The Singapore Defence Industries

Palmbum SG

I currently writing my thesis. It is about defence industries in Singapore. Specifically I'm looking at Singapore Technologies Engineering (ST Engg) and its role in the defence of Singapore.

Despite ploughing through many journals, the most I got were puff pieces extolling the virtues of ST Engg as a business company or articles hawking ST Engg products. Which in itself is not too surprising, since magazines and journals like Jane's have vested interested in promoting defence industries.

I was wondering if one of you can direct me to articles/magzines/books, that you have read or come across, that critically discusses ST Engg, its activities, the organisation or its effectiveness?

You can either post your replies here or email me privately at [email protected] I thank you in advance!

PS: I am also trying to find ST College. Heard there's a library there. Maybe I can find more source material there. Does anyone know where it is, and if anyone can just go in?

SingaporeTyrannosaur SG

Not very likely to find critical articles, ST is indeed a good and innovative company.

Palmbum SG

Thanks for your prompt reply.

However, I would like to clarify what exactly you meant by 'good and innovative'. Can you raise specific examples of it being good? Or innovative?

What do you make of the coffeeshop talk about ST Engg merely rips off designs from the West and calls it their own?

tripwire SG

ST copy others design...??

put it this way...

IF ST comes out with a brand new "death star" weapon... do you think it will become public knowledge.. or will it be hushed up and secretly produced for SAF only? since revealing such system for WATEVER reason including for thesis would simply compromise national security....

Understandably... most defence industries does comes up with something new... but its usually hushed up... unless it is released for sale.... to the global market...or was used in public due to war...

example... NIGHTHAWK of USA ...

CX SG

"rips off" implies blatant patent infringement... and since ST does intend to market its products in the world arms market, it cannot do that without legal repercussions...

but i don't see anything wrong with IMPROVING on other people's design concept. bear in mind that having an idea is a long shot from building an operational prototype.

like... are the car makers gonna sue each other for "copying" their design since most class 3 motor vehicles have 4 wheels?

we talked about this before in another thread... and the consensus seems to be, why re-invent the wheel? Mr. Green

Palmbum SG

Yes, I understand what you mean. But coming out with innovative design does not mean it is a 'good' defence company capable of fulfilling SAF's needs does it?

I am interested in looking how ST goes about fulfilling this need, or if it pursues projects that brings in profit, but not inline with SAF's defence requirements.

SingaporeTyrannosaur SG

What nice stuff did ST come up with so far?

As for good proucts, I'll vote straight for the SAR-21, the negative reactions I've seen coming from some who decide "to stick it with the M-16" are rather puzzling, since it was developed to replace, and be better then the M-16 itself. Most negative reactions I've seen seem to have stemmed from a form of mentality that homegrown weapons are inferior or from the normal kneejerk reaction most soldiers have to new equipment that replaces what they are used to. From what I can see and tried in both weapons, the SAR-21 is vastly superior to the M-16, and a crowning achievement of ST engineering. People who complain that it is a rip off of the Aug better look again, for the difference is only skin deep. In fact the SAR-21 is more advanced then the Aug, but I've yet to see the Aug get the same cold reaction. (in fact most people seem to think it's cool!) Said and done, the SAR-21 is good, period.

Other excellent products were the Ultimax 100 machine gun and Bionix I suppose.

As for real ST innovations, I think there are some:

I like their 14kg ultra lightweight grenade launcher and smart air bursting ammo that is similar in operation to the OCIWS 20mm grenade. And of course, the automatic repeating 120mm mortar system that spit out ten rounds a minute.

eurofighter SG

ST has developed a 35mm anti-missile gun which can fire 35mm rounds filled with hundreds if not thousands of sub-ammunition bomblets.
A radar will first detect any hostile missile. The computer will predict its flight path. The gun will fire the 35mm rounds into the missile's flight path. These rounds will release these bomblets into the predicted flight path of the missile. So when the missile hit the bomblets, it will be rendered useless as the bomblets damaged the missile's seeker, fins etc. This sysetm was exhibited in the 2000 and 2002 Asian Aerospace along with a AIM-4 Falcon missile damaged by the weapon system. ST may have copied this idea and weapon system from Bofors which had also developed such a gun.

CX SG

MINDEF has pointed out that it is NOT a captive market for ST products. previous ST products HAVE been rejected by MINDEF if it did not suit SAF's operational requirements.

ST knows this. its shares are also publicly listed and traded so it would be rather spastic to assume that it can continue to make substandard products which SAF refuses to buy and which it cannot sell overseas. it needs to account to its shareholders u know...

strictly speaking, ST does BOTH of those things u mentioned. being based in Sg, it has certain advantages by trying to sell to SAF first.

at the same time, the SAF alone cannot provide ST with the critical mass it needs to survive and grow in the real world so it NEEDS to market its products abroad.

but in order to compete on the world market, it NEEDS world class products and innovations.

so, SAF gets to pick from a range of first class systems and select only the best suited for its requirements, which may not be ST.

fulfilling SAF's needs is but one of many of its key objectives. and it NEEDS to be a first world class innovator to win SAF contracts which attracts defence contractors from all over the developed world.

at the same time, they market abroad to increase sales (which incidentally, also attracts the same defence contactors to compete...)

so both aims complements each other. there is no contradiction as u seem to suggest.

