US won't sell new fighter jets to Taiwan

last SG · 2011-09-18T15:36:46+00:00

dont waste your time and breath.you have said enough. its obvious what he is.I guess so, hahaha, thanks.

alize SG

I don't understand some of the others' pro-unification views here.

The closest parallel to the issue is the Korean peninsula. It's like saying that North Korea's invasion was justified, or that American intereference in a future invasion is unjustified.

The PRC and Taiwan were born of civil war over 50 years ago. There has been no internationally recognized claim by one over the other, or recognition of the right of use of force. Grievances and causes of division are not recognised, especially where hostilities have ceased for so many years. Only the principle of self determination has been upheld, whether it is for unification, independence or the status quo.

Hosting American bases are a following and secondary issue for Europeans, Koreans, Japanese or Turks to decide on their own.

dragg SG

But you made the point that Taiwanese missiles are inferior to China's. Add to this the majority of Taiwan's weapons systems are obsolete or downgraded at point of sale, or both.

Even Singapore maintains an overmatch relative to its neighbours and would not consider standing still for a decade, especially regarding the air force.

if north and south wants to go to war or unify thats their internal affairs. the same can be said of taiwan and china. there is no argument here. what has it got to do with US?

the americans are only interested in their own selfish interest. thats why they are against the unification.

alize SG

if north and south wants to go to war or unify thats their internal affairs. the same can be said of taiwan and china. there is no argument here. what has it got to do with US?

the americans are only interested in their own selfish interest. thats why they are against the unification.

I like this reply. IF (two parties are free to enter a war) THEN (all other parties are free to take sides.)

RemifanSo SG

For their own interest, USA is not selling new fighter jets to ROC.

dragg SG

I like this reply. IF (two parties are free to enter a war) THEN (all other parties are free to take sides.)

if you want to argue just for the sake of it.

sgdiehard SG

I don't understand some of the others' pro-unification views here.

The closest parallel to the issue is the Korean peninsula. It's like saying that North Korea's invasion was justified, or that American intereference in a future invasion is unjustified.

Hosting American bases are a following and secondary issue for Europeans, Koreans, Japanese or Turks to decide on their own.

The US recognized ROC before 1971, after that it recognizes PRC. UN seat for China was represented by ROC before 1971, after that it was PRC. That is international recognication. The fact remains, PRC and ROC, mainland China and Taiwan are ONE country. So outsiders, such as the US should stay out of the dispute within the same country.

The european and the US still believe that selling opium to China was justified. What benefits them if mainland China were unified with Taiwan?

If the principle of sell determination is to be upheld, then the independence of China should be respected, the Chinese, and the Chinese alone should decide how China should unify. Don't think the chinese, on either side, want to go to war with one another.

sgdiehard SG

I like this reply. IF (two parties are free to enter a war) THEN (all other parties are free to take sides.)

It is never free to enter a war, you need to buy weapons first. It is the weapons suppliers who decide, will they provide the weapon free? The US don't have to take sides, they can supply weapons to both sides. How about selling F35 to the PLA?

alize SG

The european and the US still believe that selling opium to China was justified. What benefits them if mainland China were unified with Taiwan?

All of which reduces Taiwan from recognized government of mainland China to the status of a disputed territory. A disputed territory still retains the right to plot its own course through its own referendum. It is for Taiwanese, Timorese, Falklands Islanders etc to vote for themselves. Whether they vote or don't vote war is not sanctioned.

This prevails over whether the world sees one China or two, or whether the Chinese people are even a homogenous people.

If anyone can resurrect a 50+ year old pre-colonial or imperial claim, or claim that a people of one colour belongs in one country, every country would have a case against each other. Indonesia would soon apply that principle to Singapore based on historical empires.

Dalforce 25 SG

For me Taiwan as independent state will just be a pawn of the U.S to contain China and block China's rise.

I support China's rise in order to check U.S hegemonism.

alize SG

For me Taiwan as independent state will just be a pawn of the U.S to contain China and block China's rise.

I support China's rise in order to check U.S hegemonism.

That is an interesting point.

An independent Taiwan needs USA to guarantee its security, only as far as China does not recognise its independence.

If China recognizes independent Taiwan, USA has no leverage on Taiwan. Taiwan will probably trade more with PRC than with USA, perhaps ending up as a PRC satellite state.

But it won't because Tibet and Xinjiang will follow.

Dalforce 25 SG

If China recognizes independent Taiwan, USA has no leverage on Taiwan. Taiwan will probably trade more with PRC than with USA, perhaps ending up as a PRC satellite state.

But U.S will bring it's military bases back to Taiwan and meddle in the region and China's affairs in order to block and check China's influence.

sgdiehard SG

This prevails over whether the world sees one China or two, or whether the Chinese people are even a homogenous people.

Taiwan is undisputably part of China, before 1971, the US recognized ROC as the legitimate government, after that PRC. This is different from north and south korea where both as recognized! Falkland is never a disputed part of Argentina, that is why the British went to war!

