What So Big Deal About China

last SG · 2004-07-19T09:30:44+00:00

i think we singaporean should stop looking down on china. afterall we are chinese. it the china top foreign policy to uphold one china policy. let forget abo...

SibeiSuayKia SG

sorry about im going off topic with regards to ICBM
and Aegis...

ICBM and Aegis is enemy lor

its just like icbm is a stone

u throw icbm which is a "Stone" at ur enemy's house

the enemy use a "rubber band" which is aegis to hit the stone , so that the stone won't hit the house

ICBM is inter continental ballistic missile with a range of 6000-12000 KM

Aegis is operated with satellites , which explain the sibei super huge radar they got above thier ship's hull

the satellite den later scan the area...satellites can scan a huge area at once
once they detect heat from launch..they will alert Mr.Aegis..

den mr.Aegis will launch PAC-III missiles..to do missile-missile interception
The Anti Missile Missile has sometimes failed alot of times..thats why pple question the reliability

or maybe a land based platform lor..

about Arrow its some sort like Aegis but more of land based i think

and we got oso the Aster-60 or 90 ar..

Oh ya...About the US's...they got every way to counter every move of the enemy..Even though US's armed force may be stretched..they can still win china easily..

Last time there was a project , called satellite killer which is designed to operate as a space fighter ...to destroy enemy satellites some sort like X-Wing ba in star wars

They keep on saying 20 years china will overtake USA
but what i feel it is in terms of.. Economic stuff

but not Military..US has FAR invested billions of dollars into military stuff
trust me even by 2025 ..China's military tech won't be even at USA at 2001

The Cold War HAS Caused FAR Too Many Black projects which is designed for a super WWW III conflict..

The normal F-22 and F-16 and Apache are only weapons of conventional warfares..

The weapons which u see in those Starwars movie are the real weapons which is going to be developed...

Don't be surprise if YF-35 has space capabilities to go beyond 100 KM of altitude ..

The US has always been wary of China and Russia's Secret Military Cooperation..

Therefore the US and NATO cooperation..
My bet is on the Euro fighter + F-22 for NGF..

Eurofighter is like a beginning of F-15..which faced many problems too at its early stage..

I will surely take Euro Fighter..can slowly upgrade and with avionics..even though at early stage will encounter problems..

which project don't encounter problems?

Singapore has been supporting China and US+Taiwan
won't be surprised if Singapore support more of US after this..

US has backing of NATO and Taiwan , South Korea and Japan and quite a no. of allies in the middle east and the world

China is just appearing on the world's list..
The amount of allies China has on Europe is lesser..

and if any conflict breaks out , more will support the yanks
don't forget singapore is a critical port..in terms of exports and imports

alot of major shippings is done thru PSA..if China wants to be unfriendly well..OK..

But singapore might support china cause' we're all chinese
but hey whats up with the treatment of HongKong and Taiwan and Singapore?

LazerLordz SG

Especially when you have the USAF to brass talking about the need for a dedicated space command by 2030, developments like the Common Aero Vehicle for rapid deployment of space assets and counterforce.What we see in the current US military inventory is developed in the 60s and 70s, even the F-22 was developed in 1975 thereabouts onwards.The United States had the ability to perform an heavy scale amphibious and airborne assault on Normandy in WW2, and China is only beginning to show some ability to do limited force projection right now.What does that say about the gap in military superiority?

Qkool SG

happy to enrich my military abt SAF..

what i say just now.. china dont have the power yet to expand their oversea war troop to make singapore scare of them..

btw, althought i dont like the jap . but is it truth that jap navy is more powerful than the china navy by lot?

Qkool SG

i bet china will soon later come back to paper-tiger.

if not,why dont they pay all our inventment in china and we can use this $ to put in india etc.. i sure those country dont have to make us alway have to admit 1-china everytime in the media..and least troublesome.

zjw007 SG

So sad to know there are so many "talents" in singapore like you!

miong SG

Exclamation

SibeiSuayKia SG

Originally posted by miong:
Very interesting theories on this matter.

