BREAKING NEWS! F-15T WON!

last SG · 2005-09-06T22:31:48+00:00

with weapons package being so call announced....there is no link saying we will be getting Tige eye /pantera pods for F-15T????? I prefer Tiger eye from F-15...

SMAPLionHeart SG

If you all compare SU-27/30's first appearance , which is in 80's and F-15's first appearance in 1970's .

It may not be that old after all.

SMAPLionHeart SG

The F-15 is a twin engine, high performance, all weather air superiority fighter. First flown on July 27, 1972, the Eagle entered USAF inventory on Nov. 14, 1974. It was the first U.S. fighter to have engine thrust greater than the normal weight of the aircraft, allowing it to accelerate while in a vertical climb. This, combined with low aircraft weight to wing area, makes the Eagle very highly manueverable. The Eagle has been produced in single-seat and two-seat versions.

The single-seat F15A on display, nicknamed "Streak Eagle," broke eight time-to-climb world records between Jan. 16 and Feb. 1, 1975. In setting the last of the eight records, it reached an altitude of 98,425 ft. just 3 minutes 27.8 seconds from brake release at takeoff and "coasted to nearly 103,000 ft. before descending. It was flown in its natural metal finish to reduce weight for the record-setting flights. To protect it from corrosion, McDonnell Douglas Corp. has since painted it in the gray color scheme of most operational F-15s.

This is F-15 K

SMAPLionHeart SG

The F-15K, like all F-15s, will be one of the world's most survivable aircraft. The combat-proven F-15 boasts an exceptional safety record, thanks to its advanced avionics systems, robust airframe, speed and maneuverability.
Combat aircraft survivability is largely determined by two factors: how well an aircraft avoids being hit and how well it can withstand a hit. The F-15 avoids and withstands hits with success unsurpassed by any aircraft that carries weapons or fuel tanks under its wings or fuselage.

The F-15K's integrated avionics and electronics systems provide exceptional situational awareness, giving its crew a better view of the battlespace than its enemy has. Its radar sweeps the air and ground for targets at long distances, allowing the crew to detect and attack with long-range weapons before the enemy knows what is happening. Advances in radar and weapon technology will further enhance these advantages.

The terrain-following system that allows the aircraft to fly at very low altitudes, its automated electronic jamming system integrated with a radar-warning receiver, and its smoke-free engines thwart enemy attempts to locate the aircraft.

The engines, which can propel the F-15 to speeds exceeding twice the speed of sound, and an airframe capable of 9 g maneuvers, allow the F-15 to routinely outmaneuver enemies.

The aircraft has a triple-redundant hydraulic system and redundant electrical generation system that prevent a single failure from ending a mission. Fuel dispersal throughout the wings, with none above the engines, a foam fire-suppression system, and self-sealing fuel lines significantly reduce the vulnerability of the aircraft's fuel system. In addition, much of the aircraft is made of fire-resistant titanium.

Each F-15K will carry a two-person crew. The division of duties between pilot and weapon system officer allows each to remain focused on their individual tasks without becoming overwhelmed and encountering dangerous mental and physical fatigue. Traditionally, aircraft with two-person crews have performed better than those with single-person crews.

For the long-range, multi-role missions flown under the challenging conditions at which the F-15 excels, these are significant advantages. Having two crewmembers in the cockpit is also advantageous in the event of injury or illness to one of them.

The F-15 has one of the best safety records in U.S. Air Force history. On those few occasions when an incident occurred, F-15s have safely landed after being hit by lightning, after withstanding a fuel-tank explosion, with destroyed tail sections and with half a wing missing.

Leveraging unchallenged experience, the F-15K offers proven, not merely promised survivability. The F-15K enjoys all the benefits that have contributed to the unmatched safety record of earlier F-15s.

SMAPLionHeart SG

f-15A, see the difference?
Laughing

LazerLordz SG

The Thrust Vector version is a demonstrator.Not in production..yet.

ProudlySingaporean SG

anyone knows whether the aim120 included in the 741mil weapons deal is the C7version with range of 120km or C5 one? and how does the aim9x fares against python4?

storywolf SG

You should not classified F-15E with eariler F-15a,b,c,d as F-15E is a totally redesigned aircraft with new airframe, system & engine, which only look same only. The f-15E is the forefather of the F-15T appears only in 1986.

