Social Welfare Health costs

last SG · 2008-06-14T11:25:42+00:00

We need to pay ministers high salaries to remain competitive.We need to pay workers low salaries to remain competitive.Yeah."Man is the only creature that co...

maurizio13 SG

This article says it all. I am surprise that our fellow Singaporeans can think otherwise..

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/12/opinion/12sun1.html

I think quoting stories from exterior source hardly lends credibility to your story, because these journalist are not the real citizens living here, bearing the brunt of the medical cost, they only have a non-participatory view. When you are in the system where public services are marked up exhorbitantly, it's a totally different story.

Health services are satisfactory, but cost are in the extremes.

That's why there's an adage in Singapore "可以死，不可以病” (you can die, but you can't fall ill).

Falling in to a chronic illness will drain the financial resources from your immediate family causing more financial distress to your family members.

£Ĭ€ڰ SG

That's cheap when compared to Singapore.

3 child deliveries only $300, medication only $15, cap for medication is $50.

I believe you must be having the wrong impression that Health Insurance in america is free? And you think american doctors and hospitals dont profiteer from their fellow americans meh? infact I read that America has the highest per capita expenditure on healthcare but the problem is that the money doesnt translate into benefits for the poorer people, but rather the health workers.

How much PROFIT do your reckon Singapore government make from healthcare?

PS. the subject is social welfare cost, not HDB.

DeerHunter SG

Singapore has no natural resources such minerals or huge agricultural tracts to provide revenues for social spending. Much of such revenues come from us, the citizens of our Singapore society, where the strong protects the weak.

In 1965, MM Lee cried when we got kick out of the Msian federation. He realized the enormity of the deed. We had nothing except a small port to depend on. Even our own asset, the People were largely uneducated.

He fought long and bitterly hard against race supremacists so that we singaporeans may live in a mutli racial society free from discrimination. With that kick, and without economic support, he despaired and feared leading our people to their doom.

But those tears were only momentarily. With the late Dr GohKS and Rajaratnam, his team set about the world to bring investments in, to provide jobs for the largely uneducated people. But such revenues from businesses were not enough for social spending.

Those gleaming towers, spotless MRT, fanciful schools with world class education standards today you see is the hardwork of MM Lee's team and our previous generation. It is thru their CPF contributions, tax contributions combined with other trade revenues that made Singapore what it is today.

Very often govt will tax the rich to help the poor. While Spore does not cripple the rich with taxes till they don't invest to create jobs, our most middle class bears taxes daily thru GST. But then such gst comes with free will - if you don't need goods, you don't need to pay any gst. And such gst costs a mere few cents on staples, but such mere cents goes towards helping social expenditure to help the poor thru education to escape poverty, and health care subsidies to help them get medical aid.

With a huge CPF fund, the govt invests it prudently for long term, so as not to use more taxation to provide for social spending.

We may be paying more, but such monies are used to help others. We Singaporean are a generous lot. We may grumble, but we donate generously to other nations, so we too can help our own.

Before anyone accuse the govt of 'profiteering', do show which pockets the 'profits' went into.

jojobeach SG

That's cheap when compared to Singapore.

3 child deliveries only $300, medication only $15, cap for medication is $50.

In Singapore, wonder if $5,000 enough for ONE baby delivery; medication cap of $50, I know of some old folks here, their per visit to polyclinic already exceed that amount.

At least the US government is not out to profiteer from it's citizens by exhorbitant medical charges. They mark up the price of all the services, then proceed to give you a discount, then they tell you they give you 50% subsidy, which is in fact a discount.

Same story with HDB flats, they price the flats according to market rates, then give you a discount, but actual building cost is a whole lot less. Then they proclaim that they give you a hefty discount for your HDB flats.

This technique used by retailers of the past, mark up higher, then give you a 50% discount, but they still make alot after the discount.

Actually it is all relative lah.

If you are single.. you will feel you are paying too much , because you hardly get to use the benefit.

When you become older, you visit doctor more often due to more wear and tear of your body parts, that's when you start to appreciate insurance coverage.

When you are inflicted with a serious illness, you no need to worry about sky high debts.

When you married with kids, you no need to worry any of your children are more sickly than the others.

In actual fact.. a child birth do cost about $5000 - $8000 normal birth. But if you are covered under insurance, you pay the co-pay of $300... the rest insurance cover lah.

So if you have no insurance cover, you need to pay $5000-$8000 out of your own pocket.

About the HDB issue.. our gahmen was never truthful with the cost.

My friend from the construction industry ever told me before. It is not very expensive to build a HDB block. We are paying a lot more than the actual cost of construction. And we also wonder where those profit goes to. The only answer we seem to get is that .. it is already heavily subsidised, but how we know if they don;t reveal the actual cost ?

From then onwards.. I start to have doubts about my ex-heros ( MIW). Then more and more they lost my confidence and trust....

£Ĭ€ڰ SG

Jojo, how much do you have to pay for health insurance in america?

maurizio13 SG

With a huge CPF fund, the govt invests it prudently for long term, so as not to use more taxation to provide for social spending.

