The Criminalisation of Christianity

DriftingGuy SG

My point here is not about which religon have more or less absolute truths... My point here is the intolerance on religon has for others..

Christianity has a long history of violence against other religons. Take the crusades for instance.

Granted Buddhism may have instances of violence as well. But my point of argument is that Christinaity has the most intolerance. Mr. Green

[email protected] SG

no. the point is, how can u say diseases are acts of the devil? viruses, bacteria are all as important parts of nature as we are, in fact sometimes more. is this what christianity is about? if its something that fits the church's human agendas, its "god's will" if it doesn't fit, then its "the work of the devil"? how very comforting to know.

Since bacteria and viruses are parts of nature, if u get sick because of them, its also an act of nature. If its so sinful to go against nature, then no one should seek medical treatment when they fall sick. So u can drop the "u 2 are putting up a strawman" line because u're not convincing at all. or have u run out of intelligent things to say, and thats the only line u can clutch on to pitifully? Rolling Eyes

Icemoon SG

I get your point. I am just pointing out xtians are just more vocal and they happen to have this mandate of 'make disciples of all nations' and others don't. If reincarnation is true then you are subjected to it even if you don't believe or people never tell you. So will you blame them why they never told you?

Now must play tai chi .. any evils related to crusades please cc to the RCs here. Mr. Green

Icemoon SG

Playing tai chi again .. you should cc your qns to those from the wealth and health churches. There is one very big one in the west of Sg .. Mr. Green

Sicknesses? did not exist before the Fall. So they are unnatural.

Hence you are still putting up a strawman. Wink

lwflee SG

Ok.

You said that you cannot accept homosexuality because it is cleary not natural.

I pointed out that natural does not necc mean that it is not harmful to mankind.

Heng pointed out that diseases occur naturally.

Now you say, diseases are acts of the devil.

Ok, so i assume you have abandoned you "but its not natural" argument. Can i assume that you object to homosexuality because you perceive that the devil causes one to have homosexaul tendencies?

In that case, then really, there is no point debating. I can't prove the devil doesn't exist, neither can you prove that he exists.

[email protected] SG

this line is rubbish. u're using myths and pandora's box to talk about real life facts? u're the one who's putting up a strawman. not even a strawman, more like loose bundles of straw not resembling anything. Laughing

Icemoon SG

You said that you cannot accept homosexuality because it is cleary not natural.

One can argue along two lines. Trivially something can be natural, as in it exists in nature, but it brings no benefit to the organism itself (not referring to the species). In humans, if you are a straight homo, and if you don't do in vitro or ICSI, your genes die in your generation. I don't understand why anyone can call this natural? One can also argue it in the context of faith, blah blah .. this needs no explanation.

Heng pointed out that diseases occur naturally. Now you say, diseases are acts of the devil.

Once again, I don't want to speak for those believers of 'health and wealth' gospel. Wait they sue me for twisting their teachings I cham. I just point out their belief. If you want to know the reason behind, ask them? Wink

Ok, so i assume you have abandoned you "but its not natural" argument. Can i assume that you object to homosexuality because you perceive that the devil causes one to have homosexaul tendencies?

Not really. Sins that one commited are not natural too. Before the Fall, there is no sin in mankind (even though the Fall of Satan preceded that of mankind)

iveco SG

Also, if you look at Vietnam, there is a limit on the number of people allowed to study for the priesthood. I know of a Vietnamese priest who went back to his hometown on a mission last year. He spoke of a young man whose ambition was to become a priest, but was denied a chance by the government as there is a quota in place.

DriftingGuy SG

Religious arguments are never-ending.. but it helps you spend time Laughing

stupidissmart SG

Is this a strawman? I don't think I said that.

Ok, so gays can be borned from straight parents. U believe in tat now right ?

I said the scenario is fictitious. If you want to use 'foreplay' instead of frolicking, go ahead. It still doesn't change my main point.

Wat is your mainpoint ? tat homo animals do not hav sex with each other but instead forlick with their hooves and it send a sperm through the narrow paasage of a female species and she got impregnanted ?

Note that even though you see cases of homo, it is not the case the whole species is homo. So for course they don't die out. But I believe the one that is homo should die out, as in genes don't get passed down. Maybe by being homo, overpopulation is reduced .. haha .. so homo is good at the expense of the homos

Tat brings back to the frist point of tis post. I don't care if it is good or nto for the species. I wanna ask u if it is natural or not. From your post here, it seems u believe it is natural and there r animals being homo and they supposedly be borned from straight parents. Whether it is good or bad, I don't care

The law says sodomy is unnatural .. lol .. dun ask me who is the law to say? If you believe in justice and equality, you need the law.

