Gnosticism

last SG · 2006-04-17T00:24:29+00:00

dunno where to slot you in the Five Tiger Generals of Liu Bei. Huang Zhong is old, but his archery is top. Maybe just like you, who can yi zhen jian xue (on...

casino_king SG

You are looking from hindsight. I already answered your question in 2 ways:
1. The concept of the atom 2000 years ago is not the same concept of the atom like what we have now. Their concept of the atom is not "real." Get it???? How one who can write seemingly proper sentences but cannot understand such simple logic is beyond me.
2. In fact we say that the atom is this and that based on the evidence and proof presented so far.... so far, mind you. If some brilliant chap sometime in the future can come up with a an atom that is slightly different from our concenpt of the atom then we can say that our concept of the atom was not "real." Just like based on the evidence and proofs Newton provided, we say that Gravity is this and that. Einstein came along and said.... hey wait a minute... now we have a "better" concept of gravity; a "more" "real" concept of gravity.
3. I have tried to introduce you to the idea that there are things that the human mind has not conceived of yet... but I guess that would be too much for you since even basic stuff like what constitutes reality is lost on you.

casino_king SG

So you are suggesting that God is an inanimate object like that wind? Incapable of showing himself even though you claim that it is Omni this and Omni that? You are blaspheming your own God.

casino_king SG

I have put it so simply to you- show me proof of God's existence like the proof people produce for the existence of whales... what is so difficult to understand about that? Of course it is imaginary if you say something exists that is Omni this and Omni that but is hiding in a place worse than Saddam Hussein in his hole....

casino_king SG

I am trying to bring you people so called believers to a higher reality and deeper understanding of what exactly you are believing. If I make you stumble and leave the church, so be it you are not worthy….

Icemoon SG

So what is the concept of atom we have now? isn't it the smallest indivisible part of matter that is unique?

Don't give me the crap there are electrons and neutrons in the atoms. This is not important at all. The fact that atoms are the smallest indivisible part of matter that is unique still stands even if there are no electrons and neutrons but only protons (dun ask me how the atom can remain neutral this way), simply because all your protons and electrons and neutrons are not unique!

2. In fact we say that the atom is this and that based on the evidence and proof presented so far.... so far, mind you. If some brilliant chap sometime in the future can come up with a an atom that is slightly different from our concenpt of the atom then we can say that our concept of the atom was not "real." Just like based on the evidence and proofs Newton provided, we say that Gravity is this and that. Einstein came along and said.... hey wait a minute... now we have a "better" concept of gravity; a "more" "real" concept of gravity.

So what is your position? Gravity also not real? So nothing is real to you? So you have no evidence of gravity also?

Then forget about your whale lah. I can dispute that is not a whale but a giant fish. Laughing

Of course God may turn out to be an alien after all.

3. I have tried to introduce you to the idea that there are things that the human mind has not conceived of yet... but I guess that would be too much for you since even basic stuff like what constitutes reality is lost on you.

.. like God? 'cos God who is infinite cannot be comprehended by our finite minds. Wink (I quote this from vince)

Icemoon SG

but whales and supernatural beings belong to different class of objects. You cannot use the same type of proofing on both of them.

Surprisingly for someone who sort of understand how science works, he can't understand the limitations of empirical proofs. What a pity. I think he still need to improve on his thinking and stop been so naive.

Icemoon SG

If casino king, or anyone else for that matter, wants empirical proof of God, then please invent a time machine yourself and go back to 33 AD.

Witness the crucification of Christ.

Then see the risen Christ pass through walls.

Guarantee you will shout - "My Lord and my God!" Mr. Green

klydeer SG

your efforts are indeed relentless. but please have mercy on us. you can continue to live on that "higher reality" for all we care.

and try not to think too much. i am quite certain nobody stumbled because of your illogical and prideful ramblings. On the contrary, thanks to your ever prideful statements of self-existence, you have affirmed in me, what God warns us about the end times.

xie xie ! Surprised

Icemoon SG

of course, casino king should not forget the lessons from "Raiders of the Lost Ark".

When the Holy Spirit (?) comes out of the Ark, better close your eyes like Indiana Jones. Laughing

Icemoon SG

Actually you are quite right you know?

In Genesis, some translation actually wrote "the wind of God hovered above the water". Laughing IMHO, this translation should be closer to the Herbew original.

