Hello Jerjoe,
I can totally "feel" you as I think I have the exact
qualifications as you (MS Eng, no extremely strong set of skills,
not a PhD person, comes from strong Engineering school, took on
debts to come to USA to study)
I was only slightly luckier because I found a job right before
the 2008 financial crisis. What I can tell you is that the
unemployment figure in US now is 10-13% and that actually means
that 20-30% of americans are unemployed. For further understanding,
google and find out how they calculate employment figures in US.
What's more, the companies that shed the most jobs are those in the
tech industry. So you can expect 3~5 out of 10 technically-trained
people who are unemployed. Do not underestimate the situation. US
is sitting on trillions of dollars of debt and that financial
disaster in 08 has costed them alot.
The reason why you cannot find a internship chances in Tech
companies because the only companies that hire international
students are large tech firms (of course some biz/consultancy hires
MBA/LLM) AND right now they are not generous at training
international students at all. Why would if they have a large stock
of unemployed American workers/students in a political situation
dominated by the Democratic Party? Also, large banks can no longer
hire international students due to the kind of agreement they have
with the federal govt for the bailout. Yea, as much as American
claims to take in immigrants all over the world, they need to
protect their own people in tough times unless you are really
brilliant which you have already identify yourself not to be.
The next bad news for you is: (sorry for being negative but I
need to drive in the facts to you) most international non-PhD
students who can easily find jobs in US are those in EE, Com Sci,
IT/IS/etc, Finance (used to), Pharmacy, Chem Engine. Reason: Just
look for those companies that sponsor H1B visa. Most of them are in
these areas.
You doubted if your Masters degree has degraded your chances at
employment. To be honest, your masters and mine are merely paper
qualifications without research background. Yes MS (whatever) is
prestigious but not quite useful in a recession. You only have
chances at entry-level jobs due to the fact that you do not have
any relevant experience. If I am not mistaken, you have followed
the coursework only masters plan. Ask yourself, what is the
difference between you and your friends who are working now? You
only accumulated more textbook knowledge.The only masters degree
that is markedly different is the one that comes with a strong
research thesis. That may qualify you for a more senior position if
you have spent that period in a research assistant position which
is to employers relevant work experience. Hence, by upgrading our
qualifications to Masters, we put ourselves in direct competition
with everyone: Bachelor's, PhDs, and Masters. This fact was slammed
hard at me and I never had good feelings of that extra money I
spent on my masters.
Another feel-good factor you might have butter yourself with is
your conservation skills. The reason why you have thought that
interviewers thought well of you is because they expected you not
to be fluent at all. Also ask yourself, will American do better
conversing in their interviews? Obviously they do. You will be
amazed at their interviews if you sat in one. And Indians too? They
are well-known to devote alot of time and effort to interviews.
Don't compare yourself to chinese and non-english speaking people.
Compare yourself with the best then you can correctly benchmark
yourself. I put myself at a 6 when it comes to conversations
skills. Luckily, technical skills are more important for an
engineer in my area.
If you have been to a engineering company before, they hire
engineers based on the number of projects they have concurrently
and only hire if they have shortage of resources.My company sort of
took in twice the number of internships this year and I was
assigned to train two American engineering juniors from Berkeley.
Last year, I was assigned to train a Taiwanese student. There's a
marked difference right now in the employment market. Is there a
shift to favor local americans instead? I don't know but you can
make your own judgement. When I looked at the resumes of the two
interns, they had really relevant experience and near perfect GPA
(much much better than mine when I got my job). I came to realize
that now, an Ivy-League or Big-Ten degree is no longer a qualifying
ticket to a technical job in the US. The other trend I noticed is
that the number of China-born Chinese and India-born Indians in
undergraduate programs have jumped many folds. That has created a
lot of competition in engineering jobs. This is something that did
not happen when I was in Bachelor's. For example, I only had a few
Chinese friend when I was in the Bachelor's program but when I went
back to my school's to recruit students, I saw almost 1/4 to 1/3 of
the class population are chinese/indian. For info, read this:
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/16/education/16international-.html.
In the near future, non-PhD non-IT no-EE non-researcher
international students may need legitimacy in their background
(green card minimum) and previous relevant training. Why?
It's just plain competitive compared to 5 years ago and the US
market has not grown so much to absorb the
demand.
My advice for you is to return to Singapore to seek
opportunities because the internship recruitment period is all but
over. We did our interviews in late February. As you know in US,
no USA internship = no future job. To be honest, I
think it's really hard for you to find a job in US in the future.
Like you mentioned yourself, you have to be responsible to the
debts incurred and start seeking other forms of opportunities back
in Singapore. It is not a step back but a step forward (in
life).
However, don't worry for the immediate impact of the debts you
incurred and try to think more "long-term" issues ahead. I
personally think that you have to accept that your luck is not
exactly good and the situation is really changing in US when it
comes to engineering prospects.I understand that you have put in
200k-ish into your Bachelors+Masters but it is an investment that
you will stand to enjoy the branding benefits in the future even
though you may not be able to find work in the US. Also wages in
the US are not as high as you think it will be. My friend who is
working in the civil service in Singapore is drawing close to what
I am drawing now. Even though I get ard 80K usd a year, I have to
service my debts and also pay for housing etc. It's not rosy as you
think.The only good things that comes with work in US are benefits
(green cards, great health care, better technical experiences, no
NS callbacks, weather, more recreational stuff, cheaper cars). If
you understand how things work in Singapore, you can do very well
and get as much as u do in US. So, in a nutshell, try to think how
you can recoup the 200k in the long term rather than in the short
term. Also, the key question to ask yourself is: Do you actually
need the green card? And why? Prestige? To migrate?