The law have changed to acknowledge gays is accepted. Some laws even approved gay marriages because recently medical facts have said they r natural.

You just proven homos are more than a difference in sexual preferences?

I have proven tat homosexual have a fundamental difference in their structure. It is natural. Tis fundamental structure difference is used to explain their sexual preferences.

That is ok. Many people like power .. it is until you succumb to the dark side that is the problem

HUh ?!?! Wat has tat got to do with the above !?!?

xtians especially those from 'wealth and health' churches will tell you cancer is not natural. Diseases are acts of the devil .. haha

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Once again, I don't want to speak for those believers of 'health and wealth' gospel. Wait they sue me for twisting their teachings I cham. I just point out their belief. If you want to know the reason behind, ask them?

Lets not just say something and when it went wrong, push the explaining to other group. Why don't u state your personal belief and whether is dieseases natural or manmade. No one had ask u about wat the health and weath people think

So will you blame them why they never told you?

They do told. U r not a buddhist and u know about it. They just never force u to do anything special or extraordinary liek going to church etc

Sicknesses? did not exist before the Fall. So they are unnatural

Tat is silly. Death does not exist before the fall too, so they r unnatural too ? Then if they r unnatural, the must be man made isn't it ? Then reproduction is unnatural since tat doesn;t exist before the fall too

In humans, if you are a straight homo, and if you don't do in vitro or ICSI, your genes die in your generation

As said in first point, it doesn't take a gay parent to make a gay. Perfectly straight parents can give birth to individualk with the higher tendency to become gays. As long as there is people reproducing, there will be people becoming gays. Everyone have the gene to "make gays".

I don't understand why anyone can call this natural?

The structure of their body is different. U refuse to answer to tat point about tis found medical fact.

Jesus Christ SG

Death upon the unbelievers!

stupidissmart SG

Jesus Christ ! (Exclamation tone) U r still here ! Shocked

SingaporeMacross SG

Bah, Communists. Let's overthrow them.

laurence82 SG

Isnt he sarpose to be in heaven? Laughing

plo30360 SG

A few questions here, those with info please help to answer these:

1. Plant homo, names?

2. Animals homo names?

3. Homosexuality biological fact?

Icemoon SG

No issue with that. I thought it was quite common sense actually ..

My point is you can't apply what happens in the animal kingdom to human beings like comparing apples with apples. Hell, the female praying mantis? eats up the head of its main counterpart, and that is considered natural. You can't say the same for human beings.

Tat brings back to the frist point of tis post. I don't care if it is good or nto for the species. I wanna ask u if it is natural or not.

It exists in nature.

The law have changed to acknowledge gays is accepted. Some laws even approved gay marriages because recently medical facts have said they r natural.

Not so much in Singapore.

I think gay marriages are approved in the name of liberty and not after medical research?

It never went wrong, but I don't feel like doing any explaination for them. Moreover I am not suitable for the task.

Health and wealth people are xtians too, so it helps to examine their belief.

If you really want my personal belief, then you have to accept they have nothing to do with christianity. I don't want to grant anyone the chance to shoot a faith based on what I said.

They do told. U r not a buddhist and u know about it. They just never force u to do anything special or extraordinary liek going to church etc

How they tell you? Popular conception is often misconception. It is the same with people's understanding of the gospel too.

If one defines natural as what is good and right before God, what is supposed to be happening etc, then only the pre-Fall period fits the criteria.

Death is unnatural too. God told the couple if they makan the fruit they will die. Why you think reproduction did not happen before the fall?

Everyone have the gene to "make gays".

Is the research conclusive enough to show the genetic basis of homosexuality?

The structure of their body is different. U refuse to answer to tat point about tis found medical fact.

Vague. What is the difference? They can still walk, run and talk like hetero.

Icemoon SG

For 2, many animals engage in homo, but not that the whole species is homo.

Don't understand 3. Homo does exist in nature.

If you are interested, can read Dr. Tatiana's Sex Advice to All Creation: The Definitive Guide to the Evolutionary Biology of Sex
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0805063315/ref=pd_sxp_f/104-4273145-5243933

stupidissmart SG

1. Plant homo, names?

Almost all plants have both female and male reproduction system. So u can say they r homo, bisexual or heterosexual if u want

2. Animals homo names?

Nobody really denies animals r homo. But if u want names,

dolpihn, penguins, beetles, sheep, fruit bats, ostrich, flamingo and orangutans

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/07/0722_040722_gayanimal.html

3. Homosexuality biological fact?

I have pasted so much links on here already before Rolling Eyes I just restick all of them again

http://allpsych.com/journal/homosexuality.html

D.F. Swaab conducted the next noteworthy experiment in 1990. This experiment became the first to document a physiological difference in the anatomical structure of a gay man's brain. Swaab found in his post-mortem examination of homosexual males' brains that a portion of the hypothalamus of the brain was structurally different than a heterosexual brain. The hypothalamus is the portion of the human brain directly related to sexual drive and function. In the homosexual brains examined, a small portion of the hypothalamus, termed the suprachiasmatic nucleus (SCN), was found to be twice the size of its heterosexual counterpart [2].