Atobe SG

ST Engineering works with DSTA in developing products that can be used by the SAF, as well as the world market at large.

Towards this end, it is also known to have worked with leading manufacturers in joint R+D, or the outright purchase of Designs (with patents) from independent designers, and develop the design further for local use (if suitable).

Some of these ventures are the air bursting ammo (posted by SingaporeTyrannosaur, and referred to as anti missile gun firing 35mm ammo posted by eurofighter), which is developed jointly with Bofors (not copied).

The Bionix APC was developed jointly with foreign expertise in design and production engineering. It was specifically developed as a replacement for the dated M113 APC from the Vietnam War Era with its inherent weakness.

The Bionix APC was further modified, in an attempt to meet the US Army requirement for a replacement to the Bradley APC. However, it was unsuccessful as the US Armoured Corp had its revised doctrine for armoured warfare to be based on wheeled and not tracked APC.

The SAR-21 is an example of a foreign design purchase, with further refinements to the design to suit local operating conditions.

Stealth Patrol Boats have also been developed jointly with the Swedish Manufactures of the Visby series of Patrol Boats; while the modified La Fayetter Frigates with Stealth Features have been contracted to the French DCN Shipyard Yard, with contracted transfer of technologies being signed to allow ST Engineering to build the same vessels in Singapore.

In the Air, ST Engineering, was reported by Janes Defense Journal, to have the assistance from the Israeli Defense Industries in the conversion of Skyhawks, F-5s and even the F-16. In all probability, the E-2C airborne early warning aircraft would have got some up-grade of hardware and software with the help of the Israeli Defense Industry.

These co-operation with foreign companies involved in the defense industries, will allow a shorter learning curve, and joint development will allow us more then a degree of being self-sufficiency and reliability in long term supplies.

foga SG

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this i have no comments.

foga SG

i believe in endorsin local products but there’s no point in supportin it blindly by neglectin it’s bad points. i believe ST would do much better if it have more end user, i mean saf soldiers who are gonna use it, opinon rather than those of the engineers.

bcoy SG

http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/taiwan/archives/2003/01/15/191055
Taiwan producing prototypes of new anti-aircraft guns developed by Singapore.

SingaporeTyrannosaur SG

Erm, I’m refering to 40mm the smart Automatic Grenade Launcher ammo, not the 35mm air bursting. The range to target for the 40mm smart round is input when it’s launched down the barrel of the launcher and the round counts down the time to target. It has the ability to explode over targets instead of the traditional impact grenades and hence has the ability to kill targets traditionaly safe in defilade. Not to be confused with the air bursting 35mm shell.

Palmbum SG

I guess we all have our personal favourites when it comes to weaponry. Just to play the Devil’s Advocate… what in your opinion are the duds that ST have come up with, in terms of military hardware?

Shotgun SG

The US Army did not intend to buy the bionix as a “replacement” to the bradley. They are looking at it as an, light-airportable fighting vehicle in replacement of the M113s and alternative to the stupid LAV-25. There was a huge debate about tracked vs wheeled armored fighting vehicle, (guess Gen Shinseki was on whose team?), and finally it most people were convinced that tracked vehicles were somewhat less vulnerable. So the “tracked” faction suggested upgrading the M113 to Gavin standard, which the US Army didn’t want to. And since they were also somewhat convinced against LAVs, they started looking for another vehicle that would fulfill the light, airportable, and tracked vehicle requirements. Thats where the Bionix came in.

foxtrout8 SG

http://www.austrade.gov.au/print_template/0,1059,ContentGroup%253Dcountryindust%2526ContentType%253Dcountryindust%2526ContentSection%253D%2526MetaRID%253DPWB179716,00.html

try this website....maybe it will be for some help...

SingaporeTyrannosaur SG

Wheeled units seem like a bad step in the wrong direction, already there have been many problems with the LAV, ridiculus armour protection, high cg that makes it prone to overturning at speed, pop gun weaponary, and those large bloated rubber tires (makes mobility kills easy) that need to be changed once every two weeks! And not to mention that dumb thing can't even fit in a C-130 without letting the air out of the tires, while a Gavin can just roll in. I'm going for the tracked faction anytime, I know which thing I want to be in during a firefight...

During the black hawk down incident, two Malaysian Condors, which are nothing more then garbage trucks on large rubber wheels were destroyed when they got set on fire and burst, being unable to move they were taken out or burnt out. Guess where the two malaysians died?

SingaporeTyrannosaur SG

There was this dud ST came out with, the SAR-80 rifle, which was supposed to be a cheapo replacement for the M-16. In the end it ended up in the black markets of mog being used by somalians!

eurofighter SG

What bout the latest ST Terrex APC?