Army boys should not be allowed on public buses

Fantagf SG

Agreed, Fantagf.

OOPs, by saying so parn may say it again ==== I am sucking balls of guys here. Truly, I don't. I speak the truth.

sgdiehard SG

It is just a suggestion. As I mentioned earlier, do not let ego take the better of one's better judgement.

ego judgement? where got? it is only I sweat you don't.

Crazydeezee SG

Fantagf said:

"OOPs, by saying so parn may say it again ==== I am sucking balls of guys here. Truly, I don't. I speak the truth."

Siding with NSmen posters =/= sucking guys' balls. Don't worry, Fantagf.

There are guys who side with the troll (TM), yet i haven't accused them of sucking its tits. I may accuse them of other things, like being unreasonable and failing to empathise with (other) NSmen. Yet i haven't simply jumped to the conclusion that they're trying to curry favour with women.

In fact, claiming that you're simply sucking men's balls is itself a sexist statement. It implies that women must side with other women, regardless of how unreasonable or malicious the latter's comments are.

Fryderyk HPH SG

Fryderyk HPH said:

"There is a group of people saying that NS Men should take greater social and moral responsibility when they are out in public(spray dunnoe what and others to "beautify" themselves) and there is another group saying that that is unreasonable and there came the war of words which got downright personal."

I don't think it's that simple.

Unfortunately, there's a group that said:

1.) NSmen should be banned from public buses

2.) An NSman's kindness is insignificant compared to the fact that he dirtied my seat

3.) NSmen are green monsters and a hazard to the public, and not least to me and my children

4.) NSmen attract sick faces (tasteful, indeed)

5.) NSmen are mere useless boy scouts. That they give up a good part of their lives to do a job they dislike for people who don't appreciate them is not enough. We must say that just because NSmen may not be as good as first-world armies, it also follows that they are useless braggarts. Indeed, NSmen are cowards and, implicitly, only heroes like us can do a better job of protecting the country.

6.) NSmen's efforts to alleviate or at least explain the situation do not matter. It does not matter that they make the effort to clean up, that they face obstacles in cleaning up, and that often cleaning up turns out futile. All that matters is that they stink, pollute our precious space, and should be forced out of it.

7.) In fact, while we're at it, let's heap on ad hominem attacks. Let's not just attack NSmen's smell, let's attack their characters. Then howl about being threatened when they respond angrily.

There's much more that i can list, but i believe i've made my point clear.

It's not just a question of people requesting social responsibility vs egotistical unreasonable NSmen. What it

Those 7 points borders on extreme opinions. But if your side stops, their side will, too.

Fantagf SG

Siding with NSmen posters =/= sucking guys' balls. Don't worry, Fantagf.

I don't side anyone, I just speak the truth. Besides, I believe if given a choice many parents won't want their kids serve NS.

Crazydeezee SG

[continued from above]

Therefore, the Troll's statement implies that women shouldn't have the freedom to form their own opinions. And that they shouldn't have the freedom to choose whose viewpoints they truly think are valid, because their "choice" must be dictated by gender.

I say again, that is *sexist.

Crazydeezee SG

Fantagf said:

"I don't side anyone, I just speak the truth. Besides, I believe if given a choice many parents won't want their kids serve NS."

It's ok, i understand now. Sorry if i misinterpreted your earlier post =S.

caleb_chiang SG

if given a choice, many guys would not want to serve as well.

Crazydeezee SG

Fryderyk HPH said:

"Those 7 points borders on extreme opinions. But if your side stops, their side will, too."

I have no intention of making further "extreme" statements about the other side.

But i also have no intention of stopping the others from venting their anger. Among other things, it'd be *presumptuous to tell them that they can't be angry for being insulted this way.

sgdiehard SG

Those 7 points borders on extreme opinions. But if your side stops, their side will, too.

huhh...so NS guys can use public transport or not?

Fryderyk HPH SG

huhh...so NS guys can use public transport or not?

LOL ok coz can mah~... That is what they are doing now anyways. Is just the matter of the smell...

Go out for lunch and see doctor now. Anything hor, PM me.

SingaporeTyrannosaur SG

I think Parn's questions show she really departed reality.

I think a stay with some army boys for a week or two should straighten her out.

And yet again with the useless guys can't get pregnant thing so just serve NS... a woman can choose if she can get pregnant or not... it is not a state-mandated duty for her to get pregnant in her lifetime. If the state makes it so that she has to get pregnant for national service then we're talking, unless that happens parn will just be parn.

Which is epic fail.

LOL.

Fryderyk HPH SG

I think Parn's questions show she really departed reality.

I think a stay with some army boys for a week or two should straighten her out.

Which is epic fail.

LOL.

Lets not get personal shall we... We will and must all learn about agreeing to disagree.

SingaporeTyrannosaur SG

But for the sake of comedy:

1) Do you admit that army boys stink and spread their BO on public transport without any form of consideration for public opinions?

No.

If you think so please state personal experiences, gather the data and find out if this is strong experiences and impressions from a limited set of data

From what I know, when I take the MRT from Boon Lay which is near lots of pple from SISPEC and OCS, as well as armour and what have you not, I do not experience any real case of BO from them. Indeed, given that there are often 20-50 of them in one MRT if they did stink it would be pretty obvious.

I think NSboys=stink is a sterotype.

2) Do you agree that this problem can be avoided or resolved easily if the army boys regards public opinions considerably to contain and reduce their stink and BO before they hop onto public transport?

