Cardinal: Catholics who leave the Church are deserters

SingaporeMacross SG

http://allafrica.com/stories/200607070463.html

laoda99 SG

wah so militant!

laurence82 SG

Not right though

Its basically name calling

Besides, the usual punishments for Army deserters range from jail to execution.

Surely the Catholic Church wouldnt want to put themselves in the same light as the institution they always fight against, an institution of war.

SingaporeMacross SG

It's no big secret that the Church on Earth calls itself the Ecclesia Militans, or Church Militant, as we are continuously battling towards heaven. The Church in Heaven is called the Ecclesia Triumphans, or Church Triumphant, for they have successful won the battle of life.

laurence82 SG

Sounds like Salvation Army

ObiterDicta SG

Please see this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_militant_and_church_triumphant

We do see ourselves in military terms, for we are in a struggle against the 'powers and principalities' of this world:

"Put on the armor of God so that you may be able to stand firm against the tactics of the devil. For our struggle is not with flesh and blood but with the principalities, with the powers, with the world rulers of this present darkness, with the evil spirits in the heavens." Eph 6:11-12

regards,
obiterdicta

laurence82 SG

army in spirit, not military army

SingaporeMacross SG

No, we do not advocate fighting with military armaments or ordnance.

But surely the Church has the right to take into hand Her errant children?

ObiterDicta SG

But in a conflict that has far more serious consequences than most military ones.

laoda99 SG

I am with u in this one

laurence82 SG

Since they have already left the church, the church still has power over them?

laurence82 SG

yes, but deserters are most often used for people from organised militia

[email protected] SG

for u maybe. maybe u think its right to kill people(burn them at stake) as long as u're "saving" their soul Laughing

Ito_^ SG

protestants are considered "deserters"?

laoda99 SG

Salvation Army is a peaceful corps.....more like providing social welfare one.....

[email protected] SG

more like AOG

gasband SG

FROM THE ARTICLE:

"If you are confirmed in the Catholic Church and then decide to change and go to another church, you are a deserter," Wamala said.

"We hear of adults who have deserted the church. And why is a deserter so dangerous? You don't know why he went, where he has gone and what he is planning to do next.

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Firstly, God gave all of us a freedom to choose. If the person decides to leave for whatever reasons, right or wrong in the eyes of the church, just let him leave, why label him. furthermore, in the article, he is speaking in the context of leaving from the catholic church to another church. What is this "another church" he is toking about?

Secondly, like he said "You don't know why he went, where he has gone and what he is planning to do next." SINCE YOU DON'T KNOW, how then can you lable him as dangerous and a deserter?

laoda99 SG

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ObiterDicta SG

No, that's not what we mean by the struggle. This struggle is fought, as far as we are concerned, on our knees in prayer. Weak as we all are, it is fought within ourselves as well, as an ongoing conversion effort for us to overcome our sinful nature, with God's grace. And it is fought in the hope that as we allow Christ to act more and more freely within our own souls, we will be able to help manifest the love of Christ to the whole world.

To quote Fr. Benedict Groeschel, CFR, a famous television preacher, the spiritual life is the life of Christ within us.

To reiterate earlier points, it is about struggles with powers and principalities of the spiritual realm. Killing people is not going to do it.

Of course, if one is an atheist, then this is meaningless, since there is no belief in the existence of anything other than the material world.

regards,
obiterdicta

ObiterDicta SG

Yes, God gave us free choice. However, most of us want our free choices without the consequences, which is of course absurd.

The Church has lost a lot of people. However, we do not 'just let him leave'. We always work in the hope that they will come back. We will pray, we will persuade (if the opportunity arises).

I'm not sure if you have 'lost' loved ones who departed from the faith. I know, for instancce, that many parents have 'lost' their children. If you talk to them, the sense of pain and loss is palpable. Are they restricting their children's freedom? Not at all, but they grieve.

As for me, I have 'lost' a very dear loved one who left the Church as well.

Sad

regards,
obiterdicta