Comparsions of Singapore Primus SPH & US FSC NLOS-Cannon

lionnoisy SG

In this Oct 2007 slides,NLOS Cannon will be fielded in 2011.

http://www.dtic.mil/ndia/2007combatvehicle/NDIACOMBATVehiclesDay1/FutureCombatSystemsPANEL1030amREVISED/DavidOgg.pdf

1What NLOS-C Brings to the Battlefield

Operational Capabilities
•
Provides sustained fires for close support, destructive fires for standoff engagement
Lethality
•
Multiple-round, simultaneous impact (MRSI) mission and multi-mission capable equals 2-3 Paladins
•
Sustained rate of fire (ROF) exceeds Paladin
•
Response to missions is faster than Paladin
•
Automated ammo handling allows change in effects round- by-round, mission-by-mission
•
Improved accuracy thru projectile tracking system
Command and Control
•
Networked BC with Current Force interoperability
Sustainability
•
High commonality with MGV, especially NLOS-M
•
Automated rearm of 155mm ammo is faster than Paladin

2.NLOS-C Early Production (P1-P9)(lion note-P=prototype)
•
Driven by Congressional intent
–
Delivery of 8 prototypes in CY08(lion note.CY=calander year)
–
Follow-on hand-off to TRADOC in 2010
•
Purpose
–
Reduces risk to MGV Increment 1
–
Balances cost, risk, schedule, test needs and User intent to make subsystem-by- subsystem configuration decisions
–
Proves out cannon as well as key common risk areas (propulsion, suspension, vetronics, environmental control)
–
Managed by same NLOS-C and Common teams (as Incr 1) through tailored design reviews … not an independent effort
–
Provides early learning opportunity on platform integration across MGV, C4ISR, UGV teams for hardware and software
•
Timing

P=prototype

(lion note.CY=calander year)QTR =quarter

–NLOS-C P1 to Army Ball 2nd QTR CY08, YPG Firing Safety Testing
•
3rd QTR CY08 - 2nd QTR CY09
–
NLOS-C P3 to YPG 3rd QTR CY08 for Mobility and Communications Safety Testing

3.NLOS-C Early Prototypes Key Capabilities

Not Included
•
JTRS & Battle Command
•
C4ISR Sensors
•
ANS (GPS/INS only)
•
Armor (Surrogate only)
•
Automated Resupply
•
Active Suspension
•
NBC & Hit Avoidance
•
Defensive Armament

above NOT included

Included

Early Prototype – P1-P8 (2008-2009)

P=Prototype
Non-Line-of-Sight Cannon
•
Automated ammo handling
•
Projectile tracking system
•
Laser propellant ignition
•
High efficiency muzzle brake
•
Ultra lightweight cannon/breech
•
Drive by wire controls
•
Environmental control
•
Hybrid electric drive
•
High power density diesel engine
•
Hydro-pneumatic suspension (passive)
•
21” band track
•
Integrated GPS/INS
•
Interface with FBCB2, SO-1 network via AFATDS

end of quote

vvv

lionnoisy SG

This mean the 2 cutting edge of NLOS are NOT in trial yet!!

1.a multiple round simultaneous impact (MRSI) capability,see 2 below

2. precision fires, through the XM982 Excalibur,see2

@@@@@@@@@@@@@@

So for the prototype ,the cutting edge compared with current Primus

is only The laser ignition system.

lionnoisy SG

search NLOS in this pdf ---more NLOS Cannon info here.

Link to Source Document

Pentaxdude90 SG

gd4u SG

Nope

The web below states the M109 Combat loaded weight at 27.5tons. Only the A6 variant is 31.8 tons (28.849 mt) .
http://www.inetres.com/gp/military/cv/arty/M109.html

I am sorry if i didn't state clearly. The M109 A1/2/3/4/5 series were all developed before 2003 , ie to say, before SPH Primus came out. (The M109A6 variant is developed in 2007)

I am also sorry that u didn't bother to look clearly. The wiki photo i posted is the Royal Netherlands Army M109A2 variant ...

Neither u have answered the MLC part that i have raised. Clearly, u have not understand the importance of MLC and MLC labels on military vehicle.

Yet, u said that Primus is the lightest in the world. But no, that's wrong. M109 existed b4 Primus. Pls admit the fact. Or admit that u were wrong in stating Primus is lightest in the world.

lionnoisy SG

Thesaurus of US armed force.

http://usacac.army.mil/cac2/call/thesaurus.asp

lionnoisy SG

pl check official info,not Tom Dick and Harry info.

My info come from US Army official site.Unless u have more reliable

source,i think i will stick to it.

Paladin

MLC or MCC?Ha ha.

http://usacac.army.mil/cac2/call/thesaurus.asp?search=ATEF&area=

@@@@@@@@@@@

FYI,when Primus was unveiled in 2003,NLOS Cannon just fired the first round!!

http://www.gordon.army.mil/pao/Signal/Issues/2005/2005_04/0429%20Signal%20online.pdf

Maj. Desiree Wineland
Army News Service
YUMA PROVING
GROUND, Ariz. – The
Army’s newest self-propelled
artillery system fired
its 1,000th test round on
April 14, capping months of
testing that began at Yuma
Proving Ground in 2003.

@@@@@@@@@@

I have to correct my opening post of 'Singapore locally design and built'.

Design--yes.

Built--not every bolt and nut made here.read below.

assembly--yes.

If u want run ahead than other guys,intergration is damn important.

