TNI-AU interception of USN F/A-18C 2003

last SG · 2005-10-07T18:38:48+00:00

Btw that is public domain even though not officially acknowledged by the RSAF. Try looking for Acrobat Reader documents regarding arms transfers to Singapore...

SMAPLionHeart SG

they need 44 jet fighters to cover their land.

4 advanced jet fighters are too little and too loosely spread around to guarentee a effective reaction timely during an emergency.

SMAPLionHeart SG

China is a larger threat.
Indonesia can't manufacture fighter planes .
China can.

Mr. Green

insouciant SG

You might want to check how much the A/B actually weighs versus the C/D. Just bcuz u have a slight more powerful engine, doesn't mean ur thrust to weight ration is better. Also with maneuvering, you still need to consider airflow, etc.

Believe someone mentioned about the J79s. Altho we initially ordered the F16/79, we actually got them in the usual F100 engine instead.

Also, I wasn't talking about RSAF jets. Just F16s in general.

Lastly, no one actually implemented the Falcon One program that was developed by ST Aerospace.

Shotgun SG

I'd agree the A/B birds were lighter than their C/D cousins. They packed lesser avionics and equipment.

If i'm not mistaken A/B models weren't very proficient with air to ground work. Hence their payload would be generally lighter.

coolant SG

How about TNI's New toys?

Su-30MKK?

insouciant SG

Depends how well they are equipped and how well their pilots are trained. Not to mention radar coverage.

DE OPPRESSO LIBER SG

Re: US, Indonesian fighters in tense encounter

This incident wasn't about F-16 vs F-18. It's about the audacity of one country to send it's fully armed warships and warplanes through the sovereign territory of another without permission.

The Americans shouldn't assume that having applied for permission automatically meant it'll be granted.
No reply, no matter how long you waited means NO PERMISSION.
Stand off till permission is given or go around. The American's total lack of consideration for the sovereignty of other nations is one of the reasons for their lack of popularity overseas and sometimes within their own nation. Their foreign policies are in crisis because of their "Thou is mightier" attitude, even towards friends and allies.

Even if all the Indoneisian F-16s are shot down by just one USN F-18.
The BIG LOSER is still the USA.
Case of winning the battle, losing the war.

ORCA
DE OPPRESSO LIBER

I WILL ALWAYS PLACE THE MISSION FIRST.
I WILL NEVER ACCEPT DEFEAT.
I WILL NEVER QUIT.
I WILL NEVER LEAVE A FALLEN COMRADE.

38 SG

Originally posted by DE OPPRESSO LIBER:
[...
Even if all the Indoneisian F-16s are shot down by just one USN F-18.
[b]The BIG LOSER is still the USA.
Case of winning the battle, losing the war ...[/b]

Buddy, Dont use the blood to change peoples tear, right? Wink
Must use blood to change blood. Twisted Evil
Iraq is such a perfect case, You win the battle, you also win the war.
Mr. Green

SBS1908B SG

True true and true. But can’t Indon share a little of the blame for being slow in giving permission?

Shotgun SG

I remember an incident that resulted in the death of a British Aviator. Malaysian Authorities were slow in authorizing an RSAF SAR team to pass thru their airspace to rescued the brit. I believe the RSAF SAR team decided to bypass their airspace instead of waiting for the delayed authorisation.

SMAPLionHeart SG

Come to think of it , if USA were really aggressive , i don't think Indonesia stands a chance against them.

Most indonesian warships are using anti-aircraft guns

SMAPLionHeart SG

Except for a few which has Exocet Block 1

Laughing

SMAPLionHeart SG

Exocet

Contractor Aerospatiale
Entered Service 1977
Total length 580 cm
Diameter 34.8 cm
Wingspan 113.5 cm
Weight 855 kg
Warhead impact with delay- and proximity-fuzed
high-explosive shaped charge, 165 kg
Propulsion : Condor solid propellant booster, 2 s burn;
Helios solid propellant sustainer, 150 s burn
Maximum Speed Mach 0.93
Maximum effective range 65 km
Guidance mode ESD ADAC X-band monopulse active radar homing
Single-shot hit probability
Service France, Pakistan, Abu Dhabi, Argentina, Singapore, Brazil, Oman, Egypt, Iraq, Kuwait, Libya, Qatar, Peru.

But wiki claimed that..

France, Germany, Greece, Pakistan, Abu Dhabi, Argentina, Malaysia, South Africa, Brazil, Oman, Egypt, Iraq, Kuwait, Libya, Qatar, Chile, Indonesia and Peru.

38 SG

Laughing

SMAPLionHeart SG

4 aircraft niah.

Even if 4 aircraft all win , they got 1 aircraft carrier with them leh.
and if a foxtrot did occur , i think USN fleet in CNB will also make moves

Twisted Evil

38 SG

Remeber what I've said?

At least they can change sth worthy, not blood only changes tear Laughing

Even their 4 Su30Mk/Su27SK are all down, at least they will not be down without any F18 accompanies, of course only if the skill of the Su30 pilot really sucks.

SpecOps87 SG

Serious? Singapore also got Exocet mehz? Dun recall seeing them at all during any Army,Navy nor Air Force open house. Of Course the Army won't be using Exocets,but i dun recall seeing them with the Air Force nor with the Navy

DE OPPRESSO LIBER SG

Bear in mind that not everyone is as efficient as you wish them to be. Remember your holidays overseas and you'll complain about this or that countries' inefficiencies? And yes, the US too. Sometimes they can be ridiculously inefficient.

In this case, the HQ of the small CBG (Carrier Battle Group), possibly PACOM would ve informed the US military attache, stationed in US Embassy, Jakarta about the CBG's movement. I believe it's the military attache's job to put the request to the Indonesian authorities. And his job to follow up if permission is not granted.

Apparently, he failed in his duties. He failed to get a reply from the Indonesians in time. He failed to notify the CBG Commander that permission was not forthcoming. Or if he did, then the Naval Commander of the small CBG acted in defiance of USN Standing Orders which forbids USN ships to sail into the territorial waters of another nation without the invitation or permission from that country. Except when the US is at war with that nation or when the ship is in distress.

Like i said, even if all F-16s are shot down, US still lose. They're in the wrong and even her friends and allies will find it difficult not to condemn her actions. What more her enemies? The incident will only give "ammo" to her enemies, both overseas and at home.

And now that the Indonesians and others too know that USN ships will sail thru even without permission, imagine this scenario. A rogue nation withholds permission for a similar CBG to sail thru. CBG continue irregardless. Rogue nation sends up 2 aging F-5Es or MIG-21s to investigate. CBG escorting F-18s intercept. F-5Es ignore IFF. F-18 fires. F-5Es pilots ejected to be picked up by SAR later.

Rogue nation's losses? 2 aging fighters and minor injuries to 2 pilots and some fuel. Cheap price to pay to humilate the US internationally and im sure there're more than a handful of organisations that would love to humilate the US.

US losses? Zero military hardware but faces international condemnation and possibly hostilities at home. Bad publicity the US can ill afford. Especially in the current world situation.

This is just my personal opinion. I've no access to classified information with regards to the said incident.

ORCA
DE OPPRESSO LIBER

I WILL ALWAYS PLACE THE MISSION FIRST.
I WILL NEVER ACCEPT DEFEAT.
I WILL NEVER QUIT.
I WILL NEVER LEAVE A FALLEN COMRADE.

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