All out to defame our governement

last SG · 2007-06-07T10:34:23+00:00

Not in biomed business, but believe such hubs exist in many places besides Australia and Singapore. not interested in disputing what the australians have est...

january SG

by jontst

Are there many countries with oppressed people and yet still prosperous? Oppressed in this context meaning a similar one party rule, with opposition oppressed?
Or rather, in terms of Press Freedom and human rights ranking, are those countries in the same ranking category as Singapore less or more prosperous

what is considered same ranking catrgory as singapore? is there any sources to see?

Jontst78 SG

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Press_Freedom_Index#Worldwide_press_freedom_index

Take a look at those that are near Singapore's ranking. 147 (I think we are lower than that now) Ranked below somalia, afghanistan.

Gazelle SG

a) Why are you not complaining when M13 is talking about ejeculating sperms into people's mouth? is it because birds of same feathers are suppose to sratch each other's back?

b) If you are referring to the language use against some di.ck headed, white pri.ck sucker from pussieland, who always call us sillyporeans and sinkapore, I think he deserve it, because he has no respect for the people living in this country. Period!!

soul_rage SG

Originally posted by Gazelle:
Answer qn 2 pls. Is Govt = PAP? Are you sure? Look at the example I quote, and answer is Govt = PAP?

a) You say you dislike the government, who exactly are you referring to or is it everybody who draw their salary from the government.

b) Are you sure PAP cannot use HDB upgrading as a carrot for sway vote?? Please do some reading on that, because that is suppose to be one big news coming from potong pasir election.

don't understand your (a)
(b) I am asking you, you think its right for them to do that? An election is a political party battle, not Govt vs opposition parties. On all moral and ethical grounds, they CANNOT use taxpayers money (in this case HDB upgrading) as a tool for their political gains, because PAP is PAP, PAP is NOT the Govt.

Of coz they have been using that for so many years, but its becoz even they themselves have messed up their own minds, thinking that PAP = Govt.

If you think its fair and square that they can use upgrading as a tool to sway votes, that by all fairness, the people living in Potong Pasir and Hougang should pay lesser taxes.

Originally posted by soul_rage:
When you say we are emotional, aren't you emotional yourself?
You go about sprouting vulgarities at others, and you tell me you are not emotional? Answer this question on your vulgarities and abuse of other people. Don't avoid this accusation anymore (yes, I AM accusing you coz this is a FACT, YOU ABUSE others).

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a) Why are you not complaining when M13 is talking about ejeculating sperms into people's mouth? is it because birds of same feathers are suppose to sratch each other's back?

b) If you are referring to the language use against some di.ck headed, white pri.ck sucker from pussieland, who always call us sillyporeans and sinkapore, I think he deserve it, because he has no respect for the people living in this country. Period!!

Who started all the abuse? M13 reacted becoz you abused people in the 1st place. The root cause was you. You went ard abusing everyone. Read my post on the vampire hunter. You want to kill and bash everyone, as long as they are on the other side of the fence (in relation to you), and you don't care whether they are having good or bad intentions.

For (b), I don't mind you calling him that, coz I don't think it is right to call Singapore Sillypore as well. Its not the country that is screwed up, its the way it is run that is causing unhappiness.

soul_rage SG

sigh...
Do you understand market pay?

If a maid is paid in the market a salary of $350, do you pay $700 or $1050 just coz she is good in her work?

There is a market for everything. You don't pay for an apple the price of a Sony TV.

In the politician's market? Are they overpaid, with regards to the current politician market (all over the world)? I am asking about the NOW, NOT the future.

I will take the liberty to tell you the FACT. Our ministers are paid 3 or 4 x more than George Bush, and you think its justified???

january SG

so given that singapore is ranked 147, then how do you reason that therefore a low ranking in press freedom leads to not prosperous country?

or it leads to what?

Gazelle SG

Originally posted by soul_rage:
don't understand your (a)
(b) I am asking you, you think its right for them to do that? An election is a political party battle, not Govt vs opposition parties. On all moral and ethical grounds, they CANNOT use taxpayers money (in this case HDB upgrading) as a tool for their political gains, because PAP is PAP, PAP is NOT the Govt.

Of coz they have been using that for so many years, but its becoz even they themselves have messed up their own minds, thinking that PAP = Govt.

If you think its fair and square that they can use upgrading as a tool to sway votes, that by all fairness, the people living in Potong Pasir and Hougang should pay lesser taxes.

You said
a) Singapore government is not PAP.
b) e.g PAP CANNOT use HDB upgrading as carrot to sway vote

Reality is
a) All ministry in Singapore are run by PAP
b) PAP does use government's money to fund HDB upgrading to sway vote.

Hence I dont understand what is there for your to explain when what you said is fundamentally wrong.

january SG

i know there is a market rate but it does not mean that we necessarily have to follow it. You cannot just look at now. Planning involve long term prediction.
If the pay rise will indeed attract capable people for the country, then it is justified.