Just to add some facts.

F-15a,b,c,d history
----------------
F-15a & B was first delivered in 1974.
f-15c & D was first delivered in 1979.

F-15E
--------
F-15E was a totally redesigned aircraft, new weapons system, new enforced airframe and new engines, althought it looks the same other f-15.
The F-15E, which flew for the first time on Dec. 11, 1986
F-15E was first delivered in 1988. We should take this as the date of birth of the new eagle.

Su-27 history
----------------
In service in mid-1980s.
Different version is upgrade and rename as su-30, su-33 .... etc.

Rafale
--------
the first demonstrator flight was in 1986 but the first production aircraft entered service only in 2002.

Mirage 2000-5
--------------
Mirage 2000-5 flew in April 1991.
Orders for 110 Mirage 2000-5 have been placed by the air forces of France (37, with 20 delivered), Taiwan (60 aircraft), Qatar (12) and Greece. Greece is acquiring 15 Mirage 2000-5 Mk 2 and upgrading ten of its Mirage 2000 to the same standard. The first entered service in September 2004. The United Arab Emirates have ordered 32 2000-9 aircraft, a customised version of the 2000-5. First deliveries were in June 2003. India has ordered ten Mirage 2000D and is also to purchase the 12 2000-5 fighters of Qatar.

EuroFighter
-----------
The Eurofighter can trace its roots back to the early 1970's
The EAP demonstrator performed its first flight on 8 August 1986

If looking at the above, F-15E is not really old. In fact you be suprise that first flight of F-15E & Rafale & Eurofighter all have their first flight in 1986.

As for Su-30, su-33 ... all are just improvement verison of Su-27 which also appear in mid-1980s. They are re-name to su-30, su-33 .... just to get more export.

In fact if you look at Mirage 2000-5, with the upgrade system, it can do the same role of the rafale, at a lower cost, that is why so many customer go for it instead of rafale.

So after looking at data, su-30, rafale & eurofighter are really the same age as F-15E. And F-15E is definitely more then good enough and the king of the lot.

IAF SG

If looking at the above, F-15E is not really old. In fact you be suprise that first flight of F-15E & Rafale & Eurofighter all have their first flight in 1986.

As for Su-30, su-33 ... all are just improvement verison of Su-27 which also appear in mid-1980s. They are re-name to su-30, su-33 .... just to get more export.

In fact if you look at Mirage 2000-5, with the upgrade system, it can do the same role of the rafale, at a lower cost, that is why so many customer go for it instead of rafale.

So after looking at data, su-30, rafale & eurofighter are really the same age as F-15E. And F-15E is definitely more then good enough and the king of the lot. [/b]

Well presented

bigballs11 SG

Bro, where got seperate? I dare to bet we only get 8 planes for the first batch, and probably another 12 in the next 5-years defence budget plan from FY2006-2010. 20 is the maxium we will get for the F-15.

That's 1 Billion Uncle Sam Dollars lay, translate into 1.7 Billion Singapore Paper Money hor.

Our pathetic defence budget is only SGD5billion/year (subject to tax revenue), SGD2bil is on administrative cost (pay & food), SGD2bil on operation (facilities, fuel, repair, maintenance) and research cost and only mere SGD1bil on new equip acquisition and upgrade. We run on so call 5 years aquisition plan, so that translate to only mere SGD5bil for equipment replacement.

That SGD5bil is not even USD3bil, and what can you buy for USD3bil man? Three B-2 bomber probably. With so many new toys to pay, the new frigate, the new tank, the new subs and the new NGF plane, all need big money and that doesn't fell from the sky.

Do you know that how many exercises are cancel this year and we don't even issue blanks in field exercise anymore? That's the plight we are in anyway. Same same to other armed forces in this region.