We may be paying more, but such monies are used to help others. We Singaporean are a generous lot. We may grumble, but we donate generously to other nations, so we too can help our own.

Before anyone accuse the govt of 'profiteering', do show which pockets the 'profits' went into.

The MIW's pockets with their multi million dollar salaries and other fringe benefits.

jojobeach SG

With a huge CPF fund, the govt invests it prudently for long term, so as not to use more taxation to provide for social spending.

We may be paying more, but such monies are used to help others. We Singaporean are a generous lot. We may grumble, but we donate generously to other nations, so we too can help our own.

Before anyone accuse the govt of 'profiteering', do show which pockets the 'profits' went into.

Ahhh.. the money goes into the million lollar salary our minister gets. NO ?

Yes... Mr Lee is our savior when we became orphaned.

But why now they start to skin the people alive ?

You must be still a student issit ?

Trust me.. I used to be like you.

I worshipped Mr LKY. I loved him. I sang his praises to everyone who dares tell me Mr LKY is a evil man. I hiss at them for defiling my hero.

But today. . my eyes are open.

I see what kind of greedy people they are.

I look at the poor old people collecting carton boxes. I see them living lonely and eating porridge in their one room flats.

I see those who are ill dare not get treatment because they cannot afford to.

I see the parents of children worrying about the future they will face.

I see aunties and uncles replaced by foreign workers.

While my hero declares he and the top ministers deserves millions.

I became ashamed... I no longer feel his love for his people.. anymore.

maurizio13 SG

Ahhh.. the money goes into the million lollar salary our minister gets. NO ?

Yes... Mr Lee is our savior when we became orphaned.

But why now they start to skin the people alive ?

You must be still a student issit ?

Trust me.. I used to be like you.

I worshipped Mr LKY. I loved him. I sang his praises to everyone who dares tell me Mr LKY is a evil man. I hiss at them for defiling my hero.

But today. . my eyes are open.

I see what kind of greedy people they are.

I look at the poor old people collecting carton boxes. I see them living lonely and eating porridge in their one room flats.

I see those who are ill dare not get treatment because they cannot afford to.

I see the parents of children worrying about the future they will face.

I see aunties and uncles replaced by foreign workers.

While my hero declares he and the top ministers deserves millions.

I became ashamed... I no longer feel his love for his people.. anymore.

Same here. I used to be a hard core supporter of P4P when I was a student, but after working for sometime, I have opened my eyes to the ways of the MIW.

I guess it's because of the brain washing of students when they are in schools, after you have spent some time working and travelling around the world. You will realise the evil ways of the MIW. However I stand corrected, because there are some who still persist in their stupidity, perhaps the current situation is beneficial to them, while others lack the mental capacity to understand.

You have to think objectively to understand the issues, not being partial to either sides.

jojobeach SG

Jojo, how much do you have to pay for health insurance in america?

I pay about $250/mth for a single person

A family of four may pay about $350-400.mth.

And that is private insurance with better options. I can choose the doctor I want, no limitations.

This is also including dental.

jojobeach SG

Jojo, how much do you have to pay for health insurance in america?

You can go to this link to get a free quote.

ehealthinsurance

jojobeach SG

Same here. I used to be a hard core supporter of P4P when I was a student, but after working for sometime, I have opened my eyes to the ways of the MIW.

You have to think objectively to understand the issues, not being partial to either sides.

Yes, I agree. More so when I came here to live with my brother.

I now understand what is truly the "golden years".

There are senior villages where people who are old do not depend on their children for a living. They are independent and they are enjoying their old age. They live with dignity and pride.

They move freely and do what they want to do.

Unlike LKY's idea of old age.. a Singaporean's old age.. is just... pathetic.

In SG.. it is not the golden years... I think it is more like the "dreaded years".

SBS7484P SG

deer hunter another clone of gazelle?

£Ĭ€ڰ SG

Actually I am the total opposite. I used to be a anti-PAP supporter when i was still a student. However when I start to understand more about economic and the effect of globalization, I start to understand the underlying reasons of many government policies.

e.g, Many might argue the Singapore politicians are overpaid, however I believe that it is better for us to know who much they are paid instead of guessing how much they are profiteering from their position as ministers. Beside that, I also see the sacrifice the ministers have to make despite of their million dollar salaries. Personally, I would rather make $200,000 a year and enjoy your life to the fullest working in the private sector, instead of making $1m a year and not be able to live the life of a "normal" millionaire?

maurizio13 SG

deer hunter another clone of gazelle?

DeerHunter and £Ĭ€ڰ are both clones of Gazelle.

He has no supporters in here, that's why he is trying to create more clones to support his claim.

jojobeach SG

Sacrifice ? What sacrifice ?

They work 24 hours ? They have to put their life at risks ?

What ?

What kind of sacrifice is worth 3 million lollars ?

£Ĭ€ڰ SG

Sacrifice ? What sacrifice ?

They work 24 hours ? They have to put their life at risks ?

What ?

