write your complaints against mlm agents here!

last SG · 2009-05-14T00:39:06+00:00

Hi to all, hope everybody benefited from this thread.Btw: There's a news report on a SureForWin Scam on channel 8 a few days back. I hope none of you all are...

elementalangel SG

Hey Bro, if you wanna advertise, try elsewhere!!

Don't try to ride on my thread traffic to divert to your thread ; a dirty cheap tactic; you found the wrong place to place.

Any way, here's my verdict of your thread; since you posted and I'm obliged at least to have reponse to be a responsible thread starter.

Verdict:

Contents of the thread = Bias 1-sided experience with no prior experience in mlm - it's based on my eperience of being actively participated in mlm before thus I deduce that this person - redstone only join the business, refuse to learn and than turn skeptical than cry wolf shortly thereafter [scenerio 1] or redstone is just painly against mlm without being even involved in mlm before; it could be he's family members or relatives which have caused him and his family a lot of problems and troubles before which caused him to be super against MLM [ scenerio 2]

The numbers and percentages which are in the thread link are absolutely WRONG = Wrong Data input

The example of the companies he has listed in the thread link is just purely based on his WILD GUESS WHICH IS INCORRECT!!

His knowledge of MLM = ZERO

Skepticsm of MLM = 100% Full Marks

Bias against MLM = 100% Full Marks

Closed Up Sturbon Fellow who refuses to learn/expose himself to accept facts = 85%

Personality of redstone [solely based on the above thread link and his action of posting in my thread] = Ostrich - hiding behind the net trying to act like a pro which in fact is a smart-alex - thinking that nobody will discover/know his whereabouts nor objective when his body (evidence of post) is so clearly stated with nothing more than a link clearly indicate his personality.

Conclusion: Don't believe a word he says/write with regards to MLM.

Classic example of An Empty Vessel Makes the Most Noise

This serves as a warning to other forum users as well: If there's anybody who tries to divert or steal the traffic from my thread, I will do the same as per above or even more depending on situation.

For the above, he violated all the rules I've set in my thread so you will not want to consider such a person to be your future business partner or even take into consideration of his advices in future.

You see. People who are trying to express their views get trolled by you. and while you express your views which others disagree, people wont troll at your tread, you simply ignore due to professional etics/ or due to you paying to learn it or whatever reason you have.

Actually, any anti-mlmer to you has totally 0 knowledge about mlms, even if they had helped designed mlm systems, worked at the mlms at the admin side or even succeeded in mlms before and climbed the ladder high enough to see the dark side of it.

Just think about it and hopefully you could change the way you are. I am NOT sure if you are even close to popular amongst your peers however i know it would definetely help if you would think before you act at times.

the_fallen SG

Fallen:

I don't know why you are suddenly so hostile. You wanted MY views, there they are.

"Write your complaints about mlm agents here", so I did. That's my complaint. The overall "brainwashing" culture of some MLMs.

"The numbers and percentages which are in the thread link are absolutely WRONG = Wrong Data input "

It's FOR EXAMPLE ONLY. UNDERSTAND? Ok, fine... maybe you could give me the correct data and I'll correct it. I have no mlm contacts now. Maybe you have insider info.

As for my thread, I am merely showing my point of view. I didn't say ALL mlms. I only emphasising on a few, which I encountered before. I was cheated down by them. I'm merely infering from an outsider and a skeptic's point of view why they do such things.

Note that I did not comment about their product because I had not used them before. My existance in this subforum is to let people know about the unethical tactics and operations of some mlms. If you really note, I only shoot back at the 3 I had bad encounters with, namely VE, EY and SE. If you have the truth about why MLM companies idolise the so called "achievers" and glorify them, do clarify the truth, since you are so good in analysing. You "scolded" me there, so what's your point, I hate wars of words. It's useless. Instead of telling people what is the truth, you shoot people in the face, call them this and that.

If you disagree on my views and ideas, you can choose to ignore, or state the truth instead of flaming back.

Thanks for the clarification,

I turn hostile because I'm also against scammers (in mlm) since I personally lost $2,800 in one of the company which you have mention which appeared in newspapers numerous times. having said my point, although I was once one of the people who's silly enough to believe their rubbish nonsense. Having said that, I still don't want to have people listing company names out to avoid even more flaming.