My message is be realistic, we are not UStheA or China who has tons of money to spare. We can only dream for 4G/5G plane and fancy laser weapon, and not own them at this point of time, unless la, you volunteer to pay more taxes Mr. Green

fartboystinks SG

In fact, F15K is isn't 80-90 million. It was priced in the region of 35-45 mil
Revolving around Eurofighter forums and the net,
Rafale was priced 50-70 million
Eurofighter 60-80 million
and
F15T in the region from 40-50million

given that Boeing pulled stunts in Korea deal by dropping the price last min, i believe they did the same with the F15T.
what is most important is operation cost. we wont want to spend 8x70 million per Rafale just for NDP and Paya Lebar Open House right?
we wanted a strike fighter not an air superiority fighter. If we really wanted an air superiority fighter, we would had not dropped Eurofighter

Shotgun SG

IMO, the F-15T is a good buy. Look at the weapons sales and the AESA that comes with a COMBAT proven air frame.

The Strike Eagle may be based on the 1970s design, but is actually a totally different aircraft compared to the first McDonell Douglas F-15A that rolled off. U simply cannot compare a strike eagle against a the F-15A.

Secondly, the Strike Eagle is a highly survivable aircraft. It can really take serious beatings and walk away with it. The classic one being a Strike Eagle that lost one wing and managed to return home and land. Saving the pilot and WSO. Honestly, I think the strike eagle will need at least 2 R-77s or R-73s to peg it for good.

As for the Dogfights. Firstly, it doesnt happen very often nowadays. With AWACs overhead, most engagements would typically take place BVR. Once BVR missiles have been launched, the launching aircraft generally peel off, and try to evade any BVR missiles counter-launched at it. There is very little opportunities for Dogfights to happen nowadays. Besides, with new helmet targetting systems, and the AIM-9X, i believe we do have a good chance against surprise encounters.

And the amraam outranged by amraamski thing. Well, we really wont know until we start shooting. On paper, the amraamski does have a range advantage over the AMRAAM, but then, all these range and launch envelopes are not absolute. Older versions had an effective range of approx 25miles, and probably 15miles when it came to tailchases. At BVR, if u can't out maneuver the missile, chances are u can still outrun it. For the amraamski, we don't even know if its as accurate as claimed. I haven't heard of an R-77 launched in combat against another fighter. Somebody comment please.

Finally, the most important part of the Strike Eagle. Its almost unparalleled in the A2G role in for a Fighter. That is in terms of amount of ordnance it can carry, precision, and survivability. And just look at the variety of weapons it can use. JSOWs... what de heck, talk about a bang for the buck! With a platform like the F-15T, we can even throw in some addition A2G arms like the popeye series.

All in all, I think the F-15T is a good choice. We need something that can replace our scooters in the a2g roles.

wonderamazement SG

i remember there’re weapons included in the deal, anyone care to share the information?? think it was in the newspapers bout 1-2 mths ago…

fartboystinks SG

The 22 August notification reveals that Singapore is seeking an extensive armaments package, including 200 AIM-120 Amraam and 200 AIM-9X Sidewinder air-to air missiles, 50 GBU-38 Joint Direct Attack Munitions and 30 AGM-154A Joint Stand-off Weapons, both armed with BLU-111 warheads, and 30 unitary warhead-equipped AGM-154Cs. Singapore has also requested 24 Link 16 multifunctional information distribution system low-volume terminals and 44 AVS-9(V) night vision goggles.

http://www.flightinternational.com/Articles/2005/08/30/Navigation/190/201234/Singapore+closes+in+on+next-generation+fighter+.html

storywolf SG

20+ F15t , combine with our F-16s , it is more then enough. Remember there is not a lot of targets to justified a larger number at this moment. We don't want to over invest till we have to use a F-15T to bomb someone toliet because we run out of targets.

As I say again to hell with classification of 4g !!! As I mention before, 1986 all three F-15E , rafale and eurofighter took their first flight ! So rafale is not really that impressive or new. In fact Mirage 2000-5 have the same capability of the rafale, you see that most middle east countries are even buying mirage 2000-5 instead of rafale.

storywolf SG

No, because the F-35 program is on track and look good to be able to roll out. So they may want to reserve the title for it.

seancannot SG

If the SU 30 is really so cheap and good RSAF would have shortlist it during evaluation stage...