What kind of sacrifice is worth 3 million lollars ?

Assuming you are 85 years old, you, your children and grandchildren all have more than enough $ to live a comfortable life for the rest of their life. Your wife of almost 60 years is critically ill in hospital and could be dying anytime. Would you take time off and retire from work to be with your wife and family or will you rather continue to fly 20 hours to Russia, Middle East etc to develop bilateral ties for your country?

Personally I dont think it is humanly possible to work for 24 hours a day, however I must say that you do need many hours of discipline reading routine and exercising in order to become a walking CPU in global affairs at age of 85. I guess you should start reading some of his interviews and speeches (with a clear and open mind) and then compare him to another 85 years old, in order to understand why he is what he is today.

DeerHunter SG

Profiteering? If indeed there is profiteering, then the sums would be in billions and not the millions needed to fund our civil servants.

The ministerial pays forms only a small fraction of our annual Budget. No matter how high or low, it will be significant to some. There are already several views on the matter, and no need to repeat them.

But i will offer you a new insight.

By the late 70s, Singapore had a great economy. MM LKY could have rewarded his team with high salaries such as of today and many would not had begrudged them. They did a good job of turning around our nation back on its feet. Many had jobs, homes and a taste of the good life our neighbours never knew, even till today.

Yet they didn't. They were the original team who devoted their lives to lift ours. Money wasn't everything to them.

Unfortunately, times had changed. Many of the old guards had passed on. A newer generation had grown up living off the hardwork of our previous generation. They were educated. And mobile.

Who wants to rule the country, get pissed and scolded for even small slights? The newer guys rather take on smaller responsibilities and more money from the private sector.

An analogy of a social worker and his peer.

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An enthusiastic man who wants to help society, studied hard, obtained his degree and went into social work. He was paid $2,500. His friends went on to the private sector, and in time, got promoted and earn $25,000/mth, with some even more. They could buy cars, condos and goes on holidays, had pretty wives and lovely children.

The social worker in time, when the enthusiasm wears off, look at his paltry salary which couldn't even afford a roof, let alone a wife, soon loses hope with his long hours. He finally throws in the towel and join his friends in their careers with his degrees.

I am not casting aspersions on social workers. There are, thank goodness, real dedicated ones that made a difference to lives. But they are few and far between.

Thus, in order to attract people such as our original team of founders, money is the only way, so that they may not lose out to their peers and have equally high social standing with them. We Singaporeans had never been adverse to paying for the best, just look at our homes and cars.

Similarly, to manage our country and economy, we better get the best, if not the best, at least the capable, and not some El Cheapo clown to rule over us.

Furthermore, there will be lesser, ( not no) temptation for corruption. Those that are found guilty with evidence, i personally will lead a lynch mob to hang him, if MM LKY doesn't hang him first!

MM Lee had been hated by some and his die-hard enemies, reviled by them, but he doesn't fear them or more shit thrown. he don't need the money, but he knows he will pass on one day, thus he took this flak to ensure his legacy that our citizens will enjoy the continued freedom previous generations had enjoyed under capable administration, paid right.

jojobeach SG

Isn't he essentially hoarding the work of the Prime Minister ?

His dear son is suppose to be leading the country, NOT HIM.

Why do we need a Prime Minister for ? Teach me how to sing majulah singapura issit ?

If he thinks his son is not good enough to take over his position, then give it to someone else who CAN.

And to leave his wife during this critical time... dude.. is Russia or Middle East going anywhere soon ? Bilateral ties ? What are the benefits ?

If those Russian and Middle Eastern leaders hears of him abandoning his dying wife to go have tea with them... what do you think they will think of your dear Mr LKY ???

jojobeach SG

Profiteering? If indeed there is profiteering, then the sums would be in billions and not the millions needed to fund our civil servants.

But i will offer you a new insight.

Yet they didn't. They were the original team who devoted their lives to lift ours. Money wasn't everything to them.

Unfortunately, times had changed. Many of the old guards had passed on. A newer generation had grown up living off the hardwork of our previous generation. They were educated. And mobile.

Who wants to rule the country, get pissed and scolded for even small slights? The newer guys rather take on smaller responsibilities and more money from the private sector.

An analogy of a social worker and his peer.

---------------------------------------------------

I am not casting aspersions on social workers. There are, thank goodness, real dedicated ones that made a difference to lives. But they are few and far between.

Similarly, to manage our country and economy, we better get the best, if not the best, at least the capable, and not some El Cheapo clown to rule over us.

Furthermore, there will be lesser, ( not no) temptation for corruption. Those that are found guilty with evidence, i personally will lead a lynch mob to hang him, if MM LKY doesn't hang him first!

Excuse me hor.

We the people.. also don mind paying for the best.

But are we really getting the best of the best anot ?

We pay our ministers first world pay.

But is our country really first world yet ? Are we getting close yet ?

Dude.. you really need to go travel around the world a bit more.

See with yourself.. talk to the people who lives in 1st world countries.

Then you come tell me .. are our ministers worth the money anot lah.

Devil1976 SG

100th..

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