If only you have said those above directly in this thread instead of posting a link, my reply will be different, because I understand your point of view only after you talk about it, not complaining about mlm like in your thread postings. State your problems and troubles clearly, I see how I can explain the differences rather than postings of complainst against the company whereby it's the sales distributors whom pull down the reputation

I'm hostile towards people who have no individual responsibility - pushing the blame of their own mistakes to others - I lost my money too in mlm, but I learnt a lot more in return. I choose to reflect on my own mistakes and learn instead of complain without looking at ourselves. [dwelling on the negative will not help you move forward at all, so why not learn to admit our own mistakes and failures than move on] Thus I'm here hoping to understand why are people are skeptical about mlm when they should be skeptical towards to sales distributors.

I'm a former skpetic turn neutral towards mlm in general but is super ANTI- ILL TRAINED SALES DISTRIBUTORS & VICTIMS of MLM SCAMS who complain without reflecting on thier own mistakes when it's us who sign the document.

the_fallen SG

I agree your stand that once an mlmer is your downline, he is forever your downline whereas for traditional businesses, he could leave you and be your competitor...

However, you have to also see that once an mlmer joins a company, he can also do the same, set up a new conpany etc etc...

And the competition still stands.

Areas where being a boss of a traditional company have competition :
Rival companies. Thats it. ( add in if you wish )

Areans where being an upline of some downlines in an mlm company :
Rival companies, sidelines, uplines.

Yes, the type of rivals in the mlm companies seem the same as any other sales profession, however, for the mlm companies, there is no limit to the number of employees and people recruit endlessly. Thus granting other teams ( your sidelines) more employees under them, which would also mean that you have much much much much more rivals than traditional businesses.

I'll agree with this.. Point Noted

You in-put with regards to this info is valuable.

the_fallen SG

With regards to the 2nd paragraph, i'll agree partially, because if there's any anti/neutral person who post, I will more or less tone down and even reply normally like a disccusion.

Refer to the replies which I've replied back to the user - Togogal.

Since this user know what's she's writing and have related knowledge, I didn't turn hostile did I?

I only turn hostile to people whom I feel isn't accountable for their own actions & mistakes. It doesn't mean that just because this is online, than we can anyhow accuse others since we're not subjected to lawsuits.

With regards to paragraph 3, you're right to pin-point a common mistake which I have.

To date- you're the first who's able to pin-point things clearly.

I appreciate your kind intentions but due to the numerous experiences of mine, I rather choose to remain this way, being honest is better than putting on a false front acting to be a nice guy yet stabbing others from behind - something which I've seen and experienced myself both in the coporate sector when I was working in Raffles Place and in the 2yrs of every guy's liability. At least I'm being the real me and not trying to put on a act like the others in real life. I treat both online and offline equally.

The other thing is I'm hostile towards your post but not towards you personally because I acknowledge your abilities based on your other thread postings and replies thus I did write the phrase: "Personality of redstone [solely based on the above thread link and his action of posting in my thread]" didn't I?

redstone SG

Lets not get personal with this. I believe we're all posting here for a reason.

Yes, I'm anti MLM. But only against those who cheat people's money, trick people down to offices or use unethical and underhand tactics in recruiting and selling. And those who are "brainwashed" by their uplines and had lost their sense of reality.

the_fallen SG

Lets not get personal with this. I believe we're all posting here for a reason.

Okay, point noted.

Haiya, brainiwashing is super normal de la.

It happens everyday in fact. Lol..just that the amount of brainwashing

Example like non-smoker friend with a group of smokers, over time non-smoker will soon join the ranks of smokers if the individual is weak minded with no strong will nor determination.

Another example: Gf wants to go shopping, bf don't like shopping but if there's something which bf must get from the gf, than the bf will lose and follow gf to shopping..

the_fallen SG

dont worry la.. he is lidat one.... look at what happened to me after i asked him qns.. he oso nv answer and divert everything away

Before I forget about it, I did reply to your questions so far on condition that it's being asked with proper english which can be understood.

what happened to you is partially your mistake if you understand where i'm coming from.

don't reset your thinking to zero and forget everything when i've answered abt the mlm vs tradditional biz wor. don't think of acting blur/forgetful like what other sales distributors do in sales.. while you and the rest of the forum users complain, some times, some users also does display usage of underhand tactics used by bad sales distributors too..

