Court Martial Justifiable: Take MC, And Go Take Exam Too

last SG · 2010-03-06T12:48:49+00:00

Ooooooooo .... but it hurts, right ? ... I did come very close to the uncomfortable truth, eh ? .... did you thump your keyboard in anger ? .... is it trigge...

collinnxk88 SG

from some of your previous threads, it's obvious that you have been a huge prick to your fellow soldiers and your superiors .....

hoh seh liao lah .... now look who's got the last laugh now ......

have fun in DB.

that's what makes ppl go on fire the most...

AFAICR in summary, that guy's OC seems to lean towards the pai kia PS and the mono guys, just bcos he cannot blend in with the platoon due to background differences [and from there, wants to make life difficult and virtually strips him of his welfare + trying to get him into trouble even when it was not caused by him] and the PS concerned only sides with the mono guys. [1 of the case mentioned is whereby the TS was really sick and that PS did not believe him at all and insist he chao geng]

i wonder where the PC and the sect comms went to... being gagged and silenced? -.-

BangHong SG

You should pleed guilty.

In black and white, if you take MC, you must stay at home, cannot go out shopping etc, there will be spot check from MP sometimes (But they spot check on those perm MC people la, 1week or 2weeks mc they dont bother to check)

Black and white already said MC = stay at home, what makes you think you got right to go take exam? Specialist write letter so what? If your OC/Co dunno you take exam, and the exam is private, then quiet quiet nobody know then good, but now every body know already, better to pleed guility serve the 10days DB.

tarutaru SG

I guess TS will be the one after DB, he got discharged....

skythewood SG

If I am you, I am no push over. I will bring every resources, I have from media, mp, SAF hotline, and EVERYTHING. Since the CO or OC or whatever is being informed I will whack every1 upside down. Anyway, EXAM and TESTs are very important events in life and it is necessary for life to go on and even after you ORD. If whoever on top is not being understanding, than he does not deserve to be a commander at all.

I read somewhere that taking EXAM off, compensation leave, birthday off in the directive and handbook before, I am not sure if it is still exists. Check it out urself.

Anyway who say taking MC must stay home AND REST? It is only written black and white on the MC say you are unfit for work and is not valid for court. Have you all ever read the MC and medical directive before? Where on paper that it is being written that you have to stay home and rest?

Anyway the idea of giving an MC is not to rest, but more like isolation, because that person may be spreading the cold and flu virus around. If he is injured, it may be difficult to walk around.

Good Luck to TS. I have not problem getting OFF for my scholarship interview, driving test, and other stuff before,hence therefore...

MC never say, SAF law say. Who say must stay home and rest? SAF did. You argue MC never say also no use, they got this simple thing covered, you think you can find some loop hole meh?

skythewood SG

Hi all, my mc was related to my studies and i had my mc several months before the examinations, not the 1 day 2 day flu cough kind. Side note, I was referring to A levels.

I have NEVER EVER applied for leave, nor OFF, not even once in my ~2years of NS, it was always told that 'company off' today, but my off wasn't deducted and my leave was instead. Of course i wasn't informed till I wanted to apply for my exams. Lack of leave left me to ask to apply OFF for my exams, but i was denied. Already at THIS point of time, I am already on mc.

I was scheduled to go for my unit's major exercise but in the end i was excused from it and allowed to go for my exams. So during my exams, there was no way there could a clash of NS activities, as my unit was away for the exercise. But they just don't want to let me use off, excuse me, let me go for exam but dont let me use off, justified? In my initial post, if i missed a paper, the whole subject is deemed as absent, so aren't they playing me? So my question is there such a directive that cannot use off to go for exams?

I am confused that some replies were directed angrily, which I cannot see the point behind it, as my case doesn't harm you anyway, does it? I view my education as an important bridge to working life, so that's why i chose my path. If you think the value of conscription is greater than the importance of education, then I must salute you, great asset of the SAF.

You NEVER took leave before, check. Company off day your leave got deducted, check.

Now... how much leave you left with? how come not enough, your exams is 10 days or 20 days ah?

If you inform them way before hand, how come the leaves are not planned far in advanced? If OC reject you, why you never take the matter up to CO or call SAF hotline?

Why angry? No, it is you who are angry and blaming the whole world. Somehow, you REFUSE to acknowledge that this thing is your fault, even after so many post pointing out your mistakes. From that, anyone can tell what a fuck up person you must be, and how hard it is to work with you, and why no one wants to help you.

Fatum SG

that's what makes ppl go on fire the most...

i wonder where the PC and the sect comms went to... being gagged and silenced? -.-

my answer to that is very very simple ..... if you have served, you would have known how unlikely it is to be outstracized by everybody in a unit. People need each other in a unit, or more pointedly, they have better things to do than to go out of their way to get you. So if you think everybody in uniform doesn't like you or is against you, not your unit mates, not your PS, not your PC, not your OC, not even the MO ..... then the fault can only lies with you, from your behaviour and actions, you must have alienated everyone of these people.

