Loading level on buses

last SG · 2014-02-18T00:10:26+00:00

11-4 pax from Lor 1,Stadium 3 alight then 1 last Stadium stop 7 pax,Sims before terminal 1 boarding all the way to Lor 1Ooh la la...

dupdup77 SG

No you didn't get my point. On return journey, you will cause inconvenience to commuters from HG/SGK as they will not be able to board on SDs. What is the other alternative for these people? For Punggol residents, they will still have 168 DDs. Don't you still see the problem?

Hi mr BusAnalyser, for the return journey, I do not foresee many people from Punggol alighting at TPE stop on sengkang side. Why? It is not a direct service as it is only a so called supplementary service to a minor section of the residents living next to TPE. Most people will prefer sbs 34 which goes inside Punggol. So it is not perceived as a major threat to sbs 27 and all those who are going to sengkang and hougang from CGA. Cheers.

dupdup77 SG

Why do you not address the point of DDs needed on Sv 27.. And since it is not possible bcoz of cga.. Overlay with 27M with DDs. You don't have an opinion on this?

Hi mr BusAnalyser, I cannot say anything about this. Everybody knows double decker is not possible so I do not see any need to repeat. From the posts here, they are not keen on 27M. Hope they finally decide to put double decker on 27A to tampines one fine day.

dupdup77 SG

No as in, 109 need to go up, down and instantly up again!!

I mean, you never notice the route of 109?!

Let me tell you a fact hor, that the LTA never knew. Some people preferred 109 to get to Sengkang from Pasir Ris due to its less winding road. But now? It has to be caught on a jam and has to wait for another traffic light! Less people would patronise 109! Other svcs like 27 or 89 is okay as they are taking the immediate slip road to continue, but 109 has to go back down again and get up again! This is different from svcs like 168 or 858 as they only will go up again somewhere else, here 109 is serving a bus stop of the exact same neighbourhood it will serve AGAIN!

Makes no sense to me.

Hi mr SMB128B, I know 109 journey well as I often take it. I agree this is a fast way from loyang to sengkang. Sbs 89 also goes from loyang to sengkang but it leaves at a slip road earlier. Sbs 109 leaves at the next slip road towards sengkang hawker centre along sengkang east road. But then not much difference except for 3 mins more. The convenience brought upon to other sections of sengkang residents will be much more felt for sbs 109 to stop there. In your so called same neighbourhood, there are people living at other blocks next to TPE. Those new blocks at the edge of TPE, those currently built BTO blocks next to the temple and coffeehouse and the rental blocks and those flats inside rivervale crescent are within walking distance will benefit. Currently they do not benefit. So why not? Remember they should not be deprived of this service. Cheers.

BusAnalayzer SG

Yes but DDs is possible on SWT? What possible could be the reason not to give DDs on SWT? Even 43A has DDs on SWT, one BSEP.

BusAnalayzer SG

Hi mr Acx1688, yes I agree loading patterns will change. At first moment, I think the crowds along Punggol road 1st stop before TPE and after TPE will drop. Sbs 83 loading will drop slightly as some people will take sbs 3 and sbs 34 to the new stop to change to other buses. Currently Punggol residents take sbs 83 to Punggol road blk 190C stop or walk over to blk 298A to change buses. I foresee sbs 161 loading towards woodlands will also drop as it will be complemented by sbs 168, smrt 858 and smrt 969 slightly. Even sbs 85 and smrt 965 loading will be affected as the journey to yishun is covered by smrt 969. Sbs 34 loading will drop as smrt 858 brings people directly to Changi airport after TPE stop. Sbs 27 loading may or may not drop slightly and we shall see later. There will be many new links created. Examples are links to seletar camp, sembawang mrt and many more! Cheers.

You know you have almost said all bus service loading will drop except SMRT services 858/969. And to an extent I agree. Will 969 and 858 be able to manage extra load?? It is already utilized to its capacity. This means there will be need for significant addition of buses.. Hopefully more high cap buses on 969. I feel 161 loading will still stay as it is quick option to WDL unless people move to 168..