Yawn... if they didn't then they would stink. But they don't.

3) Do you agree that army boys wearing their uniform should do their best to uphold their image as protector of this country and take considerate amount of personal responsibility to ensure they present/project only their best appearance/odour to the public and especially when they are in the public?

You quite obviously have no idea what the OCS guys book out as do you? This is because it seems you talk long before you know how things are actually done.

4) Do you agree that Singapore army boys has much to learn from overseas army boys in other non-third world countries regarding public behaviour and image?

Can you please site an example? Which country? NPNT.

5) Do you agree that it is also unacceptable for Singaporean guys who has been in the army or currently in the army, to discuss about personal/group slayings using army equipments to threaten and terrorise anonymous forumers in an online forum?

On anonymous trolls who fail to apperciate the personal sacrifice our boys make, it's probably too light a sentence.

BTW, flashbangs are hardly lethal, given we are exposed to it all the time in training. The fact you seem to think it's a "slaying" shows your general lack of empathy, understanding, of interest in anything military.

In fact it seems to me your approach to this topic would sit very well with the Westbro Baptist folks.

Have a nice day.

Crazydeezee SG

Singapore Tyrannosaur said:

"I think Parn's questions show she really departed reality.

I think a stay with some army boys for a week or two should straighten her out.

Which is epic fail.

LOL."

There's much more to that. We respect the commitments and sacrifices of women who endure pregnancy. But we don't see that as an excuse to hammer "useless" men. Often (but sadly not always), these "useless men" do everything they can to help such women through that pregnancy. Just as many (but sadly not all) women help their men (boyfriends, friends, relatives, even strangers!) go through NS in whatever ways they can..

But i digress. This thread is *not about pregnancy vs NS. It is *not about men vs women.

It is about *people requesting decency vs those who would not only deny it, but maliciously attack the characters of the former.

Simply put, the Troll has lost all credibility. That is, assuming it had any in the 1st place. Its opinions are not worth consideration, except *maybe the consideration that one gives to a fly being swatted.

That's the wonderful thing about these forums. I realised i don't need an M16 or bayonet to make my point clear. Just let the moron make a fool of itself for everyone to see.

How delightfully simple.

Crazydeezee SG

Troll said:

"5) Do you agree that it is also unacceptable for Singaporean guys who has been in the army or currently in the army, to discuss about personal/group slayings using army equipments to threaten and terrorise anonymous forumers in an online forum?"

Oh dear. For something that bitches about NSmen being over-sensitive wimps, this howling is reeally overboard. "threaten"? "terrorise"? Trolls should really spare us the histrionics. Anyone knows it's a bloody joke.

Perhaps the troll needs to go to, oh, Aunt Agony's Forum?

Aang SG

ts nvr put urself in the shoes of those army guys.. try thinking if u r the one training to defend the country..

SingaporeTyrannosaur SG

Lets not get personal shall we... We will and must all learn about agreeing to disagree.

This is hardly an argument in anycase. It's a black tar brush that blots out all the risks and sacrifices people have made, sometimes the ultimate sacrifice, over all these years.

That's why I say no need to argue, just put Parn in an frontline infantry unit for a few weeks outfield, she'll get the picture.

In any case, even the whole premise of her argument is flawed. Most NS men don't even book out stinking. You don't do that in SISPEC, and certainly not in OCS, and your main posting would certainly give you time to figure your personal stuff out before leaving camp.

The most likely candidate I see for probably stinking would be the tekong-bound recruit who is more keen on booking out and taking the short cuts to do so.

So basically they are crying foul about a very small proportion of the military, which is okay if taken in proportion and addressed issue by issue. But trying to say the entire force of 250,000 people stink just because they wear green is a bit of a bad joke. Saying that these 250,000 people are whimps is not a joke, it's vulgar.

And if it's such an issue go raise it with the press like the dog or cat issues. But personally I don't have an issue with this. In my personal experience I haven't come across the chow recruit in public, and most of the people in green i meet in public do not stink.

Basically, TS is a troll, and Parn is kinda sad for actually taking TS seriously. As I said, two weeks outfield would be good for her.

Crazydeezee SG

Singapore Tyrannosaur said:

On anonymous trolls who fail to apperciate the personal sacrifice our boys make, it's probably too light a sentence. "

Fail to appreciate is bad enough. Actively, maliciously, thoughtlessly insult- is *far worse*.

SingaporeTyrannosaur SG

But i digress. This thread is *not about pregnancy vs NS. It is *not about men vs women.

It is about *people requesting decency vs those who would not only deny it, but maliciously attack the characters of the former.

That's the wonderful thing about these forums. I realised i don't need an M16 or bayonet to make my point clear. Just let the moron make a fool of itself for everyone to see.

How delightfully simple.

Basically this, if Parn wants to use the pregnancy tack, then can we say that all women who do not have children or choose to remain childless are cowards and a disgrace to womenkind for forsaking their duty?

Of course not. That point has no logical congruence at all and it's not even the way we view motherhood.

Which is a bit discusting, because I suspect her view of motherhood does not glorify it or give it the respect it deserves... it is if anything, disgraced and dishonoured by being used as ammunition in her pseudo-feminist arguments.

Imagine the uproar that will be caused if some joker started a thread on how pregnant women are a liability on the train because they always need seats that other same-fare paying passengers have to give up. Imagine the uproar when they suggest that maybe pregnant women should pay more because they have seats reserved for them or should just not take the train and get a taxi instead.

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