What are ur expectation for the 4th university

last SG · 2007-10-30T21:13:29+00:00

No offence but liberal arts is not pragmatic in Singapore considering that most grads just want to find a job and be done with it all. There is not a huge ma...

Rock^Star SG

Source of this "low percentage"? Isn't it the rule of thumb for one to quote the link to a claim rather than a fact? A claim..... in your case? In my time 1999, the percentage was as low as 5% per cohort based on the post graduation survey.

What does a "rigorous schedule" entail? Is this the very rigorous schedule that resulted in LKY lamenting the lack of locals who could pose questions during a local symposium? Is this the rigorous schedule that cause the political apathy among Singaporeans today? Is the propaganda in our social studies textbook today the reflection of our rigorous schedule?

Anyway, I have not said that the rigorous schedule is a fault in itself, kindly comprehend correctly. If quality is prevalent even if rigorous, why not?

Rock^Star SG

It is well known that majority of A level grads make it into uni.

How often have you heard D graders ushered into uni, albeit maybe not the course of their choice.

Rock^Star SG

Kindly justify with statistics as per your claim.

Rock^Star SG

A testimonial extracted from the SP website:

--------------------------

Mr Lim, a multiple-award winner from Singapore Polytechnic, went to the University of New South Wales (UNSW) when he was rejected three times by NUS.

By the time his appeal was approved, the electronics, computer and communication engineering poly graduate was already in his third year in social work at UNSW.

For the first class honours graduate who will marry in November, there was never any question about not coming back to Singapore.

'My family is here, my friends, my fiancee. I like Singapore for its security, tolerance and diversity. While I enjoyed my time in Australia, it never quite felt like home,' said the avid basketballer and guitarist.

Source: Click http://www.sp.edu.sg/SPweb/appmanager/home/default?_nfpb=true&T28400481471160376379105_actionOverride=%2FcmsTools%2Fextension%2Fcontentlist%2Fmain%2Flink&_windowLabel=T28400481471160376379105&T28400481471160376379105nodepath=%2FBEA+Repository%2Fnews%2FSP_in_the_News%2Faug06%2F22082006_NTUScholarship&_pageLabel=SP_ABT_SP_in_the_News_JulSep2006

Rock^Star SG

THE top student at each of the five polytechnics here will soon get a bond-free scholarship to pursue undergraduate education - without even having to ask for it.

Nanyang Technological University (NTU) will make the offer in a scheme likely to start next year.

The announcement comes a day after Prime Minister Lee Hsien Loong said in his National Day Rally speech on Sunday that overseas universities will court top polytechnic students with scholarships.

NTU's offer comes on top of scholarships already available to poly graduates, said all three local universities contacted by The Straits Times.

Details of NTU's automatic scholarship for poly students are still being worked out.

Some 10 per cent of polytechnic graduates - about 2,000 - enter local universities.

By 2010, this figure is expected to grow to 15 per cent.

Source:

By Liaw Wy-Cin
22 August 2006
Straits Times
(c) 2006 Singapore Press Holdings Limited

10%......growing to 15% only in 2010. Totally debunks whatsoever "myths" that some try to pass off as truths here. Go figure.

Eikei SG

You can't just claim "rule of the thumb" without citing where your rule or thumb came from. I would like to have a look at the post grad survey you are talking about, care to provide the link?

Your rhetorical questions serve no purpose to substantiate how another system of admission is better than the current one. The link between the ability or willingness to ask questions, the "political apathy" you claim and the "propaganda" you cite and our rigorous schedule is sketchy at best.

When proposing a logical argument, it is but only reasonable for one to demand a rigorous substantiation of fact, or are you against that too?

Please refer to the NUS/NTU admissions FAQ.

Eikei SG

Originally posted by Rock^Star:
THE top student at each of the five polytechnics here will soon get a bond-free scholarship to pursue undergraduate education - without even having to ask for it.

Nanyang Technological University (NTU) will make the offer in a scheme likely to start next year.

The announcement comes a day after Prime Minister Lee Hsien Loong said in his National Day Rally speech on Sunday that overseas universities will court top polytechnic students with scholarships.

NTU's offer comes on top of scholarships already available to poly graduates, said all three local universities contacted by The Straits Times.

Details of NTU's automatic scholarship for poly students are still being worked out.

[b]Some 10 per cent of polytechnic graduates - about 2,000 - enter local universities.

By 2010, this figure is expected to grow to 15 per cent.

Source:

By Liaw Wy-Cin
22 August 2006
Straits Times
(c) 2006 Singapore Press Holdings Limited

10%......growing to 15% only in 2010. Totally debunks whatsoever "myths" that some try to pass off as truths here. Go figure.

[/b]

This 10% could be due to
a) Only a small proportion of Poly grads who actually apply to go to the uni
b) A majority of the poly grads not being able to enter based on their academics even if they applied.
c) Poly graduates enter overseas universities on their on volition

Do keep in mind that some poly graduates did not have good grades to start with and perhaps we this 10% quoted is not a good representation of the actual situation due to the factors described above and thus it is pointless to use such a newspaper article to discuss factors and reasons for the lower number of poly graduates who become degree holders of our local universities.

Rock^Star SG

duplicate

Rock^Star SG

While I do not disregard the limited validity of your points a, b and c, they are after all, assumptions at best.

Substantiated claims would be much appreciated.

The Straits Times reported today (20 July, 2007) that:

For local students, places were offered to 14,781, or 51 per cent, of those who applied.

Only 2000 poly grads in there, therefore how many A level students entered? And the 90% of poly students who didn't make it, are they bad? This is the key flaw in the local eduation system.