Taiwan was under the japanese colonial rule because China lost the first sino japanese war. Is Japan making a claim on Taiwan now? The imperial Qing dynasty was overthrown, and China became a republic in 1911, is the Qing dynasty resurrected now and making a claim for Taiwan? You are thoroughly confused with the China history.

Chinese is never a people of one colour, china was ruled even by minorities such as the mongolian and the manchurian. and PRC never claim Taiwan on the basis of one colour people. You can find many non Han Chinese in Yunnan province, you think they should be independent?

alize SG

How Chinese is Taiwan? Taiwan was Ainu and Ryukyu before annexation by the Qing, before the KMT retreated there. Exactly how "Chinese" is Taiwan?

I raised the Falklands and Koreas to show that it is for the inhabitants to decide by referendum who to belong to, not for any colonial or pre-colonial power to decide. Which is why UN Command fought in Korea, and Britain is bound to return the Falklands when they so vote.

UN de jure recognition of authority over the sum of mainland and island landmass simply passed from Taipei to Beijing in 1971. Taiwan previously claimed the entire landmass on the basis of having governed it after 1911 and 1945. Beijing claims the entire landmass as heir to the Qing government, including Taiwan as an ex-Qing province, despite never having established Communist jurisdiction on Taiwan. Independence advocates have a stronger case than Beijing, if Taiwan's inhabitants so choose.

Independence is not ruled out just because the UN, US or anyone lumps two lands together and recognise "One China" or "Two Koreas", is it?

"One China" is a mere principle based on common colour and cuture, lacking any bearing on the wishes of Taiwan's, Xinjiang's or Tibet's inhabitants. As you showed, this basis is questionable. It is conveniently espoused by most nations wishing not to antagonise Beijing, and a handful of smaller nations who rather recognise Taipei. Your Yunnanese or other "Chinese" peoples are free to seek their path whether independence or autonomy or union. Are you saying it is compusory?

dragg SG

How Chinese is Taiwan? Taiwan was Ainu and Ryukyu before annexation by the Qing, before the KMT retreated there. Exactly how "Chinese" is Taiwan?

Independence is not ruled out just because the UN, US or anyone lumps two lands together and recognise "One China" or "Two Koreas", is it?

why keep bringing race into the equation?

china wants to reclaim taiwan because taiwan is part of china. we are talking about territory here.

the reason why china wont allow taiwan independence is because other areas will want it too. china always use the word 主权 coz they have the right over taiwan.

and china is COMMUNIST not democractic. so the people are NOT FREE to seek their path as you put it.

of course having said all this taiwan is free to resist. thats why china may resort to force. of course other countries may interfere. but then there is always a price to pay. are the americans or UN willing to pay the price?

do you think they really care? its all about interest. democracy is just an excuse.

ahtansh SG

Why continue to sell weapons to Taiwan?

They long wish to have permanent U.S. base there, for long term strategic cover.

sgdiehard SG

How Chinese is Taiwan? Taiwan was Ainu and Ryukyu before annexation by the Qing, before the KMT retreated there. Exactly how "Chinese" is Taiwan?

Independence is not ruled out just because the UN, US or anyone lumps two lands together and recognise "One China" or "Two Koreas", is it?

Exactly how "Chinese" is Taiwan? you have to ask the taiwanese...that is not something for any outsider to decide!! and who define "One China" , what is "大中华" ? ask the Chinese, living in Harbin, Beijing, Shanghai, Hong Kong, Taiwan, Tibet......

If the UN is not the organization that recognizes sovereignty of nations, who does?

Who is saying that the Tibetan, the minority tribes in Yunan (there is no such people as Yunnanese) want to be independent? Has the Taiwanese voted to be independent?

In a civilized world, the minorities and the majorities are expected to be working together for the common good, the outsiders should stay out. period.

sgdiehard SG

But U.S will bring it's military bases back to Taiwan and meddle in the region and China's affairs in order to block and check China's influence.

well, it all depends on whether the US can continue to food the bill for more military bases! Not sure in the short term China's military influence would increase, but the US influence is set to reduce, unless somebody want to pay for their presence.

alize SG

If the UN is not the organization that recognizes sovereignty of nations, who does?

Who is saying that the Tibetan, the minority tribes in Yunan (there is no such people as Yunnanese) want to be independent? Has the Taiwanese voted to be independent?

In a civilized world, the minorities and the majorities are expected to be working together for the common good, the outsiders should stay out. period.

Note the UN does not endorse "One China". It is only endorsed by individual states who recognise Beijing or Taipei. The UN will not act for independence or union, but will act against an invasion.

The UN is as ready to admit two Chinese states as when it admitted two Korean or German states (two states, one nation), because it is not compulsory for only one state to exist.

You just defined "One China" as a race-based construct. If outsiders are to stay out, what your Chinese in Harbin desire, has no bearing on where the Taiwanese wish to belong to. Too bad if Harbinese are unhappy in their minds, just because in their minds "One China" is a highly emotional concept for them.

lce SG

US dun sell then buy Russian or even buy from Chinese

TehJarVu SG

US should start minding their own business.

they should stay out of other countries' affairs.

i hope china/taiwan and north korea/south korea can unite.

ai li huan lo

« Previous Page Next Page »