Japan want 2 aircraft carrier. . .die liao die liao

last SG · 2003-07-18T19:04:15+00:00

Atobe, look, with regards to Japan and WW2, i can meet you halfway and agree that the situation of that time, coupled with the multitude of factors; shintoi...

SingaporeTyrannosaur SG

Don't put too much credience on the latent organism theory to explain such theory. Such extreme behaviours can easily, or more easily be induced via nurtured cultural idealogies or pratices being naturally extended to the extreme by those who know how to twist them.

Basically, there is no good reason why any certain population of people will share a bias towards ACTION in their latent organism unless it had been bred into them via evolutionary processes, of which we have none. I seriously doubt the average german will have more genes making them want to follow extreme action. There are good reasons for this. Basically, it's not always a good thing to do extreme things, evolutionary speaking. This is because humans are not eusocial. If such genes exist, they are basically self defeating because it drives the race to exaust their best and brightest doing basically pointless things like invite war onto themselves. These genes will remove themselves from the gene pool in short order. Genes which encourage such extreme behavior would only be rewarded if humans were eusocial.

Basically, a more likely theory is nurturing of the basal human. Basically, any human being, Japanese or German or Malay, if brought up from young with strong values of loyality to their nation and the basic belief of their superiority, added with the idea that other people are jealous of them and want to take what's rightfully theirs. Let that fester from youth and allow misconceptions to grow into unquestioning acceptence, and then kick start them on extreme idealogy. It's not difficult to see how anybody can become a nazi. It dosen't take genes, even if those genes may make you more likely to become one or not. The fact is, anybody could become a nazi or racist, given the right conditions. And back then, the conditions were suitable to affect a large proportion of the population.

Basically at most we can say is that genes may make one group of related people more implusive then another. But basically, the human being is a very complex animal that works on the outer loop of evolution. Environmental factors have and always have played the larger role in shaping the nuances person while genes defined the ballpark in which these factors play.

Gedanken SG

Atobe, I think we are starting to reach a point of agreement here. I agree with you on the fundamental point that people from certain cultures tend to act in a certain way; each culture seems to have its own distinctive characteristics. However, the research evidence I have seen in favour of environmental factors being the stronger influence is much more compelling than that in favour of genetics.

If you were to take a person from one culture and place them in another, would that person entirely retain his or her original cultural characteristics? My answer would be no. A good case in point here would be Alberto Fujimori, who not only acculturated when he went from Japan to Peru, but indeed did it to the point where he got himself elected president.

From an evolutionary perspective, one of the key characteristics that has allowed the spread of the human race across the world is adaptability. If we have one characteristic that is genetically driven, it is that we alter ourselves to suit our environment. To some extent we attempt to influence the environment, but is is always in reaction to a preexisting condition.

Being picky, "behavioural attitudes" is a bit of an oxymoron. It is either a behaviour or action, or it is an attitude or thought. Nonetheless I get the gist of what you are saying, and the way different cultures conduct themselves is very much a matter of the social environments that exist within them.

At the end of the day, however, as I said in my first post, looking at the circumstances that you described, be it from a psychological or genetic perspective, i agree that there is little, if anything at all, to stop Japan from a repeat of WW2.

CX SG

well, guess we've found some common ground... thats cool... at least this didn't degenerate into a flame war... i do lose control of myself sometimes and get excessively curt and sarcastic sometimes...

my apologies to all if i've crossed the line of courtesy sometimes...

however, i do think that it will take a fundamental change in the current world order to get Japan to take that path again... there are just too many unknowns at this point in time.

we can't say for sure that "if we let them do this, they'll invade the rest of asia again" ... its just too shallow... pple might be tempted to bring in the lessons of appeasement and munich, but times have changed... this isn't munich and koizumi isn't hitler... nor do we have any reason to conclusively believe that they'll go that way...

besides, it isn't about appeasement... i still think its about respecting their right to defend themselves and given their awkward situation, they are rightly worried...

Atobe SG

Many thanks Gendaken, ST and CX for an insightful tour of your knowledgeable and thoughtful contributions that allowed a real exercise of the minds to probe into a very controversial subject of Genetics and the Behavior of the Human Race.

I certainly agree with CX that it is senseless to seek recrimination towards the Japanese or the Germans for some events that happened during the 1940's; with those events caused by past National Leaders, who were foolishly driven by greedy political ambitions that led their respective nations to cause misery to themselves and millions of people across the globe.

While it is pointless to seek recrimination, we should ensure that Japan will act responsibly to allow for more openness in the flow of information to all her peoples to the events that had occurred, and we should not accept nor allow any attempts to distort history for the sake of the future generations before us.

