Malaysian Tanks

last SG · 2007-06-21T10:40:35+00:00

Additional weight does not means just engine power will do, the suspension and ground pressure may need to be addressed as well. More weight mean suspension...

SpecOps87 SG

No sweat...and yeah..forgot bout the DU munitions.But can the 30mm Avenger on the A10 fire other types of 30mm rounds? Say Armour Piercing High Explosive? Or Armour Piercing Incendiary?

beavan SG

anybody know how much penetration power the 30mm on our BXIIs have?

I_love_my_toilet SG

no idea

but there is a exhibit outside the armor muesum at Sungei Gedong camp

which shows the penetration depth of the 25mm one

maybe some1 from that camp can help take a look ?

CM06 SG

Penetration of the 30mm is 50% or 100% more than that of a 25 mm. I forgot which one. Either way it's a lot better in terms of performance.

Giving my opinion on our Apaches.

The thing is not only are heli-pilots rare stuff (and the constant vibration has long term detrimental injury to your joints), we do not use AHs the way the US does...IE a hunting pack of X choppers.

I think we deploy AHs to go after higher priced targets/delay enemy counterattacks and slow enemy advance as ours work mainly in pairs to make full use of the Longbow radar. Basically if we do that, we blunt their offense, keep them off balance even when we are still regrouping and are vunerable.

===
With regards to the A-10 thunderbolt, the general consensus is that the current planes are a "nice to have" for the US since they are flying so well. If they really feel the A-10's crucial, they would have restarted the production line. Dont forget that the A-10s are old and are without replacement. Not to mention , like all heavy armoured attack aircraft, AA missiles are a threat - since agility/speed/mobility is limited, you have to rely purely on your defense system to handle them.

The idea of a "Spectre" style Gunship would cost alot of $$$ and generate more whining from the neighbours than what's it's worth. I rather we have more SPHs that can do a less risky but equally painful job.

chino65 SG

The A-10's UNIQUE role, if I am not wrong, is that of a dedicated tank buster. It has the ability to linger, take punishment, fly at a "relak-satu" pace and kill AFV with its gatling gun.

Its other role of aerial bombing, rocketing, firing guided munitions etc can also be fulfilled by any existing conventional fighter/bomber with equal effectiveness.

Again, I say the same thing: We already have more F-16's than MAF have MBTs. Do we need another dedicated tank killer?

IMHO, even if money/logistics is not a problem, we should get more dual role fighter/bombers like the F-16 instead of a purely dedicated tank-buster aircraft.

A fighter/bomber may stand a chance against enemy fighters and AA missiles. An A-10 less so (as I just noticed CM06 has also mentioned).

...

There must be good reasons why the A-10 is a one-off. No new A-10's are being procured and no new replacement for the A-10 is in line.

I think that as things stand, we already have enough assets to deal with enemy armour from the air already.

If we're really pressed, re-activate the Super Skyhawks - they are almost like the A-10 minus the gatling gun and armour. Definitely one of the best attack aircrafts every built.

...

C-130 Spectre Gunship idea is good if you have a lot of spare C-130s, which we don't. Also, C-130 Gunship role can be accomplished by existing fighter/bombers - which also stand a better chance of evading AA missiles and defending itself from enemy aircrafts than the gunship. We are not fighting jungle VCs.

chanjyj SG

It is inmy opinion that the A10 was developed to blunt a Soviet armoured attack across the cold war. It's usefullness is not so apparant now that the soviet bear is gone.

Just my opnion. I didn't read any military book or even the internet.

FireAndHell SG

The part about A10 being developed for the European theater [Germany in particular] holds true. You need a truely dedicated airborne tank buster to kill them hordes of Soviet tanks charging thru the East German border towards West Germany.

CM06 SG

Oh by the way, the A-10 HAS a replacement:

Welcome the AGM-154 A.

http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/smart/agm-154.htm

Flying pigs of cluster submunitions. More accurate work with way less risks!

Yes yes we ordered some with our Eagles. Dont need A-10,

Arthas79 SG

What`s the fuss about this thing? They bought erm years ago and even had a logistical issue about spare parts which i hardly think they have resolved satisfactorily.

It is the the Malaysian answer to the bionix. They did not have much of a choice given thier budget. Bionix is better of course. The latter won the US army`s competition to replace thier old systems remember. Too bad they went for the Strykers otherwise ST would have been a few billion dollars richer. Singapore`s IFV/APC complement(working numbers) outnumber thiers. But at least they`ve got something decent amongst thier other forays into the global arms market. There`s nothing to be scared about the sightings of Adnans in Johor. We`ve got more equipment concentrated in Singapore than they could even dream of putting in Johor relatively and`sanely' speaking.