Rock^Star SG

No point counter questioning here. Anyway, I regret that I do not have the internet link. You can take my word for it, this coming from a poly grad.

Is "rhetoric questioning" all you can muster, given that our education system, rigorous or not, has contributed to this politcal apathy? However, that is another matter altogether.

Kindly provide me the exact link in the NTU/NUS admissions FAQ and quote me the number, if possible. Much appreciated.

Darkness_hacker99 SG

I did, it's in the first page.

relgn SG

yar lorh yar lorh... pls dun get into heated discussion. i dun want my thread kenna lock. Laughing

lost.soul SG

i jus came to this thread, so wads all the argument about, can someone enlighten me Confused

Rock^Star SG

The title of this thread is "What are your expectations of the 4th university?"

The debate that you see here serves to justify the existence of this university.

When there are ignoramuses who barge in here and claim that:

1) "Your basic assumption is that poly students do not get an equal opportunity to enter university. This assumption is invalid from the onset."

2) "Our education policy is geared towards making poly a viable route to uni...."

3) "If that choice will serve as a disadvantage to their future career, they should have very well thought of going to JC so they can go to university more easily"

then these bunch must be corrected.

relgn SG

super sian when they are not helping much. So of reply off topic de. Omg, wat am i gonna do?

purpledragon84 SG

to TS:
(1) i hope 4th uni is in town area too.. like SMU.. den the girls go school all dress pretty pretty den c liao shiok.. not like ntu nus.. all like go market.. esp hall residents.. though the girls wear fbt good la haha..
(2) jokes aside, i hope the 4th uni pays more attention to the needs of arts students, because NUS FASS is just a dumping ground, NTU is all biz and engine, and SMU is all econs and biz and stuff.. so the arts students like interested in geog la, lit la etc etc v limited choice..
(3) in addition to paying more attn to arts students, of course TS can seriously raise the issue to MOE regarding this much much flame war-ed more-jc-den-poly-students point, though the MOE @ss-hol3s will give you no more information than what you have read here from our proposition and opposition, desperately saying they are increasing the number of poly students who can get in. Just to point out to Eikei, that one of the simplest things to do in life is for the govt to smoke the people with numbers. Stats are PURE PURE bs.. I guarantee you that.. and links and quotes are crap too, don't believe me? click here, http://home.insight.rr.com/crispco/crap/crap.jpg
(4) Last but not least why not raise the issue of our loss of local talents? all the foreign influx of students from Malaysia, Indonesia, CHINA, ROBBING the place of our loved friends, be they poly or JC, of a place in uni.. i know, of course, that foreign talents serve an important role in creating jobs for our people blah blah blah, but the bottomline remains that every year only got 4000 slots for entry, and increase in number of foreign students means less locals.. how i know 4000? click here http://home.insight.rr.com/crispco/crap/crap.jpg of course i don't, it's just an example. seriously.. the presence of a 4th uni will do so so so much in retaining Singaporean students here.. so many times I've heard Singaporean students not having a place in uni here, have to go overseas.. so chee cham.. not say A'lvl student easier to go in uni means 100% go in.. (a small and gentle reminder to Rock^Star) and of course the relatively higher number of poly students who have to go overseas(a small and gentle reminder to Ashearo too).
well i think thats what i have to offer for TS.
As for rock^star, lets have a simple assumption. say MOE agrees with you. ok steady la.. must be fair.. 50% of uni students must be poly, 50% JC.. in that case, nobody is going to go jc le what.. alvl+degree confirm less money than dip+degree.. but you know what, I agree with you that MOE cock up.. let jc people go uni easier. there is no denial in that. but why this happens is the exact reason that ashearo has been saying, that alvl cert sux.. cannot go out work.. when MOE developed the curriculum for alvl, they purposely want put water let alvl students go in easier liao.. then people like rock^star finds it unjustified and points it out, than govt let more poly ppl go in.. Unless you want a MAJOR revamp, wipe out the entire JC system, burn down all 16,17 JCs(then no more pretty girls in uniform), OR you want close all polys,(which will mean no pretty girls wearing mini skirts), the only PATHETIC solution to keeping both jc and poly is to maintain the way it is now, keeping the entry rate higher for JC than for poly, that way we can have the bloody nerds doing all the thinking, and the more project based and more hands-on power people doing the dirty work.

Rock^Star SG

Purpledragon, nice inputs. Very Happy

The key word is "merit". Entrance should be based on that. Allowing JC students the easier path of entry simply because their A level certs are worthless justifies nothing.

Those A level students who fail to make it to uni can then choose poly as an alternative.

Burning down of JCs may sound a tad too drastic but I get your point. Both systems should be kept as they allow students a choice of curriculum and culture. After all, one needs Science subjects to go on to be doctors and arts, to be lawyers etc.

As to relgn, I regret that you have seen our inputs as "nothing to the topic". However, in retrospect, one can expect this university to be up there with likes of NUS, NTU and SMU. Anything less would reflect the failure of this govt. Expect tie ups with foreign universities to quickly raise its regional reputation.

My $0.02 worth Very Happy

purpledragon84 SG

totally agree with rock^star that merit is the most impt thing.. and moe choosing to let more jc students go in is just using a wrong solution to cover up the wrong decision in the past, which was to set up the curriculum of JCs in such a way.. but now that the wrong has been done, the way with the least damage and cost, but sadly still not justifiable, is to let more of JC ppl go in and blindly hope that the better poly students can secure a place for themselves..

relgn SG

purpledragon84, thanks for your spendid input. i will keep in mind the suggestion u gave and raise it up to the moe.

keep the good comment coming in.

relgn SG

bumpz!!!!

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