And of course, judging by the TS' winning personality .... I really think it's no wonder he could find scant sympathy towards him, even from his own parents.

http://www.sgforums.com/forums/1390/topics/380075

fun fact #5. They got the TS good and proper this time.

I wonder if they are throwing a party somewhere.

teraexa SG

As an nsf pc, I must say that off is a privilege and leave is a right. That's all to it.

By directive, since you are talking about taking A levels here, the unit should make provisions for you to take your exams to meet the minimum education bar (Poly, NITEC or A levels) provided IT DOES NOT CONFLICT WITH OPERATIONAL REQUIREMENTS. What constitutes 'Operational Requirements' is rather grey and if your OC hates you then ho seh liao, he will use this reason against rejecting your off and leave requirements.

For most units, the OCs and PCs are kind and understanding enough to grant you the off or to approve the leave if you so wish to apply for it. However, since your OC is not approving it and your PC is like not supportive of it, it looks like you are 'marked'/disliked in your unit. At least that's what I do to those guys who always take MCs for the most minor of reasons (sore throat).

As for MC, do not listen to Daveteo's crap. It is by SAF law that when you are on MC, you are supposed to be recuperating at home. Worse still, I have made people who are MC for sore eyes/sore throat take taxi all the way back to camp to rest in bunk. Very simple reason to why I do such things - if I let one get off scot-free, I am just being unfair to the rest and they will start playing MCs, making more trouble for me. Some units, in fact, do not allow those on MCs to go home but to rest in the bunks instead. If you are resting at home, the unit can conduct home visits and if you are found to be malingering, the Military Police can be called in to arrest you.

You played with fire in spite of knowing the risks and got burnt. Too bad, you have to suck thumb and face the music. Dude, you are no longer a child but an adult. Be responsible for your own actions.

No point activating media/parents/MPs over your case. It will only embarrass you and your family. Suck thumb and go to the GCM. I have, on more than one occasion, allowed my men to go on urgent overseas leave/urgent offs because of unforeseen circumstances. However, your case... Blame it on your willingness to play with fire.

insidestory SG

most likely those 'hackjob' doctors are usually foreigners or ladies who arent that aware -.-" [the local guys are more scrutinisng based on their previous MO experience unless they themselves heck care for the sake of money =.=] however, there isnt much that can be done as their professional licence's terms and conditions rarely cover nsf-related stuffs and such [as long as no malpractice causing injury/death/life threat is present]..

The hackjobs are Singaporean, and most specialists here are men, so by logical extension most of the hackjobs are men. It's extremely difficult for a foreign doctor to set up a private practice here, so there are very few. All private sector doctors, even mere GPs don't treat the NS malingerers any differently, so there is no need for special terms for NSFs in their professional license. Hackjobs whom you pay a lot to are generally very lax and dispense medication and MCs and diagnoses very freely.

When questioned later, its quite easy to just say they were erring on the side of caution. Anything can be explained away as being cautious and if faced with an enquiry from SMC, they can just pull out some obscure statistic of one person somewhere in Timbuktu who ever had this allergy to "officer" and went berserk everytime he saw an officer in 1765 to justify himself.

insidestory SG

I got a feeling the commanders must be some condemned cannot make it regulars and now trying to take it out on their subordinates

You're obviously a retard. In most coys there is an equal portion of NSF PC and regular PC. Only an idiot from an unprivileged background will think that the only people who can become an officer must sign on some farmer LSA award to do so. Its damn common to find an officer in a group of friends in poly and the bottom JCs and do you know in certain circles here, I know of the odd specialist who didn't become officer in NS unlike his friends continues to be laughed at and humiliated by the NSF officers in university.but of course, that's in a US university and all the Singaporeans there are of almost the same mould and background, and that guy is the only spec among the Singaporean male students who are all officers soo...

All regulars go through their PC tour, the most basic and simplest of command tours including the SAFOS or president's scholars. For farmers, the OC tour is the last command tour for most of them. No more space for them up the pyramid, wide at the bottom tapers narrowly to a tip on top. You sound like a retard who is condemned to a life of pathetic sadness with no brightness or future possibility. Your CEP in life will probably peak at $2,000 in a HDB handphone shop. Sad.

insidestory SG

So all in all TS's commanders suck, probably is some no-brainer sign on fellow. A simple EQ problem, at the end made it into such as big matter. A bad sheep in the high rank is making people condemning the SAF as a whole. And whoever have actually sign on, really reflect their intellect.

So the commander even know that sending people to DB eventually to martial court reflect badly on their portfolio as well.

Commanders will normally close an eye when it comes to good soldiers, I know you're illiterate and dense, which is why you failed to pick this up repeatedly even though it was said by at least three NS officers here. TS is obviously a marked case and those fucked up soldiers who caused headache and trouble for his officers. If I'm his PC, i'll also make sure my OC whacks him big time and send him to DB for life.