Jff1992 SG

my complaint

title: shameless mlm agents act like they are anti mlm but trying to close people online

descriptions: i just can't stand shitbug like that! they tries to even brainwash people's brain over the net (they thought they have some physco power like power rangers). I think they are pretty brainless, they thought by what they said can convince people to actually change their mind.

this kind of hopeless bastard is ought to die! crushed by rubbish truck! get garnished with the smelly garbage (since mlm agents and rubbish belongs to the same group), decorated with cat/dog poo.

if you compare a viagra spam message in your inbox with a "are you ready to make big money" ads by the mlm agents, you would probably be much more interested in the viagra ads. because you know that is actually REALLY GOING TO HAPPEN, rather than those stupid, dumbass pick up lines by the useless agents. If I ever going to receive a suck up spam shit in this forum's private message, i am definitely going to give that agent 01x good one!

example agent: the_fallen

the_fallen SG

my complaint

title: shameless mlm agents act like they are anti mlm but trying to close people online

this kind of hopeless bastard is ought to die! crushed by rubbish truck! get garnished with the smelly garbage (since mlm agents and rubbish belongs to the same group), decorated with cat/dog poo.

example agent: the_fallen

thanks for your RICH Contents of Junk.

From your user, you're newly registered, little posts thus giving me confirming that you create an extra account just to spam/threads and to be a clone only.

Nonetheless, I don't care whose clone you are nor will it take it to heart for your posting is totally un-related.

>>Clone Alert<<

Example which you have written is just NONSENSE with NO Clear Quotes as examples.

Nevertheless, thanks for dis-liking me, as least I know that from your negative remark, I know, confirmed my knowledge that No One to date have knowledge on par to me (with exceptions of the 2 person whom I know but isn't active or might have left the forums already)

Something to learn for all MLM agents (this will be something which you can learn)

If you say I got PM people trying to spam people, I DARE YOU to print-screen evidence lor..

Haha

Jff1992 SG

Your are greatest welcome, the_fallen. Thanks for your reply in SO COLORFUL CONTENT! Unlike conventional dull post by other user, I LOVE reading your post more than anyone else. IT'S SO FULFILLING and I really learnt a lot from it.

Now let me reply you directly from your text shall we?

thanks for your RICH Contents of Junk.
Welcome (gotta use blue, like Oceanos, strong impact, opposite of your fiery red)

From your user, you're newly registered, little posts thus giving me confirming that you create an extra account just to spam/threads and to be a clone only.
If you take about post counts and date of registation, your post is pathetic, almost 3 years you got only 1.4k post? You are not really active in the forum (I guess you are busy conning people outside forum, you have several markets - friends/relative, forum, and kintergarden) It simply show you don't understand forumer and lack of wisdom to get to know us.

Don't tell me you read a lot about forumer's post. Posting to communicate and reading ONLY is a WHOLE new shit to you. Don't worry, You can start to know more about forumer now. Since you don't understand us, you have no rights to say whether I am an extra account or clone.

Nonetheless, I don't care whose clone you are nor will it take it to heart for your posting is totally un-related.

>>Clone Alert<<
>>>>CONTRADICT ALERT<<<<
You just told me you will not take my post to heart because I am a clone... hmm.. AND YOU MAKE SUCH A BIG IMPLY ON >>CLONE ALERT<<, are you nuts? By your childish way to doing things, I really lose confident of becoming your downline or buying anything from you.

Example which you have written is just NONSENSE with NO Clear Quotes as examples.
Sama Sama lar hor.. Same same lar hor..

So people tell you negative remarks mean that person is actually an idiot/retard? Cool, this show you are unreluntant to learn and have some sky high ego shit. I am glad you still have you fight, you still thought you are the best, because without this pride, I betcha going to commit suicide after a few months of bad depression.

(As far as I know, laurence82 anytime can own you badly. Wait, almost anyone can own you pretty bad. Only maybe 1 or 2 person will be lousier than you... Your parents perhaps? No offence, but they will be so cared about you, they will intentionally MAKE YOU FELT you are king or something.

Something to learn for all MLM agents (this will be something which you can learn)
Learn something from you over the forum? I already told you, you are not power rangers, you have no physco power over the net, you can drop your slightest bit of hope that you can close anyone online =<

If you are superior in certain areas and nobody can win you in that area, sour-grapes always try some childish tactics thinking that they can throw off the thread-starters balance by posting nonsense postings without any basis nor evidence. >> This always happens in MLM be it you're doing it online/offline
Look at your ego. Your "always right" attitude. Your don't accept failure mindset. Sadly you used them all wrongly... To succeed, you need to acknowledge yourself failed if you had really failed (just like what happened now), and don't try to compensate anything to it, it will just make it become worse. Than, you move on and stop making the same mistakes.