BusAnalayzer SG

No as in, 109 need to go up, down and instantly up again!!

I mean, you never notice the route of 109?!

Makes no sense to me.

But you also need to note that 109 has space for more pax compared to 89 and 27 I don't know how will take more pax. So 109 stopping makes more sense over other services from a loading point of view.

dupdup77 SG

Yes but DDs is possible on SWT? What possible could be the reason not to give DDs on SWT? Even 43A has DDs on SWT, one BSEP.

Hi mr BusAnalyser, I think the main reason is they know that sbs 27 has one of the highest frequencies. I have also told SMB128B before. This should be the main factor why they decide sbs 27 to remain its current way. Cheers.

dupdup77 SG

Hi mr BusAnalyser, with the upcoming implementation of the new bus stop at TPE, the pros will surely outweigh the cons. It is naturally good for the loading pattern to slightly alter and also this will help to take away a bit traffic from the crowded Punggol road (blk 190C and blk 298A stops). Of course depending on exact locations of their flats, most will flock to sbs 161 to woodlands and a few will go to sbs 168 to woodlands. Actually by having one more stop at each side of the TPE, the impact on the bus routes will not be extremely great. Of course, after 3 months of implementation, there will be a routine change in loading and it will be great to see how it pans out later on. As such, new routes may still go to sengkang and Punggol not because of the sudden change in loading due to the bus stops but more because of increasing population in the 2 estates. With more flats, naturally more new bus services will come. So it will be good to make a distinction between 'loading change due to TPE stops' and 'increased loading due to more flats and people'. However sometimes they overlap and cannot be clearly demarcated out. Cheers

SMB128B SG

But you also need to note that 109 has space for more pax compared to 89 and 27 I don't know how will take more pax. So 109 stopping makes more sense over other services from a loading point of view.

Bro you got it wrong.

In fact it is the EXACT opposite.

109 SDs during peak will get packed to the door, even after reaching Sengkang. And may I ask how many DDs are actually running on 109? Proportionately the SDs would be more...

On the other hand, 89 has much more DDs than SDs during peak. In fact, you wont even find any SDs during peak on some weekday evenings on 89! As for the DDs most of the time the standees won't even fill up half the lower deck. All seats taken though.

Now in terms of ROUTE. Which makes more sense: coming up, stopping at stop and then resume as per normal or come up, stop, wait for jam and traffic light, go down, and UP AGAIN?! I could NOT think of a single route that would ultimately make 109 worth the stop. All I think it does is destroy one of the main advantages of 109.

dupdup77 SG

Bro you got it wrong.

In fact it is the EXACT opposite.

109 SDs during peak will get packed to the door, even after reaching Sengkang. And may I ask how many DDs are actually running on 109? Proportionately the SDs would be more...

Hi mr SMB128B, sbs 89 has more double deckers because it is a loop service and crowds are expected to be more. Sbs 109 is fixed at 2 sides so uses single deck. With surge in crowds lately, double deckers are used.

Sbs 109 still retains the main advantage even after it stops at TPE stop. Why? The whole sector is still express except for this stop. Other services also stop here but most have to stop at all stops on their normal routes while sbs 109 is still express for quite a distance. It still wins in terms of bus journey timing. Cheers

BusAnalayzer SG

Agreed Sv 27 has a great frequency but you have to also identify with the woes of the people.

1. Sv 27 bunches more than it does not. 2-3 buses together is common. Especially at Tampinee Reg Library towards Hougang, you will see 3 buses in PM turning in from tam ave 4. As you are aware, people all flog into the first bus. This way first two buses get 70 pax, next buses that come go empty. Very common. You realize people go standing, sticking to each other for 20-25 mins of their journey. Can be avoided by putting lesser buses no roads and having DDs leaving from Tampines interchange instead on 27M.