In fact,almost all the technologies are there.It much depend on

how u modify,intergrate and assembly!!

By April 2000, the first working prototype was rolled out, using a vehicle chassis adapted from the US Army's Bradley Infantry Fighting Vehicle and M109 self-propelled gun.

After another three years of testing, the guns were unveiled by Defence Minister Teo Chee Hean yesterday.

http://www.dsta.gov.sg/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=3098&Itemid=401

vehicle chassis adapted from the US Army's Bradley Infantry Fighting Vehicle

Bradley---

@@@@@@@

Have FH 2000 barrels made in France?So,how about Primus?

kkkk

bbbb

Shotgun SG

Is it really Multiple Round Simultaneous Impact (MRSI)?

I think few rounds reach the target at the same time

or within few seconds then can be called as above.

Pl forgive me if my military or language not so good.

But,....

http://www.bartleby.com/61/8/E0000800.html

http://www.baesystemspresskit.com/nlos_cannon/development_timeline.cfm

Does it mean it takes 12 seconds from 1 st to 4 th rounds hitting the targets?

No.

They did a 4-round MRSI, six times.

And in each of the 4-round MRSI volleys, the 4 rounds landed within 4 seconds of each other.

The 6 times was probably done to get an average time delay between the first n fourth round.

lionnoisy SG

For weight,u have to bear in mind u have to compare like with like.

One of the factor is rate of fire.

Primus

Rate of fire : 6 rounds/min (maximum rate)

......Burst rate:3 rounds per 20 sec

......substained rate:2 rounds per min for 30 mins

and u compare one with much lower rate of fire and cannot sustain so long.

M 109A6

4 round/min maximum, 1 round/min sustained

i think it is comparing apple with orange.

@@@@@@@@@@@

gd4u SG

I already fucking told u i am not comparing the A6 variant... Only, the M109 A6 varaint is known as the Paladin ...

I am talking about the M109 A1/2/3/4/5 variants which are unnamed ....

I am refuting your particular statement "SPH Primus is the lightest b4 it came out" . But the M109 A1/2/3/4/5 variants were lighter and were already there b4 Primus ...

Pls , get to know what am I exactly stating abt.

sgstars SG

calm down dude. lionnoisy is just out to get your goat. or be an idiot. or be lionnoisy.

@ lionnoisy

its ok lionnoisy, no one takes your thread seriously, there no such thing as a silent endorsement policy. you expect MODs to endorse your crap ?

its called, you post crap, expect crap responses. you reap what you sow. you talk trash, you get trash responses. when you are trash, i guess you gotta live with the rest of the rubbish i suppose.

NLOS FCS and you want to compare it to the Primus ? might as well i compare the sopwith camel with the F86 sabre or with the Mig 17. or compare the spitfire with the F22.

different generations apart. so should i compare your intelligence with a 3 year old kid at kindergarden ? of course i should, going by your M109 and Primus comparison, i should. i bet the 3 y.o kid will pwn your ass anyway.

if you dont respect facts and figures and choose to continue with your bigotry, you will end up self-pwning again, as you always do.

you are practically mentally challenged to stoop so low to get attention. why ? no one at defence talk bothers about you ? no one loves you ? escaped from IMH ?

not that i really care.

basically you are just saying this over and over again

m109 :

BLAH blah blah blah Lionnoisy is talking crap Blah blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Blah blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Lionnoisy is talking crap blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Blah blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Lionnoisy is talking crap blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Lionnoisy is talking crap blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Blah blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blahblah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Lionnoisy is talking crap blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Blah blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blahblah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Lionnoisy is talking crap blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Blah blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blahblah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Lionnoisy is talking crap blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Blah blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blahblah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Lionnoisy is talking crap blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Blah blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blahblah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Lionnoisy is talking crap blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Blah blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blahblah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Lionnoisy is talking crap blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Blah blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blahblah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Lionnoisy is talking crap blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Blah blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blahblah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Lionnoisy is talking crap blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Blah blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blahblah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Lionnoisy is talking crap blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Blah blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blahblah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Lionnoisy is talking crap blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Blah blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blahblah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Lionnoisy is talking crap blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah Blah blah blah blah Crap crap crap poot poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah poot poot blah blah blah blah

i dont really know anything about what i m saying but i think putting a few links here and a few links there and dumping a wall of texts will make me some friends and make me appear learned. i must try to pretend to be intelligent by posting and ripping and stealing people's postings and i dont think for myself by copying and pasting other individual logic, so i try to camouflage it by inserting a wall of text here, wall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of textwall of text wall of text that no one actually bother to read and i go on to the next post

and so on and so forth.

its annoying

irritating

and stupid

so when u have sentences that go

like this

and

always demanding stupid things like

I want YES / NO explainations, I DONT WANT TO HEAR IRRELEVANT STUFF

MAYBE

you

Ought to

consider THIS

home truth : nobody likes lionnoisy, Nobody wants Lionnoisy to post here, Lionnoisy is not funny, Lionnoisy is not entertaining, Lionnoisy is a nuisance

and realize that everybody finds

Lionnoisy = irrelevant garbage

Obersturmfuhrer SG

Gentlemen, a few words of advice:

Do NOT Feed the Trolls.

Never argue with an Idiot. They'll bring you down to their level and then beat you senseless with their experience.

CenturionMBT SG

flame bait. Thread closed.

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