I would like to suggest one of the reasons for that antagonising visit -

China has side stepped Singapore in many business proposals. Singapore is not getting the right businesses that it wanted. Most of the businesses we got either ended in near disaster or have failed. I believe only DBS was able to penetrate China quite successfully only because it acquired Dao Heng Bank [b]in Hongkong.

China's official had recently branded Singapore as ARROGANT. That should speak volumes of their business intention towards us....

and don't forget this....

Singapore is one of China's main competitor and lately extremely pro-USA. Why should they want to help us prosper and compete with itself ? [/b]

LoL , True heard that a business by a singaporean company wasn't given a chance to promote itself...so sad....

Just because of something called "Pride" can dissolve friendship and money

LoL...i dunno if they got any KC-135 air tankers to project their power or any Aircraft carriers or foreign bases

all i know is that if they war taiwan in 2020...they will surely lose until like siao

They are lacking very much in foreign allies , if given a chance to take sides in the war...MORE countries will support USA compared to China cause USA will definitely be the winner

3 million PLA troops needs to be equipped with high technology weaponry, ST , being one of the biggest arms manufacturer in SEA , could effectively help the PLA to modernise and be the best.. US doesn't share weapon tech..only India and Russia share the same tech..

USA has a NGF plan for 2020..taiwan will get the YF-22 and the YF-35 which is going to have special capabilities

By the time 2020 comes , Aegis equipped tw destroyers and the US bases in KR and JP will be at their peak in strength

Haiz...im going to see more F-7 and J-10s being shot down over TW strait by YF-22 and YF-35...

and somemore China can't pre-empt or whatever...the US base is still too FAR to hit

Japan...if they secretly kept on building and did not lose WWII they would be 2 times stronger den China now..i believe

at WWII they already got Aircraft carriers to strike Pearl harbor..

China don't even have 1 operational AC to project force..
and 1 AC needs to be guarded by ...tons of ships and subs...

And furthermore...singapore got technology to build stealth boats..invisible to radar and missile ...haiz.........They are purposely doubting our intergrity.

If i were the leader , i would wait til 2050 den probably...peacefully reunify , purposely retaking would cause alot of damage for both sides..

US Has 10 Trillion Dollar Economy , where else CN has 1 Trillion Economy..
furthermore.. defense budget and research counts in alot..

1 F-22 if continuously equipped with missiles and with mid-air refuelling could down at least 5 J-10 jets

If CN really wanna take over TW , they should not ignore the sea...
SEA and the AIR is the most important followed by land..
At most they have got the israeli help....and

CN armed forces

Have not seen any combat
Not proven like Russian MIGS or SU
No advanced technology
No Stealth
No force projection
High in numbers but small in hardware..
WAR games...lol...
give me a chance i rather take US Army..at least they have fought countless of battles and they know what to do..
LACKING in R&D (R&D is very very very crucial)

oldbreadstinks SG

i don't think the chinese army is that weak Confused

miong SG

sibeysueykia

China is today more keen in making money than war. So no fear of aggression from them for
now. ....

BUT in 12 - 15 years time, if they managed to become the world's most powerful economy (as China have planned to become) -

ah, then your argument may no longer hold water.

.......btw, have you heard this one about :

if all of China's citizens jumped up and down at the same time, you could actually feel the earth tremble - anywhere in the world.

pangkee SG

Originally posted by SibeiSuayKia:

all i know is that if they war taiwan in 2020...they will surely lose until like siao
(may or may not we nv noe)

They are lacking very much in foreign allies , if given a chance to take sides in the war...MORE countries will support USA compared to China cause USA will definitely be the winner
(not realli, a lot of countries re quite piss off with usa too)

USA has a NGF plan for 2020..taiwan will get the YF-22 and the YF-35 which is going to have special capabilities
(taiwan oni waste pples money on these)

By the time 2020 comes , Aegis equipped tw destroyers and the US bases in KR and JP will be at their peak in strength
(but it cant stop the pples wish to reunify)

and somemore China can't pre-empt or whatever...the US base is still too FAR to hit
(by dat time it may be possible)

Japan...if they secretly kept on building and did not lose WWII they would be 2 times stronger den China now..i believe
(n i believe u, ur family n all chinese will be slave to the jap, ur gf will be rapped by them)