Doing MLM is a failure, doing MLM over the forum is a greater failure, trying to close people over the forum is a giganto failure, quarreling with your mentor is a total failure, you are a failure.

Sometimes, you don't need evidence to know something is bad. Just like I told you shit taste good. DO YOU EVEN NEED TO TASTE THE SHIT TO TELL ME I BULLSHIT?

Likewise you are trying to convince me not I trying to convince you. So shouldn't you provide some evidence that MLM is workable?! Let's say, your paycheck? =)

If you say I got PM people trying to spam people, I DARE YOU to print-screen evidence lor..
Another typical MLM gangster tatic. "DARE ME". Seems like there are quite a number or MLM telly your behaviour (e.g. VE, Amway). Please don't threaten me, there is something called the cyber harassment. =) and I am only 16?

Haha
Hahahahahahahaha - I have the longer laugh :D

the_fallen SG

Now let me reply you directly from your text shall we?

thanks for your RICH Contents of Junk.
Welcome (gotta use blue, like Oceanos, strong impact, opposite of your fiery red)

Nonetheless, I don't care whose clone you are nor will it take it to heart for your posting is totally un-related.

Example which you have written is just NONSENSE with NO Clear Quotes as examples.
Sama Sama lar hor.. Same same lar hor..

Sometimes, you don't need evidence to know something is bad. Just like I told you shit taste good. DO YOU EVEN NEED TO TASTE THE SHIT TO TELL ME I BULLSHIT?

Likewise you are trying to convince me not I trying to convince you. So shouldn't you provide some evidence that MLM is workable?! Let's say, your paycheck? =)

Haha
Hahahahahahahaha - I have the longer laugh :D

1 - Post Count over period of years - I use it as a consideration factor about clone is because that's what many clones do when especially in this forum where clone hangs around thus the moderators have methods to check for clones and ban them. Over time when you proof yourself to be a real forum user account with quality content than say. - It's the phrase which everyone goes through leh..

Learn to talk and show your worth when you at least have some creditable posts contributions la hor. Although I'm not so much of a Active Forum User like you said, but my posts are creditable to some extent - I didn't say 100% perfect ar..

If you don't know about my background - kindly do a background check among those previously active threads and see how i reply back, look at the contents, i offer quality and not quantity. [ if you read previous pages of my thread, than you'll know that i was also one of the people kana con by mlm agents fyi - so this shows that you didn't even bother to read through the thread before commenting. ]

If you think I don't understand you guys in the forum, by all means go ahead, I have no issue with this to begin with. I only focus on helping to clarify any mis-conceptions which people might have with regards to mlm. For those who reply to my post, I will make it an effort to clarify and understand what exactly is the message being passed around;

BTW: the direction which you're going is no longer towards the topic with i'm heading in my thread which is aim towards clarifying different tactics of MLM agents who use those methods to con people - if you have any issues with those methods that i use, kindly show proof - no proof = no quality reference = just plain flaming (my own thinking - since this is my thread, so I make the rules here)

if you want to flame me, please start a new thread; I'll be happy to continue over there to avoid adding non-related thread postings in my own thread; this way i least i know different views from people of me and my actions perhaps in the mlm forums..

English Session once again: Distest = Dislike intensely

I have no issue with Laurance82 because I personally know his style of replying and his depth of checking out for Law Related Information especially related to MLM stuffs and I acknowledge his generousity and kindness of helping out other users to dig out for more information with regards to clearing / telling people advices based on Law.I have also seen his determination in winning the debate/arguement so with regards to that, I admit that he can win me head and shoulders.

BUT I'm different from him. I'm not as hard-working as him so I choose to reply based on my experiences.

Me on the other hand would advice and clarify based on my experience because I got myself hands dirty in mlm involvement thus I know the tricks inside out. I'm not so sure as to who else knows about the tricks since so far I didn't read any previous posts which shows signs of the user demonstrating CLEAR Understanding of MLM [advanced not those basic skills which is learnt in 1-2hrs]

I welcome anyone who possess advance quality knowledge to come and contribute in the forums so that we can learn from one another. I'm not saying that I can win you guys in terms of MLM knowledge but I just happen to know more than you guys in here because I make it an effort to learn the methods and coming up with counter methods thus little people can win me in terms of knowledge.

