Sleeping

last SG · 2007-02-22T22:51:02+00:00

There is no mindfulness to penetrate reality during sleep. You simply cannot practise in sleep.. but non dual can naturally propel into even the dream phases...

An Eternal Now SG

Dreamless Sleep

You take a journey into the Unmanifested every night when you enter the phase of deep dreamless sleep. You merge with the Source. You draw from it the vital energy that sustains you for a while when you return to the manifested, the world of separate forms. This energy is much more vital than food: "Man does not live by bread alone." But in dreamless sleep, you don't go into it consciously. Although the bodily functions are still operating, "you no longer exist in that state. Can you imagine what it would be like to go into dreamless sleep with full consciousness? It is impossible to imagine it, because that state has no content.

The Unmanifested does not liberate you until you enter it consciously. That's why Jesus did not say the truth will make you free, but rather: "You will know the truth, and the truth will make you free." This is not a conceptual truth. It is the truth of eternal life beyond form, which is known directly or not at all. But don' t attempt to stay conscious in dreamless sleep. It is highly unlikely that you will succeed. At most, you may remain conscious during the dream phase, but not beyond that. This is called lucid dreaming, which may be interesting and fascinating, but it is not liberating.

So use your inner body as a portal through which you enter the Unmanifested, and keep that portal open so that you stay connected with the Source at all times. It makes no difference, as far as the inner body is concerned, whether your outer physical body is old or young, frail or strong. The inner body is timeless. If you are not yet able to feel the inner body, use one of the other portals, although ultimately they are all one. Some I have spoken about at length already, but I'll mention them again briefly here.

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What Eckhart said here is roughly there. Except that Thusness implies that it is not necessary or impossible to enter dreamless sleep 'consciously' (ironically Eckhart's second paragraph's first sentence contradicts his first paragraph), which I believe would equate to a sense of Witnessing presence. This is not the same as deep dreamless sleep where even the sense of Witnessing presence dissolves into complete non dual absorption.

Eric Cartman SG

Did I say I enter dreamless sleep consciously? The other time you were telling me that pure awareness is only correct if I can feel it even in deep dreamless sleep, to which confused me and I said I would need to meditate more to do that. Then shortly after that thusness started saying not to want to be conscious during deep sleep and that you misled jonls by introducing ken wilber to him, otherwise he would have realised emptiness by now.

You like to assume a lot dont you.

Thusness SG

The phrase "second-round of non-dual experience" is truly misleading. I used it merely for my own reference to account for certain experience. Not to be misled. I should not have used it; it has caused much confusions.

An Eternal Now SG

As long as the descriptions fit what I have then it is good enough.

It only fits YOUR own interpretations of other's words. That is ridiculous. By what you said, you meant that you can interprete anyones' words to fit your own experience, even though it is not what the original author intended. You are implying there is no need for authentication, you can do yourself by any-how interpreting others' experience as your own. Sounds like cult master.

It is like everything is mind and nothing is not mind.

You did not see it, you only concluded it.

Eric Cartman SG

It only fits YOUR own interpretations of other's words. That is ridiculous. By what you said, you meant that you can interprete anyones' words to fit your own experience, even though it is not what the original author intended. You are implying there is no need for authentication, you can do yourself by any-how interpreting others' experience as your own. Sounds like cult master.

So now I am bringing it all up and see if you can convince me otherwise.

You did not see it, you only concluded it.

Right now I conclude it because that feeling is gone. I saw it when I was waking up.

An Eternal Now SG

Originally posted by Eric Cartman:

Did I say I enter dreamless sleep consciously? The other time you were telling me that pure awareness is only correct if I can feel it even in deep dreamless sleep, to which confused me and I said I would need to meditate more to do that.

Don't talk about whether you are doing anything. The crucial matter is not whether you are doing anything, but whether you are mindful even when not doing or doing anything, and whether you are aware of the reality of that doing or not doing or whatever.

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