Actually right now, I am facing lots of pressure at my work to
perform at a very high level or face elimination. I need to keep my
job so I can get my green card in a couple of year's time. Can I
keep my job for another 3 years? I am not sure myself but I am
doing my best to prove my value to the company and impress everyone
I work with. I also network a lot with people outside my company so
I have backup chances when I am removed. I definitely had a lot of
thoughts to what I can do when I get my green card and that
includes returning to Singapore for better opportunities. So don't
think that returning to SG is a shameful thing. In fact, I think
it's a great background for me because lots of US MNCs are based in
Singapore. Also I am very grateful to the bilingual education I
received in Sg. It opened several more doors for me. The only set
back is the NS system which took away 2 years of my life.
Take care and be positive! Don't even think of killing yourself.
It's the dumbest thing you can ever do to yourself and imagine how
your parents will feel about it. I think you are a smart guy but
you need to really start moving forward.
Hi XenDan,
:/ I typed out a reply and somehow lost it when I tried to reply
but here's the jist of what I said. I agree with alot of the things
you mentioned. I'm not so sure about the political effect on big
tech company hiring policies but I'm certainly feeling the lack of
engineering opportunities. I would in fact further narrow the
"employable" fields to just Computer Science engineering, banking
and consulting. The only chem engineer I know who got a job here
went into banking (through his dad's connections). I realized this
midway into my undergrad and somewhat regret taking this path.
I'm certainly aware things are not as rosy as some make it out
to be and that the internship hiring period is long long over.The
H1B sponsorship (I don't really need/want a green card) has pretty
much dropped by 75% and yes alot of companies that used to sponsor
no longer do so. It also seems to have affected internships which
is the first problem for me. Since I switched majors for masters,
I'm focusing mostly on learning as you say. I actually worked as
research assistant in my undergraduate, through spring/summer and
during school for almost a year, paid and unpaid. It just seems
that employers seem abit adverse to students who seemed to have
taken a more "academic" route in their work experiences, even if it
was very relevant. I worked more as a design/prototyping engineer
as compared to a laboratory assistant. A couple of prototypes that
I build from scratch are being refined by the research group and
will probably be patented some time in future. My undergrad gpa is
near perfect for a top college program that does not inflate
grades. I don't know if thats good or brilliant any more as I've
beaten myself up too much about not getting an internship/job. Its
just that they would gladly hire someone else with just one
internship with a big name company even if they'd been there for
barely 3 months (what could you accompish?). I've thought about the
Phd route but the lull in earnings for 5-6 years is just something
I can't afford right now. Being mentored by my young prof who
graduated from MIT and has tons of funding is on face value an
excellent opportunity but I'm just not cut out for a Phd,
practicality aside.
I've had alot of feedback on my interviews. I used to actively
seek it as well. There have been quite a few times I've had to
remind recruitors that I'm not a US citizen and would need
sponsorship as they tend to keep falling into the assumption that I
am one. I usually take it to mean that I'm doing a good job. I know
there is always a bias that other nationalities can't speak english
well and that I out performed that expectation. However, I've also
been interviewed by quite a few who had less than perfect english,
usually Indian/Midde Eastern PRs or first gens. As you get past the
HR people and progress further into the later rounds, they tend to
be more open and honest with you, especially if you meet those who
you could potentially work with directly. Ultimately, I think
communication would come in secondary to having specific knowledge
sets for a position / having a big name internship / having a US
citizenship/PR. I'm still working to improve on whatever I can.
If I may ask, why do you "need" a green card (ignore if this is
too sensitive a question)? If you are Singaporean, H1B1 should keep
you around for as long as you want, so long as you have a job in
the US I guess. I still think that from an Engineer's standpoint,
there is no doubt that US>>Singapore. My theory is this
probably stems from the costs difference and popularity of getting
an engineering degree in either country. You can look at it from
take home pay after taxes, cost of living, job satisfaction, job
variety, etc. I've done a fair bit of analysis and I think its
quite safe to say this (assuming one gets the job).
You're quite accurate in describing the influx of foreigners in
US universities. In one of my classes, 95% are chinese/indian and
probably among the brightest as well. This has made things very
difficult for me academically. While doing Mech, I more than held
my own but since going into Indus, my lack of foundation knowledge
has hampered my performance. I'm taking it as a learning
experience. In terms of job searching, I feel that most Chinese
want to do a masters/phd before returning, whereas the Indians are
desperate to stay. They are essentially in the same boat as me
except that I like to think I can communicate better. Returning to
Sg, leaves me no different from having gone to say NUS or NTU,
except with this "branding".
I'm very disillusioned with this 200+k worth of "branding" and
honestly do feel it was a very poor investment, maybe even cheated.
Most of the $$ goes into research funding and what I have is no
more than a overpriced piece of decorated paper like coe. It also
only matters on the first job generally. In my case, its seems like
it won't even matter at this rate as I'm probably headed for grunt
work that won't use my knowledge.
I'm finding it very hard to feel positive, since other facets of
my life aren't doing that great either. I think I'll stay my hand
that would be taking my life for now as I do think about what my
parents would do/how they would feel if I did it. That is truly the
only reason that's keeping me alive.
Good luck with your green card. I sincerely want that to work
out for you.