If i were the leader , i would wait til 2050 den probably...peacefully reunify , purposely retaking would cause alot of damage for both sides..
(ya i agree, all chinese also dun wan to see the history of chinese fighthing chinese reapeat itself after so many thousand of yrs. also maybe till den, china may equal or better den taiwan den the pples also wan to reunited)

If CN really wanna take over TW , they should not ignore the sea...
SEA and the AIR is the most important followed by land..
At most they have got the israeli help....and
(agree)

[b]CN armed forces

Have not seen any combat
( vietniam, korean, indian, russia war )

Not proven like Russian MIGS or SU
No advanced technology
No Stealth
No force projection
High in numbers but small in hardware..
( pla is not dat weak )

WAR games...lol...
give me a chance i rather take US Army..at least they have fought countless of battles and they know what to do..
LACKING in R&D (R&D is very very very crucial)
(by dat time pla may equal or come close to usa tech we nv noe)

[/b]

Blueray SG

Ahem, in case u don't know, China attracts the most FDI every year. Our investments in China is peanuts compared to japan, HongKong, USA etc. We are just a small time invester there compared to many countries. Do u really think China will suffer just because we stop investing there?

Qkool SG

of-cos china dont suffer if singapore really stop invest to china.

but are we own china for a rice bowl? how many singaorean really earn in china ? how many singaporean help china to get a job rather then providing job for singapore? how many singapore company set up in the big china and how many china's company been set up in singapore(the ratio)?

TuxedoMars SG

Mad tHe BloOdY cHinEsE gOvt aRe [email protected]#king RIDICULOUS as tHey dEciDe wHich CouNtRy SINGAPORE oFFiCiAls sHoUld ViSit!..Thats BS! Mad

Making Things out of nothing....sad.....pathetic.....BIG country...but SMALL brains......Nothing better to do than flexing muscles at smaller country... Mr. Green

Surely evry independent country have every RIGHTS to visit anyone they want to?!! CHINA... Dictating your own people is ENOUGH... We dont take free money from you...We TRADE. So No offence to all the Chinese nationals....

Evil or Very Mad Twisted Evil --->CHINA....STFU! just go settle your domestic problems Exclamation

Mr. Green

Blueray SG

Why do u think PAP always encourage us to go to china all the time despite a number of failed investments? It's because in this era, no businessman can afford to overlook the Chinese market. if we fail to get a piece of the action in the chinese market, we are finished. Like it or not that's the case.

Qkool SG

1st ,yea..dont overlook china market but also dont look too high.

I ASK U SOMETHING,the percent growth in singapore this year (maybe around10%) .

how many really due to china,wrong! is USA and other S.E.A investment.
the chip import to USA and the profit by S.E.A bank,telecom.

singapore only gain abit for having abit more to-china ship to park.

Qkool SG

dont think china have treating singaporean so well.

they have to treat HK,taiwan ,USA,euro country first.

then the left over ,see singapore want or not.like [suzhou gong ye],until now then make abit money..only.havent recover back the base $ yet. NOW ,got good s_hit for the stupid singaporean,help them to build the wild-wild west of china.......i feel vomiting
(they only tell singapore what to invest..not singapore want to invest)

china stop singapore temasak from buying HK telecom.i alway remember this in my heart. the USA let us buy what we want.

for them,HK is their belove child,taiwan is left-home child and singapore is just long-distance relative.

SibeiSuayKia SG

Check out the R&D spent on developing weapons and new stuff
you find out that most of their GDP is spent on other stuffs...

they got 50 billion not that much...THE FACT THAT..no one buys china made aircraft is only prove that how good their aircraft power is

2050 ba..USAF already investing on space type weapons..
But first China's GDP should match USA's 1..

Cause china's economy is 1:10 usa's size.....
Don't forget China has to use the GDP to provide welfare..roads..construction..education healthcare to 1.4 BILLION PEOPLE

Before you can talk about Military , USA only has about 400m pple

EH..China's past military involvement is at least more then 3 DECADES ago that means the pple who got involved in a WAR ..already retire liao..