I do recall a conversation I had during the last AA where this ST dude said that the 25mm gun on the Bionix 1 is capable of punching through anything the Malaysians have saved the Twardy tanks.

tankfanatic SG

i know this should have stop...but i cant help it. It is so funny. Laughing

Hopefully these tanks will not leak in water, like those in which ex-president Habibe purchased out-dated World War II tanks from Germany. On its maiden journey to Indonesia some of these tanks leaked in water and reportedly sunk into oceans.

read the blue line.... tanks swam from german to indonesia and sunk in the middle of its journey... Laughing

In my earlier posting, I mentioned 2 issues. The lst one concerned M'sia's intention to acquire tanks from Poland.

the dolly parton is not a ww2 tanks. Wink

The other was about Habibe who most of us know him to be an Indonesian, procuring German tanks from Germany.

which never happen Rolling Eyes

For the millions who live in S.E. Asian countries and who have been reading newspapers often and seeing Habibe's face on tv during Suharto's time, we alll know him to be an Indonesian. There can be no mistake about Habibe's nationality. You youself appear to be 'very blur'

....so is there any connection between mahathir and habibie?..some more both didnt bought any ww2 tank?

For the time he spent in Germany, Habibe thought he had a good deal when he settled on a fleet of dyfunctional German tanks from Germany. unfortunately some of them were found to have leaked in water.

the only thing that he bought is ships..hence it leaks..and allegedly sunk.. not tank..furthermore..only ah beng call tanks 'fleet'....

CM06 SG

*cough*

Must take note that Weapon and Armour are two different things.

The 25mm CG bushmaster is capable of going through most of our vehicles too to set things straight....

Arthas79 SG

*cough*

Must take note that Weapon and Armour are two different things.

The 25mm CG bushmaster is capable of going through most of our vehicles too to set things straight....

duh yes..in the context of the new Adnan which the MAF is getting of course.

tankfanatic SG

anyone have any detail on the group of apache that were ambushed in iraq?

Arthas79 SG

In brief, what happened? Or was it circumstantial? Nothing is immune. However, it is better to have the Apaches then not having it; especially with air-power on your side. As a matter of fact, more and more countries are buying attack helicopters. Has the Apache combat helicoptet failed in it`s objective when the US built/used it? Ans:No. It has fulfilled it`s original objectives.

Recently, I read about an ingenious device which can be equipped on a combat helicopter. It functions like the Trophy system(concept-wise but not execution) in that it releases miniture rockets which will eject a net at any projectile fired at it. The net will then capture the projectile and due to the weight of the net and projectile, they will fall to the ground. I`ll see if i can find it again.

The Apaches can be equipped with Aim-9 series missiles as well if Im not wrong.

At any rate, the current series of conflicts are proving the worth of attack helicopters but it also helps in coming up with better solutions to increase thier survivability. The Israelis are even considering increasing the armaments of normal medium-lift military helicopters so that they can function as aerial gunships.

kotay SG

Are you referring to Karbala Gap ?

tankfanatic SG

i donno. i heard this story from nat geo about a group of 70 apache on the way to destroy a bunch of iraqi RG tank who is menuvering for counter attack. Whe the apache fly by a small town, an iraqi colonel saw it and call his counterpart at the nearby town using his handphone. So his friend arrange everything that can fire at the sky and wait. the apache got into the trap... and every single ac rtb with damage. In the end of the war only 2 apache return for operational duty.

i guess nat geo have diff pespective on this

Arthas79 SG

donno. i heard this story from nat geo about a group of 70 apache on the way to destroy a bunch of iraqi RG tank who is menuvering for counter attack. Whe the apache fly by a small town, an iraqi colonel saw it and call his counterpart at the nearby town using his handphone. So his friend arrange everything that can fire at the sky and wait. the apache got into the trap... and every single ac rtb with damage. In the end of the war only 2 apache return for operational duty.

i guess nat geo have diff pespective on this

please provide evidence of this. link ? article? Do not say that you`ve heard this story about so and so. What are you? a rumor-mongerer? 2 out of 70 apaches return to operational duty in the end of the war ? Are you sure? Do you even know how many Apaches were deployed in the first place ? What a wuss...

The fact remains. Having it is a great force multiplier. And too bad for the monkies they train thier sights on.

tankfanatic SG

u prick, i said i saw it in national geograpic! this jounalist interviewing this apache pilot ..and that is what he blurt out!

Shotgun SG

I think the American's previous excursion to Iraq led them to believe that their Apaches were invulnerable to everything except Shorads.

I guess they were wrong... again. Its no secret that the Yanks lost quite a number of apaches in the sandbox. One of them happened to be a pretty well liked forumer on one of the Jet-sim forums. Kinda sad, he only got his wings a few months ago before they sent him there.

Arthas79 SG

u prick, i said i saw it in national geograpic! this jounalist interviewing this apache pilot ..and that is what he blurt out!

You can say whatever you want MyVi to discredit the Apache. This is nonsense unless you can show some evidence which was what i had asked for.

The fact is the Apache is good to have. Even your muddled headed military officials(a fact) would understand this.

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