

I graduated from UOL acct and Finance, like you i was stuck with the choice of ACCA or UOL. ACCA is very specialised, you basically have 2 main career options after that: auditor or accountant, I din noe what i was going to do then so i took the safer route of UOL at SIM.

Btw if I am not wrong SIM started offering UOL acct and Fin in 2003 while SAA started offering the UOL program I think in 2005/6. Both schools have some same lecturers so..i think teaching faculty wise should be ok...(I will recommend SIM if you are not so pro-accounts as SIM has more subjects on offer)

I ended up being an auditor, its really quite easy to enter the audit industry the attrition rate is 60plus % a year so if you dun mind the hrs and hard work...go on... you can still gain the CPA singapore certification by taking on 5 subjects after you grad from UOL and take the ICPAS exam. ICPAS professional exams..I am taking now, last i heard the passing mark is 60% for all papers and the passing rate is between 50-60%.you have 5 years to clear 5 papers. Can apply straight after you grad to take the papers.

ACCA i think with 3 yrs relevant experience you can apply for the ICPAS exam. BTW ACCA have a degree too ....think its brookes oxford or something.

I have got friends who went into finance sector with the same degree so not much problems there.

I am just curious why you yearn so much to get into local U?

A basic degree is only help to open doors, the rest is pretty up to u.

With the UOL degree you can take local uni masters...cos you still have to clear the SATs, GMAt and what nots...(Masters....give me the impression is as long u got $$$ u can take liao )

ahtoot89 SG

To Forbiddensinner: I'm not confident of obtaining A-level grades that allow me to enroll into Accountancy in local uni so I think I've to settle for other alternatives. I'm concerned that in downtimes, I'm still able to retain/find a job. From what I've gathered, if I manage to secure a Masters in Finance, I should be able to find job stability so I'm now looking for the path to that goal. Hm...thanks for the reply! I'll go and check out the local universities regarding using a private degree to apply for Masters. ^_^

To deepak.c: ACCA is considered better than UOL Acc. & Fin.? Even with a UOL degree in Acc. & Fin., as long as one takes the ICPAS examination, one can still become an Associate of ICPAS(as mentioned by ah san too!) I'm curious that why you think ACCA is crap in SAA since SAA is the training arm of ICPAS. May I know which programme did your friend, as you've mentioned above, study??

To charlize: Your friends must be real hardworking to obtain the CFA designation. From what I see, having a CFA or CPA signifies that you have some certain seniority in the sector. Something like a Doctorate(CFA/CPA) compared to a degree(UOL/ACCA, etc). No surprise that they have a high salary but the problem is what qualification to attain that designation? Is ACCA a more probable choice to aid me compared to a UOL degree??

To ah san: Wow! I've so many questions! Does UniSIM gives sufficient tutors' support during free times? What is the % of people completing the degree in your batch of students? You've mentioned that the attrition rate is high, but I do not know how high it means. Does it represents that one is able to find a place in the industry right after graduating? Being an auditor now, do you know what are the qualifications that most of your colleagues hold? I hope to find out which programme/school is more preferred among the employers.

Oh yea, thanks for telling me the passing rate of ICPAS examination! The question was burning in me for sometime because I believe that being an Associate of the ICPAS is essential for an accountant/auditor. Is that true? Since I'll be working in Singapore, from what I know, a local degree would have an edge over overseas degrees(those obtained in Singapore. Going overseas is supposedly more "acclaimed"??, thus preferring to enter a local university.

As for Masters in a local university, I've yet to enquire but it is comforting to know that I should be able to take Masters without a graduate degree from the university. My impression of it is that it is very difficult and people get white hair trying to graduate from it while working, haha!(I hope it's not true!! >.<) Imagining juggling work with even more advanced curriculum than an undergraduate degree! *shivers down the spine* Or is that the way taking a Masters should be?? haha =P

I-like-flings(m) SG

I see some friends accounting trained all doing quite well.

Some took their CFA and currently holding high positions in their company.

Earning 5 figure salary.

And they are in early 30s.

ur fren are "some" of those lucky or hard working few lah.. si mi CPA, CFA just an extra piece of toilet paper nia..... earning 5 figure salary? maybe 1 out of 10 lor.... there's another 9 that is still earning 3k or 4k and working 16hrs a day lor...... anyway dun think so far lah... study so much so fast for what... slow slow lah...

deepak.c SG

I know of NTU B.Acc with CFA selling insurance.

charlize SG

What to do, employers look at the amount of letters behind your name these days.

Woe to the uni graduate who thinks her basic degree is a big thing.

Lee012lee SG

If you do not mind, I would like to pose a few more questions:

From what I can gather from your reply, can I say that what you meant was SAA > UniSIM > PSB etc? If that is the case, I would like to ask some questions again:

Sorry for the late reply.

Many people have since replied to your post especially you get first hand information from the forumer Ah San who has taken UOL accounting and finance degree and proceed to become an auditor.

The degree is awarded by University of London and it will not be more advantageous or disadvantageous to study in either places. It will depend on the quality of the lecturers, teaching resources, learning resources at both places.

May I suggest that you make a trip to both places and talk to the current students to find out more about the lecturers, learning and teaching resources at both places. First hand information and knowledge are always the best.

I-like-flings(m) SG

I know of NTU B.Acc with CFA selling insurance.

sell insurance? that too hard for mi... i'm even thinking of selling satay for my retirement job...

I-like-flings(m) SG

What to do, employers look at the amount of letters behind your name these days.

Woe to the uni graduate who thinks her basic degree is a big thing.

PAPK, PSLE, GCEOL, ACCA, CPA .. long enough bo?

charlize SG

PAPK, PSLE, GCEOL, ACCA, CPA .. long enough bo?

If you want to put the first 3 behind your name in your resume, be prepared for the potential employer to laugh in your face.

That is, if you ever make it to the interviewing stage.

deepak.c SG

sell insurance? that too hard for mi... i'm even thinking of selling satay for my retirement job...

Selling satay good business, less stress, everyday only need worry about your meat.