City harvest invitation!!

last SG · 2005-06-11T01:25:12+00:00

I agree too. Main Entry: Do·nate Pronunciation: 'dO-"nAt, dO-' Function: verb Inflected Form(s): do·nat·ed; do·nat·ing Etymology: back-formation from donatio...

Mr Fugue SG

Now I understand why it's called "city HARVEST"; they "harvest" funds from the city... Laughing

Ogbunwezeh SG

This fella talk nonsense... Trying to be sacarstic n hurt other religions. The west r blood sucker, like to colonize other countries, suck them dry n leave the poor countries alone to fend for themselve tats why they so rich.

OH-FF SG

Wah Zombies !!!!

looks like a Resident Evil Movie !!

hxm SG

ha, so the other churches' gods are fake? this is stupid.

Mr Fugue SG

Hmmm... how does fake gods look like??? Laughing

hxm SG

i had a neighbour who PESTERED me for dunno how many weeks to go to the SO-CALLED CARNIVAL. in the end had to sit thru some SERVICE. n she told me she didn't KNOW about it. wtf??!?!?!?!?!? sorry no offense.

hxm SG

Originally posted by Ito_^:

Welcome to sgForums - the place of crazy critics, chc flamers and hys haters.

Anyways..

CHC Official Statement of Faith:

The fundamental teachings of this congregation are reflected in the following clear statements of faith:

1. We believe in the plenary-verbal inspiration of the accepted canon of scriptures as originally given. [b]The scriptures are infallible, inerrant and the sole and final authority for all matters of faith and conduct.
(2 Timothy 3:16; 1 Corinthians 2:13)

Personal Opinion: Please note that it says ".. accepted canon of scriptures as originally given."

2. We believe in the eternal Godhead who has revealed Himself as one God existing in three persons, Father, Son and Holy Spirit, distinguishable but indivisible.
(Matthew 28:19; 2 Corinthians 13:14)

3. We believe in the creation, test and fall of man as recorded in Genesis; his total spiritual depravity and inability to attain to divine righteousness.
(Romans 5:12, 1 Cool

4. We believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, the Savior of men, conceived by the Holy Spirit, born by the Virgin Mary, very God and very Man.
(Luke 1:26-35; John 1:14-18; Isaiah 7:14; 9:6)

5. We believe Christ died for our sins, was buried and rose again the third day, and personally appeared unto His disciples.
(1 Corinthians 15:1-4; Romans 4:25)

6. We believe in the bodily ascension of Jesus to heaven, His exaltation and personal, literal and bodily coming again the second time for His Church.
(John 14:2-3; and 1 Thessalonians 4:13-1 Cool

7. We believe in the salvation of sinners by grace, through repentance and faith in the perfect and sufficient work of the cross of Calvary by which we obtain remission of sins.
(Ephesians 2:8-9; Hebrews 9:12, 22; Romans 5:11)

Personal Opinion: Salvation by grace, repentance by faith and works. Simple enough?

8. We believe in the necessity of water baptism by immersion in the name of the eternal Godhead in order to fulfill the command of the Lord Jesus Christ.
(Matthew 28:19; Acts 2:34-36; 19:1-6)

9. We believe in the baptism in the Holy Spirit as a real experience at or subsequent to salvation, with the scriptural evidence, namely, speaking in other tongues as the Spirit gives utterance.
(Acts 2:1-4; 8:14-17; 10:44-45; Galatians 3:14-15)

10. We believe in the operation of the gifts and ministries of the Spirit as enumerated in 1 Corinthians 12-14 and Ephesians 4, as manifested in the early Church.

11. We believe in the Spirit-filled life, a life of separation from the world and perfecting of holiness in the fear of God as expressing the true Christian faith.
(Ephesians 5:18; 2 Corinthians 6:14; 7:1)

12. We believe in the healing of the body by Divine power, or Divine healing in its varied aspects as practised in the early Church (Acts 4:30; Romans 8:11; 1 Corinthians 12:9; James 5:14) and by deliverance in the name of Jesus.
(Mark 16:17)

Personal Opinion: Yes the Church believes in healing, miracles and exorcism.

13. We believe in the table of the Lord, commonly called the Communion or the Lord's Supper, for believers.
(1 Corinthians 11:28-32; Matthew 26:26-2 Cool

14. We believe in the reality and personality of the Devil and eternal judgment in the Lake of Fire for the Devil and his angels.
(Matthew 25:41; Revelation 20:14-15)

15. We believe in the eternal life for believers (John 5:24 ; 3:16 ), and eternal punishment for the unbelievers.
(Mark 9:43-48; 2 Thessalonians 1:9; Revelation 20:10-15)

Personal Opinion: That settles it, non-believers go to hell - period. Not happy, you can flame, but the statement stands. For one, I didn't even write it.