Whereelse USA's military involvement in a war is still fresh ^.^

And if you talk about aircraft carriers, soviets are reluctant to pass on to china's Aircraft carrier technology...

and somemore i believe there's some sort of a ban preventing european countries from selling stuff to CN..

Thats why they strip apart a old aircraft carrier to learn from it..
(my analysis is that , it will be most likely not really useful cause the aircraft
carrier is that time old technology..cannot carrier as many aircraft as Nitmitz
also somemore no nuclear technology must keep on refueling to power a aircraft carrier to carry alot of planes requires ALOT of power )

America + Japan oredi got Aircraft carrier from WWII and has been developing the technology since 1945.. almost 60 years of a start ahead of CN , who hasn't even start on 1...

USA has started from lvl 1 and is on level 10 NOW(60 years)

If CN go learn the design from scratch which is about 5 years before and hasn't start and has no sailors involved in a training..or in wartime

Anyway in VN war, russia or korea..they were not the main pple fighting..
not really direct , but rather indirect as a troops backup to the north korea and russian forces.

Anyway if US really wanna play , they can use something called..
SANCTIONS!! or embargo or whatever den jialat liao lol..

Anyway they are smart let us build western china cause nobody wanna invest there ^^ heilongjiang or xinjiang or tibet? I think singapore might invest
cause got OIL there..use SPC and go there dig oil den SPC shiok liao

Steps to Implement if i were PLA General

1. Cut down military size (india has done the way , making it more professional)

2. Use the military and expenses saved to purchase new hardware
(make friends with singapore and we MIGHT sell u 1 million SAR-21 at $10000 each and sell u all the bionix etc etc , don't forget singapore is quite a close ally to china in fact and singapore has access to western,USA and israel technology , which china dont =p)

3.Tell the foreign ministry to make lesser noise , private visit , private la...
close 1 eye..

4.spent more money on power projection..negotiate for access to foreign base like what US is doing

5. Make more friends instead of warning..taiwan..singapore and hongkong
(your fellow ethic chinese is really afraid of you)

6.Conduct joint exercises....use the $$ which is focused on capturing taiwan
to teach those taiwanese politicians why they shld come back to CN.
Sunzi's art of war is abit outdated liao...time to read up more on
latest type of battles...
(even in sunzi's art of war , it doesn't mean bigger = stronger)

7.Practise better foreign policy...and continue to use russian made fighter jets
and have more live bombing over western deserts..

8.Halt production of J-10 Fighter jets , get YF-22 or euro fighter's data
and understand why their's might be better

9.Modernise ships..increase defense density in CN...make it more defense per
acre..and make the troops and ships more responsive.

10.Equip the 4 sides ...about 100 km away(faster response) from 3 gorges dam..have a airbase + 40 SAM batteries(must be long range and accurate) and get AWAC to counter any atk by TW , use ASTER-60/90 if possible..practise pilots scrambling time and interception time...make a permanent ship base facing TW..

11. UNDERSTAND this simple logic:
no point having missiles pointing at TW , if they got aegis/arrow

12.Build subs , smaller and fast.., more spy satellites , more commando and guard units , TEST simulation battles of F-16 and FA/18 and F-7 and J-10
(if u know the results..and if u find out J-10 and F-7 weaker , find out the mistakes and learn why den slowly improvise and upgrade)

13.Follow the above 12..

Qkool SG

Originally posted by SibeiSuayKia:

Check out the R&D spent on developing weapons and new stuff
you find out that most of their GDP is spent on other stuffs...

they got 50 billion not that much...THE FACT THAT..no one buys china made aircraft is only prove that how good their aircraft power is

2050 ba..USAF already investing on space type weapons..
But first China's GDP should match USA's 1..

Cause china's economy is 1:10 usa's size.....
Don't forget China has to use the GDP to provide welfare..roads..construction..education healthcare to 1.4 BILLION PEOPLE

Before you can talk about Military , USA only has about 400m pple

EH..China's past military involvement is at least more then 3 DECADES ago that means the pple who got involved in a WAR ..already retire liao..