God did show Himself. God was in the flesh in the person of Jesus Christ. He also revealed Himself in various form to the different prophets. So He is definitely not incapable of showing Himself.

According to the New Testament, the next time Jesus show Himself (above the clouds?) mean something bad is gonna happen.

casino_king SG

So convenient... suddenly all the claims of God amounts to nothing and is only a supernatural being? No longer Omni this and that? No longer able to show itself to man? Can only appear once 2000 years ago and then disappear and play hide and seek? Can only exists in people's imagination? Right... sucker...

casino_king SG

Such blatant stupidity... no wonder you can be such a sucker... if you can show proof that the whale is a fish... you can win the next nobel prize... but a whale is a fish? Such mindboggling stupidity.

Icemoon SG

Huh? God was all along a supernatural being! Which Christian tells you He isn't? Rolling Eyes

No-one is saying he no longer omni this and omni that.

God is not playing hide and seek. After Jesus ascended into heaven and sit at the right hand of God, God did send His Holy Spirit to mankind.

God never promise to suka suka "show Himself". However the New Testament tells us the next time Jesus show Himself, something bad is gonna happen (to you, at least).

So if you dunno theology pls dun anyhow demand claims.

Icemoon SG

well .. when Copernicus came out with his heliocentric theory, people also thought that was mindboggling stupid and heretical. Stupid because common sense tells you the sun rises and sets around the Earth.

Well .. I might be able to show a whale is a fish .. very simple .. I just regroup the taxamony (sp?) only mah.

By the way, I am rather motivated by someone's comments earlier on. Spur me on further research in marine science:

In fact we say that the atom is this and that based on the evidence and proof presented so far.... so far, mind you. If some brilliant chap sometime in the future can come up with a an atom that is slightly different from our concenpt of the atom then we can say that our concept of the atom was not "real."

Oh well .. I need to show our whales now are not "real". Laughing

casino_king SG

So convenient only suckers can accept such nonsense.. ask you to show proof like show proof that whales exists; give all sort of excuses... if you have no proof, just say so and if you like to live in a world of delusion instead of reality, just go ahead, there are so many suckers like you after all.... it is a good thing that the majority are are not.

casino_king SG

So I tell you that there is a whale that has a horn like rhino and you can be a sucker to believe that it is "real?"

If someone really discovers that there is such a thing and show proof, only then does it become real... otherwise it is just a fiction of my imagination, get it? Just like you cannot show any proof of the existence of God and until you can show proof of the existence of God, you are talking about delusions at worse and imagination at best.

Icemoon SG

I said liao .. if we are living in 33 AD, this kind of proof might still be possible. I say might because in the absence of even budget airlines, I cannot imagine how long we need to travel before we reach Palestine from Singapore. Laughing

God does not reveal Himself now like what He did to Moses and Ezekiel. The closest thing we have is the Holy Spirit, which after all is "invisible". (the ghostly apparitions in Indiana Jones is only special effect, I must remind you).

The Holy Spirit cannot be seen, but His effects can be felt and seen. If you want some proof, maybe this is an angle you can research on (instead of demanding God shows Himself in flesh).

No-one is trying to give excuses. If we're claiming pink unicorns exist, then of course the kind of proof will be similar to that of your whales (take pictures and videos like what they did in the movie King Kong). But now we're dealing with God, the kind of proof presented will be different (this is what the plo guy was trying to get across to you).

I think you got to change your mindset a little, yeah? Wink

Icemoon SG

First question.

Does anyone owe you a proof for the existence of God? I mean, does your science professor force you to accept the existence of God without giving a proof?

Second question.

So what if someone managed to give you a *convincing* proof for God? Will you worship Him?

casino_king SG

So I tell you that a ghost live in your house but because it is ghost you cannr see it. Proof problem, I will draw a picture of the ghost for you.

If you are sucker enough to accept that, then I will go on and start nonsense like the ghost want you to do this and that and to do this and that requires money and... you get the drift.

Don't be a mentally weak sucker who goes by superstitions and non proofs.

casino_king SG

This is a forum and we are having an intellectual discussion and if you cannot appreciate that, just too bad for you.... somethimes I do this not just for you but also for me by forcing me to crystallise my own thoughts....

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