16. We believe that there is one true universal Church, made up of genuine believers, but this one universal Church is also composed of many local Churches in given localities. These Churches are under the sovereign headship of the Lord Jesus Christ, exercising autonomous government under Him, administering all its local affairs and ministry, as well as the propagation of the gospel.
(Acts 15:22; Matthew 16:18; 18:15-20)

Personal Opinion: There are many Harvest family Churches in SE Asia, included related/funded orphanages, schools, etc. A large portion of the member's offerings goes into this - not just that building.

17. We believe that Government is ordained of God, and the powers that be are ordained as ministers of God to us for good. To resist the powers and the ordinances is to resist the ordinance of God. We are subject not only for wrath sake but for conscience sake, rendering to all their dues, custom to whom custom, fear to whom fear, honor to whom honor. We declare our loyalty to our Government and its leaders, and will assist in every way possible, consistent with our faith in the scriptures as Christian citizens.
(Romans 13)

Personal Opinion: Romans eh? Yah, someone was wondering how come ISD didn't treat CHC as a cult?

Well, I'm sure this will be useful, whether you are a believer or not, CHC or not, its better that you can put your argument with some substance with understanding of what you are talking about - rather than screaming OMG! THEY ARE BRAINWASHED! OMG! BURN THEM! things like that.[/b]

what happens to the muslims and other religions?

hxm SG

btw…issit illegal to spread religion in singapore? jus asking.

Ogbunwezeh SG

I got the same experience. My friend from CHC keep calling me n pestering me to go to her church as if trying to do some sales or selling insurance. I keep rejecting her saying tat i not interested. She dun give up until a point whereby she send me 3 invitation card. The moment i receive it, i juz throw away. feel like asking her dun waste money on card, postal service etc, use the money to help the needy in stead

Ogbunwezeh SG

vito_corleone SG

i agree! Laughing

coffeeortea SG

same.. have a few friends who go there.. and i was pissed when they kept asking me to join them..

dO|pH|n3 a.k.a JaMiE SG

I mean the way that you do it totally wrong. Someone or rather your friends spend his/her time to buy the stamp and wrote something for you and you just throw it away,just by doing that. How would you feel when someone did that do you?

You are being self-centered. The reason why they ask you to go is because they are concern about your life. If you think life is about me,myself. Then you are really self-fish. I tell you if your friend don't care about you, they won't ask you go even if you die, they don't even care.

People invite you just go lah, as if it will kill you and asking you to go and NOT asking you to accept their religion. Nobody force you too even for your friend. You think you are so great? Who you think you are, ask you so many times, many of the times are rejected. Ask yourself this question, what for they spend they money and time on you. What benefit do they have? How would you feel when people reject you.

One last thing, and many times I have to say it again. If you do not belong to that church, please do not say something you THINK it is correct. They have their own belief too. They don't believe in money will drop from heaven but by sowing and reaping,just a farmer planting a seed and in due season, they will reap to a good fruit will can use it to sell.

That also goes for other churches as well, don't say something that as if you know everything from there. There are a lot of things you still donno. If you think you know, then you are nothing more then a denier.

snk86 SG

Kid, put it this way, you care for someone, you expect NOTHING in return, i am sure you know that, people throw away your mail without reading, you should still graciously take this fact as it is God that is rejected, not you, making a fuss out of it is just plain un-Christ like.

you say people invite you just go lah, lol, not like you don't know how aggressive your church is, i was there once, some christmas thingy, then need to leave early as my church's own service there need me do something, one of your usher just come over and tell me "our pastor don't like people leaving half way". Tell me, is this the way to treat a newcomer? My Dad is the IC of our church's FTA(first time attender) ministry, and we all know the basic fact that you give the newcomer the best impression, we are not self centred people, we are God centred people. what is it with comments like "our pastor don't like it'??

and lastly, are you sure what you said is pleasing to God's eye? seriously, i do not wish to start an argument with you, i just hope you can think about what you are saying, really.

To the other non-CHCers: pai seh guys, got to talk THEIR language lah, or else cannot get thru to them one :p

M©+square SG

I really like your statement about God being rejected over the letter and not those who post it. Nice.
Evangelism to them has become a quota target reaching duty.

I personally feel that leaving halfway in the midst of service is not right, but you do have the right reason to do so.

The fault here is from the usher. 'Our pastor don't like....'
He didn't present his pastor and the reverance of the service in the right light.
In this area, i feel that it's the usher's inexperience way to deal with people. Again i would say, the leadership have the right intent. But somehow the message was passed down with unclear intent already.

Cheers

teekh SG

woah rejecting invitations also wrong ar?

How about accepting to go to a charity dinner or something of that sort invited by your non-christian friends? Seriously, I doubt you would give a hoot too...unless you have NO non-christian friends in the first place Laughing

MrBach SG

1) "I mean the way that you do it totally wrong. Someone or rather your friends spend his/her time to buy the stamp and wrote something for you and you just throw it away,just by doing that. How would you feel when someone did that do you?"

Response:

If it's a question of accepting what is merely a stamp that my friends have bought for me and intend to be giving to me as a gift, then I would agree that it is true that I would be doing them a disservicing (all other things being equal) if I were to throw back into their faces the stamp that they have bought for me.