How many countries are using Rafael ... the french themselves have only just started using them

IMO Strike eagle with the array of weapons and avoinics is better suit to Sg economically ba

84mmrr SG

We must see things in perspective. Last year, govt announced that civil service will cut 3% of all ministries(except MINDEF) manpower annually from 2004- 2007. All minintries(except MINDEF) will have 2% budget cuts. MINDEF is the only one that have more budget this year. Now, defense budget accounts for about 30% of total govt budget. this is very high and there is so much that we can afford to spend.

i think RSAF should be glad that they have new & expensive jets. Many civil servants are the one that have low morale as they have worry about smaller budgets, retrenchment & outsourcing.

bigballs11 SG

As I say again to hell with classification of 4g !!! As I mention before, 1986 all three F-15E , rafale and eurofighter took their first flight ! So rafale is not really that impressive or new. In fact Mirage 2000-5 have the same capability of the rafale, you see that most middle east countries are even buying mirage 2000-5 instead of rafale.

Heh heh, I thought I already mention F-15E is a totally different plane from the older F-15-A till D Rolling Eyes

Jet Fighters Classification 101

1st Generation (1945 to 1955)
piston-engine avionics stripped with subsonic turbo jet.
e.g. Mig-15, F-86 Sabre

2nd Generation (1955 to 1960)
single role, limited weather, radar equipped supersonic jet fighter, A2A missiles
F-104 StarFighters, Mig-21

3rd Generation (1960 to 1970)
multi-purpose fighters capable of performing both air defense and ground attack missions.
e.g. F-4 Phantom, F-5, Mig-23

4th Generation (1970 to 1990)
multi-role fighters equipped with increasingly sophisticated avionics and weapon systems. These fighters also began emphasizing maneuverability rather than speed to succeed in air-to-air combat.
e.g. F-15, F-16, F-18, Mig-23, Su-27, J-10

4.5th Genration (1990 to 2000)
refering to more recent fourth generation fighters. These aircraft are generally seen as retaining the same basic characteristics of fourth generation planes but with enhanced capabilities provided by more advanced technologies that might be seen in fifth generation fighters.
e.g. F-18E/F Super Hornet, Su-30/33/35, Eurofighter Typhoon, Gripen, Rafale
also F-16E/F, F-15E/K/T is consider 4.5th Generation due to it's advanced avionics and it's integrated battle management situation aware system

5th Generation (2000 to ?)
The technologies that best epitomize fifth generation fighters are advanced integrated avionics systems that provide the pilot with a complete picture of the battlespace and the use of low observable "stealth" techniques.
e.g. F-22, F-35 and Mig-MFI/Su-47 if they ever exist

Xth Generation (???)
Macross Valkyrie Fighter VF-1x Mr. Green

Orcishwarrior SG

Rafale

(Source: French Ministry of Defence; issued Sept. 7, 2005)

(Issued in French only; unofficial translation by defense-aerospace.com)

The authorities of Singapore have announced that they have selected the Rafales competitor pour their future combat aircraft program.

This is a sovereign decision of the State of Singapore. France respects it as such.

Although we regret it, this decision will not affect the quality of our bilateral relations.

During this exhaustive international competition between several aircraft, Rafale was selected as one of the two finalists. The Rafales qualities have been recognized.

At the time of the final decision, however, the present weakness of the US dollar appears to have been a determining factor in favor of our competitors.

-ends-

I salute and applaud Smile the french for their spirit.

tvdog SG

The F-15 airframe design is basically still current. The SU-30, Su-35 are all still basically in this kind of configuration give or take a canard or two...

Our F-15 is really a new plane, using a tried and tested airframe.

It's a safe choice, I have to say, not necessarily the best choice.

I was hoping for the Typhoon but when that was dropped, I definitely feel the F-15 is a safer choice than the Rafale.

When the RSAF bought the F-16 Falcon or Viper (which is correct anyway?), it was already a proven plane. Sound, reliable and proven deadly in by the Israelis.

The same with the Eagle. It has been battle-proven. Folks have gone to war several times with this plane and everything from logistics, reliability, weapon delivery have all been proven to work very, very, very well.

Plus the people selling us this piece of equipment is happy to share with us their years of combat-fighting experience on this platform.

We'd be silly to throw ALL THAT away and go for an "iffy", unproven, un-combat-tested French product.

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