[Note: I however acknowledge that there are countless people who are Better than me in terms of MLM knowledge but they aren't contributing in this forum only - due to their absence thus I stand out only for the time-being. - people who are successful can't be bothered to come online into the forums..while it's a way to interact but it doesn't make monetary sense in anyway]

Corrections:

1 - doing MLM is failure >> Does this means Donald Trump is a failure too (refer to previous pages if you don't know what I mean)

2 - doing MLM over Forums is greater failure >> In which way did I project myself to be marketing MLM products and services? Please show me the proof, thank you - without proof, you are just talking nonsense/rubbish.

3 - Closing people over forums to do MLM = Again please show proof - Did i sell any products/company name or did I share tips and tricks on how to identify bad-ass sales agents in mlm >>obviously my thread belongs to the latter.

4 - Quarreling with my mentor - Look - Who's my mentor? I don't have any mentor online in this forum, so what made you think I'm quarreling with my mentor?

5 - Shit - Visit Japan for their exclusive SEX shopping center (don't ask for specific name because I have yet to go see this shopping center in person; I only hear this from my elder brother) and you'll be suprised that there are people selling Shit for people who have this festish for shits belonging to babes and if you like to order from same person, you can put up a request too if you like - go Japan and check it out yourself - if shit is bad, why are there still people who sell it - Lol.

Durian - Western people always say durian stinks, why do we still eat it. Even taiwanese also don't like it but we singaporeans do like it..

6 - Evidence : If you think evidence isn't important, try go accusing LEE Family in govt and see what happens to you in Court - look at the Democratic Party of Singapore who was sent to jail if you need an example. [I treat both online/offline equally if you didn't read my previous pages of this thread - I simply repeat this to let you know]

7 - Cyber Harassment - Where's the proof? I once again is responding to posts by different people. Did I in anyway harass people? Answer is clear No what..

8 - Did I fail or lose to you? No what, I on the other hand is showing you your mistakes, if you can show me my mistakes (after you have read the reads of my thread from the first page to the last page) than come and voice your views. Don't assume victory too soon. But if you want a victory, I now surrender and declare you're the winner >> how about this? Sounds good to you?

9 - Threaten = Which word/phrase/sentence and content give you the idea of me threatening you? No I didn't? You're just accussing me without any basis.

Jff1992 SG

^__^;;;;

I lazy to read.. post reply some other time when I am dread bored.. but I saw the english lesson part.. it's true.. I dislike you intensely.. I not only doesn't like you =)

ciao...

Deino SG

my classmate is spreading his company through social network sites like friendster...

the_fallen SG

my classmate is spreading enyouth through social network sites like friendster...

typically it would look look like

Deino, I would apreciate it if you simply just write about saying your fren posting in networking sites to promote mlm (E.g: Friendster) instead of exact copying which including the company's name which I want to avoid to prevent flamming.

Anyway thanks for your input.

With regards to the above post which you have written..I can only comment that those methods are out-dated tricks already.. Their bulletin post's contents is already killing themselves giving warning to poeple telling them that they are doing MLM.

Just leave it as it is la, see how they rot lor..It's just a matter of time before they give up since they don't know what are they should do nor are they updated with the new trends of MLM which have changed over the years.

darthboy SG

I am totally baffled at how some individuals will sit in front of their computer for hours on end, churning out walls of text, that ends up contributing nil to society at the end of the day.

laurence82 SG

I am totally baffled at how some individuals will sit in front of their computer for hours on end, churning out walls of text, that ends up contributing nil to society at the end of the day.

u are absolutely right

i am baffled too, its so pointless

the_fallen SG

I am totally baffled at how some individuals will sit in front of their computer for hours on end, churning out walls of text, that ends up contributing nil to society at the end of the day.

hmm..

no comments, but i can only say that those texts (if you're referring to me) which i've written are done in 30mins or less, lately it's just around 1-2min session only..

wall of texts from my point of view demostrates the depth of the knowledge and examples which I can relate to a lot of people both online and offline..

the_fallen SG

u are absolutely right

i am baffled too, its so pointless

i'm equally puzzled as to why your determination is so strong against certain senstive topics too in particular when you displayed undisputed hardwork in the researching part..

aren't you doing what i'm doing?

lol..

laurence82 SG

i'm equally puzzled as to why your determination is so strong against certain senstive topics too in particular when you displayed undisputed hardwork in the researching part..

aren't you doing what i'm doing?

lol..

technically no, i dun churn out walls of text in a topic that not many people are interested in...i dont even understand this bit about 'depth of knowledge'when you are just flaming people who post something on the contrary

*shrugs*

eagle SG

I spend few minutes every so often to churn out answers for homework forum :(

Could have been used for so many things hor :(

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