However, rejecting openly the invitation to attend the sevices of a church that someone may issue to me (regardless of whether or not he is a friend of mine), on the grounds that the said church professes beliefs and endorses practices that are in my opinion dangerous, would not be tantamount to doing this particular person a disservice.

In asking me or in otherwise inviting me to attend the services of his church (regardless of the trouble he may have been put through, in order for him to have been able to do this), this person ought to realise that the right is entirely reserved to me to refuse this invitation; and that because I may refuse it on the grounds that I disagree profoundly with some of the practices and beliefs of his church, it would follow therefore that I would be not only entitled to refuse his invitation to attend his church but even indeed to do so in a way that would have left him in no doubt as to where I stood concerning my esteem of his church.

To accept a gift like a rubber ball (where the giver of the rubber ball was well-intentioned in giving it and where one knew of his good intentions in this regard) would be an action that in itself would be moral; but to accept an invitation to attend a church would, however, not be necesarrily moral even if one should have been made aware of the fact that the person issuing such an invitation had no ulterior motives for having issued it.

In fact, the people issuing an invitation to others to attend their church have ABSOLUTELY NO RIGHT WHATSOEVER to take it personally when this invitation of theirs is turned down openly; for in inviting another person to their church, they ought to realise that this person may have conscientious and sincerely felt objections to whatever it is that their church may stand for.

2) "If this will be done onto you. How would you feel as a Christian?"

Response:

If you believe that it would be good for them to attend your church, then their refusal of your invitation ought to fill you with sadness at the prospect of what it may entail for them; on the contrary rather, their refusal of your invitation appears to have induced you to begin feeling sorry for yourself, as if you should have felt yourself personally slighted by their refusal in this regard.

This very response of yours (that is, the fact that you should be taking it so personally) demonstrates to my mind what a narcissistic and self-absorbed and deluded individual you are.

3) "You are being self-centered. The reason why they ask you to go is because they are concern about your life. If you think life is about me,myself. Then you are really self-fish. I tell you if your friend don't care about you, they won't ask you go even if you die, they don't even care."

Response:

If you don't yourself think that 'life is about you and yourself', then why feel yourself so slighted by their refusal to accept your invitation to them to attend your church?

It is ridiculous to assume that it is because you care for them, that you have asked them to attend the services of your church.

How do you know that you care for them?

I can assure them that Christ cares for them because I believe that He gave His Sacred Blood on the Cross for them (and for me), but I would think twice myself about making grandiose claims about the affection that I supposedly bear them.

Do you think (as you appear above to have ignorantly implied) that a person's care for someone else is necesarily made manifest in and by an invitation that he issues to this particular person to attend his church?

I don't deny that if A loves B then it is plausible that A, by way of loving B, would invite B to his church; but I do deny nonetheless that one of the ways in which it would be afforded us enough of a warrant as to be certain that A loves B, is by our seeing A invite B to his church.

If you can't grasp this basic point, then you are truly pathetic.

4) "People invite you just go lah, as if it will kill you and asking you to go and NOT asking you to accept their religion. Nobody force you too even for your friend. You think you are so great? Who you think you are, ask you so many times, many of the times are rejected. Ask yourself this question, what for they spend they money and time on you. What benefit do they have? How would you feel when people reject you."

Reponse:

Who asked them to 'spend their time and money' on the people they have decided that they should be inviting to their church?

I'm not sure what 'benefits' they may or may not hope to derive from their evangelistic efforts, but I do know that for a fact that once, someone has been made a part of your church by way of his becoming a member of it, then he is going to be expected to contribute regularly a portion of his monthly income to your church's coffers.

I don't deny that the people involved in these evangelistic efforts may themselves not profit monetarily from the success of these efforts; but that does not mean that in some other way they may not have already reckoned that by the success of these efforts they should be able to derive a benefit, especially since it is clear that they are greatly inclined take the failure of these efforts in a highly personal fashion.

In rejecting their inivitation to attend their church, why must they deem this to be a rejection of themselves?

In any case, since it is a question of an invitation to attend a church, then why should you think that it would be impossible for me to feel conscionably that it would indeed (in a sense) serve to 'kill me to attend your church'?

What if I feel that Christ compels me to refuse to attend your church?

And what if I feel that it would be a sin for me to attend your church and to expose myself to teachings and practices that I regard as false and abominable?

You are so pathetically deluded that I feel that it would be pointless for me to carry on this conversation.

Kimosabe SG

Go away…

Ogbunwezeh SG

My friend tat keep forcing me to go to CHC so call herself the minister of god/christian, something like tat. Think she wanna increase her popularity in the church by bringing in more new comer n new face. Hence i reject all her invitation… I’m not playing this type of senseless game with her.

hxm SG

that time my neighbour ask me to go to the indoor stadium for the service. wah lau still make tv show. might as well donate to those ppl in need.

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