Whereelse USA's military involvement in a war is still fresh ^.^

And if you talk about aircraft carriers, soviets are reluctant to pass on to china's Aircraft carrier technology...

and somemore i believe there's some sort of a ban preventing european countries from selling stuff to CN..

Thats why they strip apart a old aircraft carrier to learn from it..
(my analysis is that , it will be most likely not really useful cause the aircraft
carrier is that time old technology..cannot carrier as many aircraft as Nitmitz
also somemore no nuclear technology must keep on refueling to power a aircraft carrier to carry alot of planes requires ALOT of power )

America + Japan oredi got Aircraft carrier from WWII and has been developing the technology since 1945.. almost 60 years of a start ahead of CN , who hasn't even start on 1...

USA has started from lvl 1 and is on level 10 NOW(60 years)

If CN go learn the design from scratch which is about 5 years before and hasn't start and has no sailors involved in a training..or in wartime

Anyway in VN war, russia or korea..they were not the main pple fighting..
not really direct , but rather indirect as a troops backup to the north korea and russian forces.

Anyway if US really wanna play , they can use something called..
[b]SANCTIONS!! or embargo or whatever den jialat liao lol..

Anyway they are smart let us build western china cause nobody wanna invest there ^^ heilongjiang or xinjiang or tibet? I think singapore might invest
cause got OIL there..use SPC and go there dig oil den SPC shiok liao

Steps to Implement if i were PLA General

1. Cut down military size (india has done the way , making it more professional)

2. Use the military and expenses saved to purchase new hardware
(make friends with singapore and we MIGHT sell u 1 million SAR-21 at $10000 each and sell u all the bionix etc etc , don't forget singapore is quite a close ally to china in fact and singapore has access to western,USA and israel technology , which china dont =p)

3.Tell the foreign ministry to make lesser noise , private visit , private la...
close 1 eye..

4.spent more money on power projection..negotiate for access to foreign base like what US is doing

5. Make more friends instead of warning..taiwan..singapore and hongkong
(your fellow ethic chinese is really afraid of you)

6.Conduct joint exercises....use the $$ which is focused on capturing taiwan
to teach those taiwanese politicians why they shld come back to CN.
Sunzi's art of war is abit outdated liao...time to read up more on
latest type of battles...
(even in sunzi's art of war , it doesn't mean bigger = stronger)

7.Practise better foreign policy...and continue to use russian made fighter jets
and have more live bombing over western deserts..

8.Halt production of J-10 Fighter jets , get YF-22 or euro fighter's data
and understand why their's might be better

9.Modernise ships..increase defense density in CN...make it more defense per
acre..and make the troops and ships more responsive.

10.Equip the 4 sides ...about 100 km away(faster response) from 3 gorges dam..have a airbase + 40 SAM batteries(must be long range and accurate) and get AWAC to counter any atk by TW , use ASTER-60/90 if possible..practise pilots scrambling time and interception time...make a permanent ship base facing TW..

11. UNDERSTAND this simple logic:
no point having missiles pointing at TW , if they got aegis/arrow

12.Build subs , smaller and fast.., more spy satellites , more commando and guard units , TEST simulation battles of F-16 and FA/18 and F-7 and J-10
(if u know the results..and if u find out J-10 and F-7 weaker , find out the mistakes and learn why den slowly improvise and upgrade)

13.Follow the above 12..
[/b]

to 'pro' for me to understand leh...

drawer SG

SibeiSuayKia,ur PLA General Guide is useful,but u have to understand one thing,those ppl who in-command of the China troops are “old fossils”.I mean really really old fossils.You know their head leader is who you know or not?That “Pig” Jiang ZeMing.There,the fat fat guy wearing a pair of black until cannot black anymore spectacles lor.Last time he is in charge China,now become military headleader,Pui.And he that time still say China within 16 yrs want to take back Taiwan,most probably by force.This “Fat Pig” likes to dream alot!!!

Qkool SG

yea...the 'old fossil jiang' alway wanna to kill and war..like taiwan people not human,not chinese! 16yr...okie loh, long enough to let taiwan to prepare.

(tell you something, SAF(xing guang troop) been alway supporting taiwan military tech )

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