Military tactics and strategies

last SG · 2001-10-05T21:40:00+00:00

no no no... it should be,,.... as far as Malaysian corcern.... we wont hve war with singapore.... but with a mother fucker like u around... its hard to say n...

Joe Black SG

I'm sure you want all people in Singapore, Penisula Malaysia, a large population in Sumatra to die instantly in the inferno or die of radiation poisoning, radioactive fallouts, etc. Not to mention, people in Thailand, Indonesia, Australia, Phillippines will die of leukiemia or some blood related cancer a few months later. And are you crazy - dump anything on Sentosa? I love Sentosa.... !!!! Smile

[This message has been edited by Joe Black (edited 18 June 2002).]

pocketpig II SG

sorry i didn’t get to fire a nuclear missile during chinese new year when it was not banned.

Viper52 SG

I rest my case

pocketpig II SG

me too

recoil SG

man this guy is really clogging up this forum. no offence. =P

so i guess what it really boils down to now is actually how well our and their armed forces are trained, and logistics right?

its true.. numbers arent anything. equipment also isnt everything. back in the gulf war the T72 was thought to be damn powerful.. then you have iraqi tank crews abandoning their tanks at the sight of incoming apaches, and the turrets of the tanks being blown of with single tank rounds. maybe the same for m'sia MBTs? theyre essentially the same make. but i wouldnt really count on it.

one wonders if their armed forces are willing to fight. i dont really have doubt about ours, after everything we have to go thru during NS... =)

m'sia even has to resort to barter trade to obtain its weapons... would it have the raw cash to support the logistics? hm.

and thanks tripwire for opening my eyes a bit. =P

YourFather SG

Dun underestimate the PT-91. It has a very good western (French SAGEM, I think) FCS, and a powerful cannon to boot. It only lacks in the area of armour, which is not really that much of a proble, considering they face only the threat of our current 105mms.

CenturionMBT SG

105??? i tot it is 75mm

YourFather SG

Its 75mm? Fwah, much worse than I expected. Didn't really bother to check. sorry. But only goes to show how lousy our tank's anti-armour capability is.

thomasct SG

Hello,

There is still our " old " Centurian - Tempest MBT around. -

Joe Black SG

That was why they got Spike and Milan in the first place. I think the SAF top brass somehow forgot that armour still has a place in jungle warfare as well as in built-up areas. Look at how the Israeli use their armour to full extend with great effectiveness. So far, only 1 of their Merkeva was blown up and that was due to a trap and some 50 kg of TNT !!!

I think some sort of 105mm armed light tank is in the pipeline (rumour has it that it will be a design from STEngg based on Bionix chassis). We just have to sit and wait.

Another thing that I have heard was that it really depends who is the chief of army at any given time. If the Chief of Army comes from the arty background (trying not to name names here... Smile , then of course the arty units are going to get all the nice toys. Just look at how many new toys they have got since the late 80s till now, M72, FH88, FH2000, LH105, and now LWSPH). If the next Chief of army comes from one with armour background, I'm sure the armour units will get more and better vehicles other than the Bionix. Maybe a whole new gen of vehicle based on Terrex and a Bionix 105mm gun platform, maybe even some foreign designed tanks to replace the Centurions as well...

YourFather SG

LWSPH? I dun think the SAF has ordered any of that….. BTW, why issit that so few FH2000s were bought?

CenturionMBT SG

yah, but no comfimed sightings. its just a rumour

recoil SG

i think i've seen the centurion on TV before. some news coverage. just a glimpse. and my fren has serviced it before.

and i thought the FH2000 is locally produced? waitwait im a bit blur here. FH2000, bionix, terrex etc are local designs.. but are they made here? or made somewhere else and delivered here? or is that not for anyone to tell...

thomasct SG

Yes , our friend Centurian - Tempest MBT is real but its active or is in Reservists is another question ?

ST equipment is produced & assemble locally .

[QUOTE]Originally posted by yourfather:
LWSPH? I dun think the SAF has ordered any of that..... BTW, why issit that so few FH2000s were bought? [QUOTE]

Dear YourFather,

Believed you are referring to 18 units of FH - 2000,

Let me highlight my thinking regarding the issue:

1. The 18 gun would just nice for an Artillery battalion ?

2. Every 2 years cycle, a Sg combat unit will produced another battalion of NS men going into Reserve.

3. Do you think not the reservist's battalions have the same type of equipment as they have been trained in the active service?

4. Therefore the MINIMAL nos. of FH 2000 gun be 18 guns X the nos. of active & reservists FH 2000 Artillery units - correct ? Actually should be more .

You have think and not take the nos. / information blindly even from Janes .

There is a lot of disinformation out there created /coming from vested interests & nationalistic sources.

[This message has been edited by thomasct (edited 20 June 2002).]

YourFather SG

I heard something like 20+ units. Got me real puzzled, cause there would be no sense in designing a whole new weapon and procuring it with such low numbers. You seem to suggest that there are more units involved, is that right? Could you then post a guestimate on how many you think are in service? thanks.

Joe Black SG

True about the disinformation, but let me also point out that the number of FH2000 is not that many because the reservist (NSmen get retrained to use the FH88 anyway). In your post if what you suggest is correct, then there should be active units using M72S (Singapore upgraded version of the old Israeli Soltam M72 guns), but that is not the case. The arty guys who use FH88 during active service get retrained to use the M72S.

Retraining during annual reservist is nothing new. I know of guys who used to drive M113 get retained to drive the Bionix. Rifleman retained to use the new S21, etc...

Given how similar FH2000 and FH88 are, I can't see why FH2000 guys can be retained to use FH88 during their 13 years reservist.

Shotgun SG

18 FH-2000s? A bit hard to believe leh. But 18xno of active & Reservists FH2000 units also doesn’t make sense. I do believe that Singapore would cross train arty men to handle all the different guns. Since we don’t have a proffessional army, this would be the smarter thing to do.

recoil SG

are you sure the bionix can take a 105mm gun? thats a pretty big gun for a 20 ton tank...

and are our longbows army assets or air force assets? are all 20 of them longbows or just 12? im not very clear. =P

tripwire SG

lets just say that there are only 18 FH2000 arty pieces in the inventory... PLUS lots of prefabricated spare parts that can be rapidly reassembled into dozens and dozens of new FH2000 in times of crisis...( before war breakout)

Afterall... the biggest advantage of local production has been the ability to make all you want... and report watever you deemed sufficent....

and as long as the Guns are not assembled... well... technically its not in the total count... but if crisis developed and suddenly we see hundreds of FH2000 and thoudsands of other locally made vehicles moving all over singapore... (dont be surprise)

wombat SG

True, I agree that we could report lesser than the amount actually produced, and assemble in times of crisis. However, I think your number of possible guns/vehicles is abit over inflated. Even working 24x7, it could not chunk out that amount within 1-2 months. Or you "not counted" means FH2000, without tires... Very Happy

ST been spending alot of R&D on high value assets, but seems not enough on the average infantry man. Some of those tonners/rovers are way due for retirement.

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