I find it amusing how you are totally self justified over something that is not allowed. It's been said by so many people, some officers and some not, that its not allowed and he did it. But as usual your failure to understand English due to your illiteracy is a stumbling block to a normal life for you.

I know a lot of commanders who have sent lots of people to DB. Nothing happened to them as a result of that. It's the fucked up soldiers who paid the price for being fucked up, and I'm quite sure they'll carry their deep seated character flaws into their post-ORD life..after they serve out the rest of their extended NS days after DB. As for TS, i'm sure you'll enjoy the lovely exercise, pleasant ambience and nice gourmet meals you are about to enjoy in your 10 day holiday. Have fun!!!

Through this forum, I found out the mentality and psyche of these fucked up soldiers that I've to deal with in camp. Most of them however don't reveal their real feelings to me of course, now I know these fucked up and marked soldiers actually feel so much self justification about their misdeeds and bad attitude,don't think they did anything wrong and think its all the commanders' fault. I will make sure that such soldiers suffer and get whacked with harsher consequencies from now on and recommend to my OC maximum charges for them every time they even try to pull a fast one.

Shorter ninja SG

TS has to be court martialed within a stipulated time otherwise all charges to be dropped completely.In this case prolly he will escape the punishment but would recieve a harsh warning to save some faces.Still what he did was wrong and be reminded that, 'THIS IS NOT YOUR FATHER'S ARMY'

loki_chaos SG

You NEVER took leave before, check. Company off day your leave got deducted, check.

Now... how much leave you left with? how come not enough, your exams is 10 days or 20 days ah?

If you inform them way before hand, how come the leaves are not planned far in advanced? If OC reject you, why you never take the matter up to CO or call SAF hotline?

Hm. I'm wondering if TS leave actually still have balance, then will he still have a chance to defend himself? And, as most men in a battalion they have no access to OA in offices to check they will have to depend on their admin specs to check on their behalf. If the spec chose to hide the real balance to him, then it is really such an unfair case.

Xcert SG

Going by what the TS has posted....he is not likely to be in the good books of his OC and CO...I am sure the rest of us will agree that if U served ur duties deligently throughout ur NS...a lot of things...can be negotiated and looked the other way....so why does the OC and CO want to clamp down on TS?

TS said he has never applied for leave...I dunno about now...used to have to fill in a Leave Form and handed in for the admin people to do the updating...since TS said leave has been used up...come up with the hard-copy proof.If now Leave is by electronic application...there will be an electronic trail to check...which comes back to the 1st paragraph.

whether Off can be used to go for exams is no longer the issue now...go to exam while on MC...in NS or civillian world also cannot...TS can come up with 1001 reasons why he should be allowed to go but the fact remains that he abused the medical leave to go for exam....now still want to play hard ball and go to CO...have fun TS.

the Bear SG

*points and laughs at TS*

schi_zo SG

What do you mean by stipulated time???

Anyways to explain to you all too hard already, since you all dunno full story or the methods that my commanders undertook.

schi_zo SG

Simple example, why is it hard to explain to you all. Look at this Xcert guy, say that i play hard ball and go to CO.

LOL, when did i play hard ball and go to find CO? When i don't plead guilty to my OC, i will be automatically transferred to CO, only to get charged! GG to people who cannot read.

fudgester SG

Simple example, why is it hard to explain to you all. Look at this Xcert guy, say that i play hard ball and go to CO.

LOL, when did i play hard ball and go to find CO? When i don't plead guilty to my OC, i will be automatically transferred to CO, only to get charged! GG to people who cannot read.

People read it and understood it fully. You didn't.

The bottom line is, like it or not, you were totally in the wrong. You should have simply pleaded guilty to your OC because an MC does not give you the right to take an exam outside. Simple as that.

Like I said before, National Service Full-Time is exactly what it sounds like - you are a full-time soldier. If you want to take a course outside, then do it at your own time without letting it get in the way of your duties as a soldier. If you get time off to pursue your studies, then it is a privilege and not a right. If you do not get that privilege, then really, it's just too bad.

Xcert SG

LOL, when did i play hard ball and go to find CO? When i don't plead guilty to my OC, i will be automatically transferred to CO, only to get charged! GG to people who cannot read.

if U didnt try to play hard ball...then U would have taken ur OC's order.

Right now U can just continue to refuse to take order from CO and go court-martial....if U think that the world evolves around U alone and that anything that doesnt go ur way is an attempt to stifle your freedom....its ok with me...U are the one going DB.

shitakemush SG

suck thumb and go DB lor, afterall, pes F don't think need to undergo regime sangbag drills. maybe is everyday stay inside cell eat sleep? but 10 days, maybe it will be tagged to your record for life. no point playing around with the system.

collinnxk88 SG

dont mind me asking, what's your job position in your camp? 1 thing i observed, the power to recommend charges can be quite varying across various services/formations in the SAF. perhaps due to different scope of operations? basically as long as A is of a higher rank than B within the guidelines of the SAF Act, A can recommend?

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