2. CGA does not need 3-4 minute frequency. The loading there is pretty low. Hence, 27 can have frequency of 8-10 mins to CGA and 27M can have frequency of 6-8 mins from Tampines Interchange with DDs.

Lta should seriously consider this, and this decision will very well be welcome by people.

SMB128B SG

How is it still express for quite a distance?!

Other services can just turn left and continue while 109 has to wait for traffic light!!

I seriously doubt your "experience" with 109 and your credibility as a whole...

BusAnalayzer SG

Do you know the stop before YCK road on Buangkok Green can fetch Sv 43 about 60-70 pax at one go??? Crazy boarding at this stop. Even spotted Sv 88 gets 40-45 pax boarding on this stop. Sv 325 gets about 5 pax.

SMB128B SG

Major stop that one is.

dupdup77 SG

How is it still express for quite a distance?!

Other services can just turn left and continue while 109 has to wait for traffic light!!

I seriously doubt your "experience" with 109 and your credibility as a whole...

Hi mr SMB128B, other services can just turn left and continue. Right! While continuing, they will stop at each and every bus stop enroute to destination!

Sbs 109 has to wait for traffic light at junction. Right. After few mins, it will still move pasr traffic light and goes express again before turning left to sengkang east road. This express portion makes up time lost for the traffic light, correct?

No need to doubt my experience with sbs 109. Also one of my favourite bus to hougang 1.

No need to doubt my credibility as a whole. Sbs 109 will benefit many sengkang residents living near the TPE. To them, convenience will be much more important than my credibility. So many new links are created for them. They may not even need to go to sengkang interchange to transfer to sbs 159 anymore.

sgbuses SG

Hi mr SMB128B, other services can just turn left and continue. Right! While continuing, they will stop at each and every bus stop enroute to destination!

No need to doubt my experience with sbs 109. Also one of my favourite bus to hougang 1.

You probably spend more time waiting for the bus than waiting at the traffic light.

dupdup77 SG

You probably spend more time waiting for the bus than waiting at the traffic light.

Hi mr sgbuses, yes you are right. A short wait at the traffic light is not going to cost an arm or a leg.

Sometimes I wonder why there are many people in this forum who wrote inside the route suggestions in another topic to introduce new bus services providing so-called new links to connect places with other places which either currently lacks the linkage or totally no link as of today.

Now that the soon to be introduced extra bus stop along the TPE is already indirectly giving new links to the routes, but people are hesitant because they have services affecting them. An extra bus stop just does the trick. It does not involve a lot of new resources or manpower. The impact is going to be much better than introducing new bus services because they really provide many types of new linkages. Hooray! Isn't that what people want?

sgbuses SG

Hi mr sgbuses, yes you are right. A short wait at the traffic light is not going to cost an arm or a leg.

Mindsets are difficult to change. People won't know the option is there until you actually tell them so.

Perhaps if there is a PIS capable of making both visual and audible announcements in future, it could tell passengers of transfer options at major stops as they do in Hong Kong.

SMB128B SG

Mindsets are difficult to change. People won't know the option is there until you actually tell them so.

Perhaps if there is a PIS capable of making both visual and audible announcements in future, it could tell passengers of transfer options at major stops as they do in Hong Kong.

HK don't provide transfer options. Only KMB tells you the fare stages when nearing the respective stops.

Can incorporate into SMRT PIS system actually.

SBS3688Y SG

Hi mr sbs 3688Y, I think will not in the long run. Firstly, the roads are expanded when they add the bus stops. Secondly, most of the cars will use the direct flyover. Only cars turning into sengkang and Punggol will use the slip roads. Thirdly, we do not expect huge crowds of people at the TPE stops. Even though there are more residential units coming up, some of the passengers may have taken bus services originating from roads inside sengkang and Punggol. They do not have to depend on the bus services at TPE bus stops all the time. For those residents living just besides or within waking distance of the TPE stops and having no cars of their own, congrats to them. It will be like an MRT to them! Cheers

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