Jontst78 SG

My point, Low press freedom doesn't equate to prosperity, and by looking at the table in the link, the more affluent countries are mostly in the blue zone. Hence, I would be lead to belive that more press freedom is actually a trademark more affluent nations.

fymk SG

Think monopoly ...think ....microsoft ....then apply .......

Jontst78 SG

I think in this context, "cannot" meant, "morally not right?"

Hence, its not right for PAP to use HDB upgrading as a carrot to sway votes?

january SG

there are countries that have higher press freedom but their country are not necessary more prosperous or happier.

This inference of this chart should not be : higher press freedom --> prosperity

For more prosperous country, what are the reasons for their prosperity may not be due to press freedom. It may be due to other reasons.

If you study statistics, such data are called correlational data, it does not imply casuality.

soul_rage SG

You are wrong again.
a) Ministries are not run by PAP. They are run by the ministers in the govt, whom are coincidentally PAP party members.
b) I am saying, the PAP CANNOT use the funds rightfully because the funds are funded from taxpayers, but because they monopolized the govt, they are doing an immoral thing.

Now I understand why another forum member said you are wrong to equate PAP = Govt. You can't seem to distinguish between the two.

soul_rage SG

define capable.
Are our current ministers capable? Pls justify in your opinion why you think they are capable.

If your boss asks you, whether you are capable, chances are, almost everyone will say they are capable. (Who will say I am stupid, I am lousy, I am not a good work. Fire me?)

Whether a person is capable, is judged by others on their achievements, and not just hot air from their own mouths.

Gazelle SG

This is his orginal post, does it mean morally to you?

2) This is where you are so wrong. The Govt will NEVER be the PAP. The only reason why we are caught in this stupid situation is that the PAP is running the entire govt (almost), so people tend to say Govt = PAP. For instance, during elections, the PAP CANNOT use HDB upgrading as a carrot because that is taxpayers' money for upgrading. This belongs to the GOVT, NOT the PAP, so the party cannot use the taxpayer's money as their war chest. Every person who pays taxes are entitled to equal rights for upgrading. [/b]

Gazelle SG

Soul_Rage, this is what you wrote, please rememeber and please dont simply add the word, monopolize just because fymk say monopoly and immoral just because someone esle say morally incorrect.

That really makes you look pathetic.

2) This is where you are so wrong. The Govt will NEVER be the PAP. The only reason why we are caught in this stupid situation is that the PAP is running the entire govt (almost), so people tend to say Govt = PAP. For instance, during elections, the PAP CANNOT use HDB upgrading as a carrot because that is taxpayers' money for upgrading. This belongs to the GOVT, NOT the PAP, so the party cannot use the taxpayer's money as their war chest. Every person who pays taxes are entitled to equal rights for upgrading. [/b]

soul_rage SG

Gazelle, pls don't avoid this portion that you raised.
Pls kindly advise whether you admit that you are wrong, coz there are so many FACTS in this forum of your abuse and ugliness.

january SG

i am not saying that our government is governing the country the right way now. i do not have sufficient enough of governace to know how a country should be governed and what should the country achieve for its people, happiness, money, low crime rate or what?

My stance towards government capability is on 75 % and is based on the fact the singaporean has enough money for food and basic utilities, is able to have savings

some areas of improvement for singapore govt would be to finding ways to make more singaporean wiser and more capable people, finacially knowledgable

and also reducing social ills to a minimum.

assuming that 50 % = neutral
0% = totally oppose govt every policy

soul_rage SG

Originally posted by Gazelle:

Soul_Rage, this is what you wrote, please rememeber and please dont simply add the word, monopolize just because fymk say monopoly and immoral just because someone esle say morally incorrect.

That really makes you look pathetic.

2) This is where you are so wrong. The Govt will NEVER be the PAP. The only reason why we are caught in this stupid situation is that the PAP is running the entire govt (almost), so people tend to say Govt = PAP. For instance, during elections, the PAP CANNOT use HDB upgrading as a carrot because that is taxpayers' money for upgrading. This belongs to the GOVT, NOT the PAP, so the party cannot use the taxpayer's money as their war chest. Every person who pays taxes are entitled to equal rights for upgrading. [/b]

The problem with you is that you like to grab somebody's words and try to twist them.

The above statement I made is saying, they CANNOT use HDB upgrading, coz its taxpayers' money, NOT they are NOT using HDB upgrading.

I really think you are pathetic, you have no intuition, you disgrace your parents, and you abuse everyone ard you

be careful of karma. I tend to believe its true.

Jontst78 SG

Sigh.... I actually meant it the other way around... that press freedom may actually be due to their affluence, or maybe a contributor to thier success.

And using press freedom as an example of human rights being oppressed, that there is a tendency for the more affluent nations to have higher press freedoms. Never claim that press freedom was the cause of thier affluence.

What I am saying is that economic and social stablity should not be used as reasons to oppress free speech e.g. press freedom. As there are affluent nations who are in the blue zone.

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