At the same time, another scientist, Laura S. Allen made a similar discovery in the hypothalamus as well. She found that the anterior commissure (AC) of the hypothalamus was also significantly larger in the homosexual subjects than that of the heterosexuals [2]. Both Swaab's and Allen's results became a standing ground for the biological argument on homosexuality. The very fact that the AC and the SCN are not involved in the regulation of sexual behavior makes it highly unlikely that the size differences results from differences in sexual behavior. Rather the size differences came prenatally during sexual differentiation. The size and shape of the human brain is determined biologically and is impacted minutely, if at all by behavior of any kind.

More of tat website on nature do cause an effect. It is a balace website, from the psycology journal

http://wiki.cotch.net/index.php/The_gay_gene

Yes. Even without direct evidence of individual genes we could be confident in predicting that, like almost all aspects of behaviour, sexual orientation has multiple biological and cultural influences. As it is, there is a growing pile of evidence from multiple areas of research that give us an idea of exactly what the biological influences, both genetic and non-genetic, may be.

One gene in particular has been associated with male homosexuality. A gene on the X chromosome has been shown to be present in a significantly larger proportion of homosexuals to heterosexuals. It is clear that this gene is not "the gay gene" described by the media, as its presence of absence alone does not determine sexual orientation.

There are strong indications of a link between male homosexuality and the pre-natal environment, including birth-order and the mother's blood pressure and androgen (male hormone) levels, which can be traced back to an interaction of the mother's environment and genes (see below).

From wiki

However the animals do commit such acts, like homosexual. God created animals and ther r unfallen or have not sinned. They r in the form god always intended. He made animals gays, tat means he have little problems with homosexual. When u mention about praying mantis ripping off another head, to me, if a god exist tat create the praying mantis, the only conclusion I get is god is a cruel being to force another to kill another. If animals do it, it shows it is not cultural or manmade factors tat made certain people gay.

Not so much in Singapore.

I think gay marriages are approved in the name of liberty and not after medical research?

The bottomline is there r laws have accomodate gays marriage. So just quoting singapore laws is not useful. It could be after much medical research

How they tell you? Popular conception is often misconception. It is the same with people's understanding of the gospel too.

I never meet anyone who told me about buddhist things. Yet I just know about their teachings possible from self study, much like wat i know about chritianity.

I define things in the world as either man made or natural. I believe tis definition is wat most people do know. If u define natural as wat is good in the period before adam fall, then reproduction is also unnatural and having sex with a heterosexual regardless of reasons is unnatural and a sin. It will be as low as homosexual

Is the research conclusive enough to show the genetic basis of homosexuality?

Yes. It shows nature do plays a part.

Vague. What is the difference? They can still walk, run and talk like hetero.

the brain tat controls behavior is different. U can see more above

lwflee SG

Actually, i must disagree with you on one point. There was an attempt to find a gay gene last year. However, the serach turned up nothing. Has there been any other developments in this area?

Weirdo80 SG

None of us here are biology experts, and even the experts have only scratched the surface about knowing the human body fully.

All I know is, and all that Christians need to be mindful of is that the Bible has said that homosexual acts are wrong. Don't let anyone else ever tell you otherwise. In the end times, many will attempt to steer you away with false teachings, erosion of Christian values and misinterpretation. If you have a homosexual friend, love him/her as you would a brother/sister, but know that the act of homosexual sex is wrong. Help the person who is struggling with the temptation of homosexual sin as you would with anyone struggling to indulge in hetrosexual sin. You may be homosexual, whether at birth or through experiences I don't know and don't care, but Jesus can bear all your infirmities for by His stripes we are healed. No one is spared from temptation, but remember that God always prepares a way out of temptation. Hetrosexual sex is also wrong when done outside the boundaries of holy matrimony. The Bible has stated that marriage is a sanctified bonding of a male and female before God. There shall be no such thing as homosexual marriage.

That should be a Christian's stand and it will never waver. Let your foundation be built on the Bible and nothing else.

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