The World Community should press this minimum standard onto Japan in exchange for an acceptance Japan's desire to play a bigger positive contributory role on the World Stage.

Human kind has a tendency to forget past events, and with the passing of each generations the memory of past events become less significant; resulting in lessons having to be learnt again at a much higher cost.

Asia has been much kinder towards Japan and its people, when compared to how Israel has continuously held the Conscience of the World to ransom for the holocaust that fell on their People during WW-2.

While we encourage Japan to play a positive role in the World Community, we should expect Japan to be more responsible and forthcoming in the conduct of its relationship with its immediate neighbors and those further from its shores.

Her aggressive determination to succeed in any tasks is an innate characteristic of the Japanese People, and when harnessed and managed by the World Community it will be able to play a positive role for the benefit of all.

The alternative can only be a dreadful one, as history has shown.

laser51088 SG

Concerns rise over Japan troop dispatch to Iraq
2 hours, 35 minutes ago

By Elaine Lies

TOKYO (Reuters) - Japan enacted a controversial law on Saturday that paves the way to dispatch troops to Iraq (news - web sites) in what could be the nation's biggest overseas military deployment since World War Two.

But with concern rising about safety amid continuing attacks on U.S. troops in Iraq, it remained unclear when -- or if -- deployment would be carried out.

After two days of opposition party delaying tactics that put back passage until the wee hours, parliament's Upper House approved the law, which critics say could violate Japan's pacifist constitution.

Prime Minister Junichiro Koizumi has been determined to keep his promise to the United States to send troops to Iraq, despite the fact that a recent poll showed more than half of Japanese voters oppose the move, promising that troops would only be sent to a "non-war" zone.

Koizumi said Saturday that maximum efforts would be taken to guarantee safety for Japan's Self-Defence Forces (SDF).

"We will conduct precisely required aid operations....with sufficient consideration of the safety of SDF personnel," he was quoted by Kyodo news agency as saying.

But Naoto Kan, head of the largest opposition Democratic Party and a vehement opponent of the law, condemned its passage.

"We believe in trying to fill the Iraqi people's need for aid, but opposed sending the SDF over there, since a war-like situation continues," he said in a statement.

Japanese media also expressed concern. The daily Asahi Shimbun warned the situation had to be carefully studied.

"It is not as if the people of Iraq have asked us to be there," it said, noting that troops would face dangers such as the guerrilla-style attacks now plaguing U.S. troops.

Kyodo quoted Iraqis as saying that Japanese troops could indeed become the target of attacks.

"It is risky for Japanese troops to be stationed here," said Hassan al-Najjar, assistant dean of the Media College at Baghdad University.

Koizumi's ruling coalition had pledged to have the bill passed by the Upper House before the current parliamentary session ends on Monday.

Failure would have meant a huge loss of face for Koizumi, possibly forcing him to call a snap general election.

The law's passage was fraught with troubles, including the submission of several censure motions, a no-confidence motion against Koizumi's government, and a scuffle between lawmakers from opposing sides during a committee meeting.

------------------------------------

The next step away from Japanese pacifism.

It now remains a question of time before Japan regains its legal right to have a force not bound by World War 2 treaties.

cavsg SG

Japanese Navy Seeks Carrier Funding
Aviation Week & Space Technology
08/11/2003, page 32

Eiichiro Sekigawa
Tokyo

Maritime Punch

Japan's navy has requested initial funding for the first of what will be the largest fighting ships--eight 13,500-metric-ton-class helicopter carriers.

Funding to begin building the first ship is being sought in the fiscal 2004 budget. Each is expected to cost $1 billion and carry four Sikorsky/Mitsubishi SH-60K subhunters.

Regional tensions, particularly the ballistic missile threat posed by North Korea's Taepo-Dong program, have prompted Japan to rethink much of its post-World War II pacifism. The Japanese navy's largest fighting ships are four 7,250-metric-ton Aegis cruisers. (The navy does have three 13,000-metric-ton transport ships.)

However, for the past 30 years navy planners have been seeking a light carrier for helicopters and vertical takeoff/landing (VTOL) aircraft, such as a Boeing AV-8B. But their pleas have been rebuffed by the Defense Agency out of regional political concerns over Japan "rearming."

But the North Korean aggression is wearing away such resistance. The country has developed its first military reconnaissance satellite fleet and is considering a missile defense system.

The plan is to assign each of the navy's four fleets two of the helicopter carriers. Currently, those fleets are equipped with a 5,000-ton flagship that can carry three helicopters.

Besides the situation's political ramifications, the navy will face some budget opposition because the cost is so high relative to other programs. The plan does not include introduction of a VTOL aircraft.

JLennon SG

i look forward to that day man.... SDF-1 and protoculture may already be in the pipelines somewhere.

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